High School DxD Universe Discussion Thread

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Qliphoth Bacikal/Sandbox5

vsbattles.fandom.com

Here's another sandbox I did for those of the Ultimate Class and Heavenly Dragon Class.

Just realized and looked at Total's posts for the scaling in=between it and it's not really a whole lot. There's also the Maou's part I could have added but I'm not much of a calc guy, where we could maybe add Sona's earlier statement about her sis Sera being able to "destroy Japan several times over". Maybe that can help to have a floor where Super Devils like Sir, Ajuk, and Rize can scale up from at min?

Also, I just realized that Issei having so many attacks just make things "disappear" was a thing since Vol 5, and he did that with no Doubling added...htf are we now addressing this shit is beyond me xD

I just realized that I took DxD from the Island level to the Multi-Continent level based on pure Powerscaling and multipliers, now I know how whoever made the Dragon Ball Power Scaling felt.

Probably helps that Ishibumi was into Dragon Ball when he first made DxD. From the references of the series to the BxB and up + Boosted Gear being like Kaioken but on crack helps owo

Plus OPPAI.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Here's another sandbox I did for those of the Ultimate Class and Heavenly Dragon Class.

Can you make the one for the abilities and resistances?

I think we should start the series of CRTs with the abilities thread, then maybe move on to the middle-class scaling. Following that, a thread for High-class and Ultimate-class, etc.

Not sure when the updated cosmology thread and @MasqueTLDF Boost thread will be made. I’m assuming no one has anything extra to comment on the cosmology sandbox.

For now, we can start with abilities and lower tiers, then proceed with the higher tiers, etc.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Can you make the one for the abilities and resistances?

I think we should start the series of CRTs with the abilities thread, then maybe move on to the middle-class scaling. Following that, a thread for High-class and Ultimate-class, etc.

Not sure when the updated cosmology thread and @MasqueTLDF Boost thread will be made. I’m assuming no one has anything extra to comment on the cosmology sandbox.

For now, we can start with abilities and lower tiers, then proceed with the higher tiers, etc.

The one TotalMaster made on the Physiology Page CRT? Sure.

There's also the stuff that will be useful for layering hax and hax resistance that will need its own section and be evaluated on to the Hax Layer Thread.

I really got nothing else on that one. I'd rather we focus on the lower tiers and abilities, then up to high to top tiers. And if new/updated calculations for feats not yet been made/need to be remade is needed, that can also be discussed too.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

The one TotalMaster made on the Physiology Page CRT? Sure.

Yeah, and the others suggested in the earlier pages. Will have to go back and find some of those.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

I still know exactly what the power of Telos Karma is,
is Probability Manipulation and/or Causality Manipulation and/or Fate Manipulation and/Plot Manipulation?

Forgot to answer this one.

As Telos Karma hasn't properly reached BxB by itself (Though I guess you could sy it has in a sort of pseudo fashion through Transcendent Arrival), we only got the description for what it can do:

It's said to be able to "create choices that aren't possible forcibly", which fits in-line well with what Probability Manipulation does. (V25, L2)

Ouryuu mentions about how Telos Karma can do something that causes some sort of domino effect to make another effect happen or something. (ex. Having a Beezlebub game have a failure accident that then affects Xenovia or something like that. (Ditto)

This parts feels like it's Probability Manip, but then we have the part in V25 New Dark where Mitsuya used Innovate and Telos TA power to force Balance Breaker state on the both of them and used Telos side to make an attack "not hit him". Maybe that's for Causality Manipulation but idk. Either that, or it's just an even higher degree of probability manip.

Telos Karma was mentioned to have "taken part" in some events in history made in places like Japan and Europe, with it gaining the moniker "History Breaker". It's also said to be able to pretty much control fate while within the world made by Innovate so I guess altogether in a way that makes it have Fate Manipulation, and I don't see enough of it to think Plot Manipulation is even warranted to think.

To TL;DR this, here's what we know of TK and what it can do including its usage with Innovate Clear:

• It can forcibly make choices that aren't normally possible occur (V25L2)
• If a rock was used to be thrown at someone, various possibilities are made. Telos Karma's power to forcible make things that are impossible occur means it will do something that leads to a possibility of the person (Xenovia, in this case) in question in spite of the possibilities that can happen where she otherwise would have either smack it aside, block it, parry, or even evade it. (Ditto)
• It's thought up as being able to "turn a possibility of a phenomenon into an unexpected outcome", and is then added after as having taken part in several instances in shaping the history of the world in places like Japan and Europe, gaining the name "History Breaker" (Ditto again).
• With Innovate (through Transcendent Arrival), Mitsuya can do things like make an attack that would have him to not occur simply by "choosing the option to 'not get hit'".(V25, New Dark)
• With Inno and TA (again), Mitsuya can make something like a weapon go from being in good condition for use to one where it's not in "good condition", making the weapon brittle or weak to the point its blade or such falls off (Ditto)
• Ditto again, it pretty much is said to control fate while within Innovate. (Ditto to V25L2)

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Yeah, and the others suggested in the earlier pages. Will have to go back and find some of those.

Oh yeah, I remember you also brought up some stuff for things specific to certain chars.

Those will have to be noted down too for another CRT to put, ye.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Qliphoth Bacikal/Sandbox7

vsbattles.fandom.com

Here's another one for abilities and resistances.

Only listed the stuff based on Total's stuff from the CRT.

The other stuff on this page I didn't go through, although there probably won't be a whole lot as some of them were resistances I've put up on the physiology pages when I made them.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Probability Manipulation for Telos Karma is set in stone, possibly Causality Manipulation for affecting historical events.

Fate Manipulation with Transcendental Arrival. It’s possible it has other applications we haven’t seen yet.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Bruh, I haven't been getting notis
Edit: I'll continue the Sacred Gear and Boost blogs later today, sorry for taking so long, I've just been a bit busy irl.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Qliphoth Bacikal/Sandbox7

vsbattles.fandom.com

Started adding a few abilities for now. @MasqueTLDF, you can also add the new suggestions you added for Issei in your sandbox.

Edit: I tried to list the abilities with bullet points as it seems that’s the format for ‘modern’ profiles.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Also, I said this before but Issei awakened the aura of a god with True Dragon Deification… so this means Issei, Ophis, and Great Red should get whatever’s being suggested for the gods.

Trihexa was also called a Divine Beast once…but who knows, never confirmed to have divinity aside from that.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

A few questions, regarding the Maou, how many generations were there? Has the strength of the original been retconned (That one V12 statement makes it pretty inconsistent)? What class is base Azazel in terms of strength (He's actually called god class at one point) How do we interpret this SLASHDØG statement “—This country will probably be plunged deep into darkness in a flash. That’s how powerful those youkai are rumored to be. Hence, they are sealed on this soil, the Five Principal Clan’s storage.”?

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Probability Manipulation for Telos Karma is set in stone, possibly Causality Manipulation for affecting historical events.

Fate Manipulation with Transcendental Arrival. It’s possible it has other applications we haven’t seen yet.

This works just fine with me.

If TA is just placing a pseudo BxB state on Telos and Innovate, then it should do what any BxB does which is potentially granting/unlocking/accessing new abilities you normally wouldn't access in your SG's base state...I think?

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Sidenote, I realized that even when Total used pure powerscaling and multipliers for DxD's power hierarchy (sans Boosted Gear, which is TC but on crack and with a boatload of problems of its own just cuz), the latest highest they got which was with AxA being held back is Small Planet level.

Assuming that's even legit on its own, it fairly fits well with how AxA's greatest power potential is planet busting.

Add that it was Great Red's power that allows Issei's AxA to access such power, and you easily have one of DxD's God Tiers to easily be planet busting+ (the + cuz of however we tier Trihexa for ruining the various mythos and afterlife realms as well as the potential damage their fight could cause with GR). Same for Ophis in her prime/pre nerf state as she and GR were stated by Ishibumi to be a match for 666.

The Evies, I don't have to really say much given how crazy those are.

Now if Boosted Gear multipliers were even considered to the equation, and being that it's Twice Critical (2x) but able to do more doubles indefinitely (or until the user reaches their limit), the power ladder would go even way higher there.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Now if Boosted Gear multipliers were even considered to the equation, and being that it's Twice Critical (2x) but able to do more doubles indefinitely (or until the user reaches their limit), the power ladder would go even way higher there.

I don't see any reason why staff would disagree, it's not like there are many antifeats or inconsistencies.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

I don't see any reason why staff would disagree, it's not like there are many antifeats or inconsistencies.

Just hope it goes well then.

The thing about BG being involved is some of those feats Issei has done, if not most, were from after boosting himself.

Although I kinda assume he does more so he can give more BIGGATONS to wreck his enemies in battle with.

Which if you think about it, it's pretty overkill af.

Dude was capable of vaping a mountain with a single aura shot w/o needing to boost once in Vol 5, and that can get you to island level on its own with even the smallest assumed mountain.

And from there, it just escalates further and further lol.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

A few questions, regarding the Maou, how many generations were there? Has the strength of the original been retconned (That one V12 statement makes it pretty inconsistent)? What class is base Azazel in terms of strength (He's actually called god class at one point) How do we interpret this SLASHDØG statement “—This country will probably be plunged deep into darkness in a flash. That’s how powerful those youkai are rumored to be. Hence, they are sealed on this soil, the Five Principal Clan’s storage.”?

A bit vague. Would be nice if there’s raws, or let me check the Portuguese translation site.

Add that it was Great Red's power that allows Issei's AxA to access such power, and you easily have one of DxD's God Tiers to easily be planet busting+ (the + cuz of however we tier Trihexa for ruining the various mythos and afterlife realms as well as the potential damage their fight could cause with GR). Same for Ophis in her prime/pre nerf state as she and GR were stated by Ishibumi to be a match for 666.

Not sure how to rank the Great Red vs Trihexa statements, although the God Tiers may end up scaling to the cosmology depending on how things go.

But let us finish with the abilities and lower tiers and slowly work up to the God Tiers. I will try to add more abilities soon. Staff will decide with the cosmology scaling and Boost multipliers.

Speaking of which, I’d say we should handle the Boost multipliers last.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

I put the general resistance to soul damage but I don’t know if someone can word it better.

Something else is, should Great Red also get a resistance to the Abyss since both Issei and nerfed Ophis resisted it? Issei especially since he was using Great Red’s power. Finally, also Trihexa since only the Isolation Barrier Field can temporarily contain it. That means the Abyss would be useless.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Not sure how to rank the Great Red vs Trihexa statements, although the God Tiers may end up scaling to the cosmology depending on how things go.

True. If not, we'll have to simply upscale them + Prime Ophis to AxA's (current) potential to planet bust.

 

[Digital_Franz]

Something else is, should Great Red also get a resistance to the Abyss since both Issei and nerfed Ophis resisted it? Issei especially since he was using Great Red’s power. Finally, also Trihexa since only the Isolation Barrier Field can temporarily contain it. That means the Abyss would be useless.

Yes, that should be the case.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Progress : P

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Qliphoth Bacikal/Sandbox7

vsbattles.fandom.com

Started adding a few abilities for now. @MasqueTLDF, you can also add the new suggestions you added for Issei in your sandbox.

Edit: I tried to list the abilities with bullet points as it seems that’s the format for ‘modern’ profiles.

I’ll add Great Red and Trihexa. Not sure what else to add aside from that. Most of my suggestions were for the physiology pages and general abilities.

But going forwards, we should try to update the profiles in this format.

Perhaps when scans are eventually added to the profiles, which would take a bit long. That’s why I say we should go ahead with the revisions and implement the scans later (since most [?] of the profiles references already).

 

[TotalMasterInfinity]

Lists
-Sacred Gear
Absorption Line, Blaze Black Flare, Delete Field, Shadow Prison, Forbidden Balor View, Aegis Mineralization, Blade Blacksmith, Dreamlike Curse, Flame Shake, Freezing Archaeopteryx, Griffon, Byakusa, Pokkun, Blizt, Gravity Jail, Holy Resuscitation, Mirror Alice, Night Reflection, Staring Blue, Staring Green, Sturdy Saint, Sword Birth, Strategy Trap, Trick Vanish, Twice Critical, Twilight Healing, Variant Detonation, Brine Shine Statue, nameless teddy bear, nameless curse mouths

-Longinus
Absolute Demise, Aeon Balor, Alphecca Tyrant, Annihilation Maker
Boosted Gear, Canis Lykaon, Dimension Lost, Divine Dividing, Incinerate Anthem, Innovate Clear, Nereid Kyrie, Regulus Nemea, Sephiroth Graal, Star Buster Star Blaster, True Longinus, Telos Karma, Zenith Tempest, Unknown Dictator

-Extra Longinus
Eden's Dual

-Artificial Sacred Gear
Applause Wall, Blazer Shining Aura Darkness Blade, Down Fall Dragon Spear, Procellarum Phantom, Scouting Persona, Twinkle Aegis, Nameless Typhoon Dagger, Disaster of Burning or Freeze Pot, Blazer Shining or Darkness Samurai Sword, Blazer Shining or Darkness Samurai Sword- Kitchen Knife Form, Blazer Shining or Darkness Samurai Sword-Third Stage

-Satanic Arms
Malebranche

-Quasi-Divine Weaponry
Ragnarok Æsir Berserk

-Artificial Longinus
Gigantis Maiden Robe, Boosted Gear Diabolos

Pseudo Balance Breaker
Down Fall Dragon Another Armor

Balance Breaker Incomplete
Welsh Dragon Over Booster, Si-Xiong HúnDùn Over Booster, Eden's Dual Limited Balance Break

-Crest Side
True Longinus Götterdämmerung, Polar Night Longinus Chakravartin, Flagello di Colori del Arcobaleno, Speranza di Briscola, Bandersnatch and Jabberwocky, Dimension Create, Boosted Gear Scale Mail, Divine Dividing Scale Mail, Regulus Rey Leather Rex, Night Celestial Slash Dogs, Incinerate Antiphona Calvario, Lovely Heavenly Angels, Assoluto Argento Mondo, Twilight Saint Affection, Blade Knight Mass, Stake Victim Dragoon, Glory Drag Trooper, Chaos Edge Asura Ravage, Detonation Mighty Comet, Night Reflection Death Cross, Nostalgia Mad Tea Party, Fourteen Holy Salvation, Sturdy Saint Withstand, Paraselene Utopia, Caput Medusa and Mineralization Knight

-Abyss Side
Perfectus Tenebrae Lykaon et Fortis Densus Laelaps, Empiero Juggernaut Overdrive, Abyss Side of the Hero Faction

-X Side
Sword of Betrayer

-Abyss Side and X Side
Forbidden Invade Balor the Beast, Malebolge Vritra Promotion, Illegal Move Triaina, Cardinal Crimson Promotion, Diabolos Dragon God, Diabolos Dragon Lucifer

-Counter Balance
Disaster Typhoon Beast Another Armor, Hyper Proceralum Phantom Gigante Blessed Scale Mail, Scarlet The Extinction Blade, nameless samurai armor

-Juggernaut Drive/Breakdown The Beast, etc
Booster Gear: Juggernaut Drive, Divine Dividing: Juggernaut Drive, Regulus Rey Leather Rex: Imperial Purple Hajūshiki, Truth Idea, Sword of Supremacy

Others
Vritra Promotion, Chaos Drive, Transcendental Arrival

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Brine Shine Statue, nameless teddy bear, nameless curse mouths

Could you share what volumes these are from?

-Artificial Sacred Gear
Disaster of Burning or Freeze Pot, Blazer Shining or Darkness Samurai Sword-Third Stage

When were these mentioned?

-Crest Side
True Longinus Götterdämmerung, Polar Night Longinus Chakravartin, Flagello di Colori del Arcobaleno, Speranza di Briscola, Bandersnatch and Jabberwocky, Dimension Create, Boosted Gear Scale Mail, Divine Dividing Scale Mail, Regulus Rey Leather Rex, Night Celestial Slash Dogs, Incinerate Antiphona Calvario, Lovely Heavenly Angels, Assoluto Argento Mondo, Twilight Saint Affection, Blade Knight Mass, Stake Victim Dragoon, Glory Drag Trooper, Chaos Edge Asura Ravage, Detonation Mighty Comet, Night Reflection Death Cross, Nostalgia Mad Tea Party, Fourteen Holy Salvation, Sturdy Saint Withstand, Paraselene Utopia, Caput Medusa and Mineralization Knight

-Abyss Side
Perfectus Tenebrae Lykaon et Fortis Densus Laelaps, Empiero Juggernaut Overdrive

-X Side
Sword of Betrayer

-Abyss Side and X Side
Forbidden Invade Balor the Beast, Malebolge Vritra Promotion, Illegal Move Triaina, Cardinal Crimson Promotion, Diabolos Dragon God, Diabolos Dragon Lucifer

A lot of these placements are wrong ngl.

-Counter Balance
nameless samurai armor

When was this mentioned?

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Don’t tell me we are going to get into another argument on the Sacred Gear classifications…

Could you share what volumes these are from?

Slash Dog.

Abyss Team

Abyss Team (アビス・チーム, Abisu Chīmu), also known as both Nephilim Abyss and Those who Fell into the Abyss, is an organization composed of individuals with ferocious Sacred Gears. The founder and current leader of the Abyss Team is a former Cadre named Satanael. After Satanael betrayed the Grigori...

slashdog.fandom.com

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Don’t tell me we are going to get into another argument on the Sacred Gear classifications…

I won't, just stating an opinion.

Slash Dog.

Abyss Team

Abyss Team (アビス・チーム, Abisu Chīmu), also known as both Nephilim Abyss and Those who Fell into the Abyss, is an organization composed of individuals with ferocious Sacred Gears. The founder and current leader of the Abyss Team is a former Cadre named Satanael. After Satanael betrayed the Grigori...

slashdog.fandom.com

Thanks.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

So many SG types...

I think not a whole lot of fanfic writers even now about this, and I can sorta understand why with how many types they can fall under.

Plus they're the kind to always go for something like BG/DD where it has some Dragon ish entity that's OP af and never for something less.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Plus they're the kind to always go for something like BG/DD where it has some Dragon ish entity that's OP af and never for something less.

Yeah, especially the typical power fantasy stuff. Gamer ficus often use Innovate Clear or Telos Karma since their abilities were revealed.

 

[BlackeJan]

Imma be real but I don’t like Rias at all. Idc what yall think, but wanting someone to die so u could revive them to be on your team just cause u are in trouble instead of explaining and asking is a bitch move

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Imma be real but I don’t like Rias at all. Idc what yall think, but wanting someone to die so u could revive them to be on your team just cause u are in trouble instead of explaining and asking is a bitch move

Rias never wanted anyone in her peerage to die.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Yeah, especially the typical power fantasy stuff. Gamer ficus often use Innovate Clear or Telos Karma since their abilities were revealed.

I've heard of those manwha's before that does that like Solo Leveling, but never ever got into it.

Them using Lonnginus that came in so late and we still dk their full potential is...meh.

One thing I will also say is with how Innovate Clear is more or less a composite of Dimension Lost and Annihilation Maker's base abilities, I kinda had this thought that some of the Longinus are just lazily written up and put there just for the sake of making "13 Longinus", especially with having Telos as the "13th and Bad Numbered Longinus" or whatever it was they called TK as.

Maybe it's just solely me but I definitely had this idea for a fanfic I tried to make for IC where it's literally the fusion of DL and AM. Nevere got too far into it on how I would be able to fuse two abilities nor I guess it wouldn't much sense, but fanfics are fanfics + that probably isn't the most outlandish idea that could have been made for DxD. Shit, even a friend of mine whose into DxD thought the same idea.

Really, IC kinda seems lazy to me on paper if you look at it. It may not have ALL of DL and AM's abilities, it's still just a composite of it if you look at all of its known descriptions.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

I've heard of those manwha's before that does that like Solo Leveling, but never ever got into it.

Them using Lonnginus that came in so late and we still dk their full potential is...meh.

One thing I will also say is with how Innovate Clear is more or less a composite of Dimension Lost and Annihilation Maker's base abilities, I kinda had this thought that some of the Longinus are just lazily written up and put there just for the sake of making "13 Longinus", especially with having Telos as the "13th and Bad Numbered Longinus" or whatever it was they called TK as.

Maybe it's just solely me but I definitely had this idea for a fanfic I tried to make for IC where it's literally the fusion of DL and AM. Nevere got too far into it on how I would be able to fuse two abilities nor I guess it wouldn't much sense, but fanfics are fanfics + that probably isn't the most outlandish idea that could have been made for DxD. Shit, even a friend of mine whose into DxD thought the same idea.

Really, IC kinda seems lazy to me on paper if you look at it. It may not have ALL of DL and AM's abilities, it's still just a composite of it if you look at all of its known descriptions.

Speaking of, at one point, it's stated that all Longinus are combinations of two Sacred Gears.

“Boosted Gear combines together both the nearly endless doubling ability and the transfer ability. There exist independent Sacred Gears with either of these respective powers, the doubling Sacred Gear and the transfer Sacred Gear. All the Longinus are just a combination of one ability with another. Essentially, they combine powerful abilities that aren’t supposed to be combined. ‘Maybe the Longinus are born because of a kind of bug or errors in the Sacred Gear program constructed by God’, that’s one of the opinions of us in Grigori. If I had to say it in an easy-to-understand way to you, it’s a fact that there are other powers that can transfer.” Volume 4: Azazel

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Speaking of, at one point, it's stated that all Longinus are combinations of two Sacred Gears.

Yah, that’s probably retconned. Funny enough, there’s an unnamed Sacred Gear in Slash Dog that has the basic ability of Dimension Lost.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Imma be real but I don’t like Rias at all. Idc what yall think, but wanting someone to die so u could revive them to be on your team just cause u are in trouble instead of explaining and asking is a bitch move

It’s fanon, partially caused by the anime. Most Rias haters are working off of a misunderstanding lol.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Yah, that’s probably retconned. Funny enough, there’s an unnamed Sacred Gear in Slash Dog that has the basic ability of Dimension Lost.

I haven't read SD in a long while but really? Is it SD 2?
Edit: Dimension Lost's base state does possess the ability to "reinforce dimensions" as well unlike the other SG.
"It was at that moment. The space that was starting to go away was enveloped by mist. The blurry scenery then went back to normal, as if this space was reinforced by the mist. I was familiar with this mist! —At the same time, I could hear a voice." Shin 3

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

It’s fanon, partially caused by the anime. Most Rias haters are working off of a misunderstanding lol.

What exactly happened?

 

[MasqueTLDF]

It’s fanon, partially caused by the anime. Most Rias haters are working off of a misunderstanding lol.

Even in the anime, there was nothing Rias could do. Devils can only have personal interactions with Humans if they're summoned, if she interfered with Raynare and the others, it could've started a war, and there wasn't really reason for her to stop it anyway. Stopping every single death is kinda foolish, why would she prioritize the life of one random boy over the lives of every other human?

 

[MasqueTLDF]

What exactly happened?

In the LN, she only came to know of the situation as she was summoned by Issei, in the anime, she knew a few hours prior but had no reason to stop it FRA.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

So basically the Anime caused a little bit of an oopsie?

 

[MasqueTLDF]

So basically the Anime caused a little bit of an oopsie?

Not really although it is different than the manga and Source Material