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General DC Comics Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Confluctor
- Start date
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- Tags
- dc comics
- 539
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Composite Presence is the strongest character in DC comics.
Even the concept of Brahman, buddha and other religion supreme gods are a small aspect of The Divine presence.
The Presence in vertigo only rules over a single creation. Some people existed before the presence.
So it's better to ignore and treat vertigo characters as seperate without scaling them to the DC Multiverse similar to unwritten storylines
Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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I personally disagree with this but I respect your opinion.
- 12,459
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bro look at the revision blog (vertigo)
Presence created infinite timelines (2A)
Heaven is beyond that making it Low 1-C (5D)
The mansion of silence is beyond heaven and houses thousands of creations making it Low 1-C (6D)
The void is beyond everything else
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Just existing beyond is not a qualitative superiority.
- 12,459
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im too lazy to add detail mb
but you can check the revision blog which has the same stuff as what i said but with more detail
Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
- 1,524
Checked it and there's not much. The reasoning for Heaven being Low 1-C is that Heaven "transcends" creation but "transcending" isn't a qualitative superiority. That's explicitly stated in the FAQ, and the other descriptions do not indicate the existence of any QS.
The Mansions of Silence's justification is that it is far beyond Heaven, which would only grant it Heaven's tier at best but Heaven itself doesn't have a qualitative superiority as seen above.
Only the Void has an actual qualitative superiority. But even then, it's due to viewing creation as infinitesimal and not due to some R>f or anything.
- 12,459
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heaven transcends creation, looks down upon it and views it as sprinkles or smth which is QS
it does as explained above
yeah
Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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Viewing it as sprinkles would be Low 1-C but do you have a scan?
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Can I get eyes on this?
- 12,459
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its in the revision blog and the scan says something like, "creation is spangled" in heaven
or smth
- 12,459
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Scan said "seemed". So it's not literal. It's just how Archangels view it. And why is viewing something as sprinkles Low-1C? Sprinkles aren't even infinitely smaller.found it
- 12,459
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....non sequitr? the word 'seemed' has nothing to do with it not being literal. the archangels are in the silver city, thats why 2-A creation looks blurred and spangled because silver city is so much bigger
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Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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Scan just says creation seemed spangled. Two issues with this-found it
1: It just means creation appeared to be covered with spangles, not that creation itself was spangles
2: "Seemed" means it's not necessarily true- https://www.dictionary.com/browse/seem
- 12,459
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im not saying creation itself is spangled. im saying heaven views creation as spangled because heaven is superior to it.
appeal to meaning? the word seemed is being used because heaven quite literally see's it as spangled from their point of view because thats what it looks like from their point of view...
Seem: give the impression of being something or having a particular quality.
Similar:
appear
appear to be
give the impression of being
look
In this context, theyre using the word seemed because it LOOKS like creation is spangled and blurred
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Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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Not qualitatively so. Humans see things as spangled, they aren't qualitatively superior.
I think you mean Appeal to Definition, but with the dictionary, I have established an equal alternate interpretation, so the burden would be on you to prove the word "seemed" is used here as you say.
Deleted member 2530
Guest
How did you even come to the conclusion that "seemed blurred and spangled" means its covered with spangles?
All it means is that the creation looked blurred and spangled. Are we really having an argument regarding semantics?
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This is an awful example you're comparing with and i don't see how it relates to heaven viewing a 2-A creation as spangled at all
explained above
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Exactly. This is simple English and grammar
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That's the point, the importance of "seemed", it's not literally spangled, it just appeared to be.
Deleted member 2530
Guest
Its not a cat, it just appears to be one. Do you even know what "spangled" means? Its those sparkling lights below. Make an actual argument with proof rather than saying its not literal.
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Hitchen's Razor + Refer to my comment against Immortal. Seeing creation as spangled is not a qualitative superiority, why would it even be?
Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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"I know he seems to be a nice man but he's actually a criminal"
Deleted member 2530
Guest
Seeing a 2A structure as a tiny dot is actually superiority.
Deleted member 2530
Guest
We are talking about appearance not their characteristics.
Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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I don't see how any of these correlate with viewing a 2-A structure as spangled. Im talking about literal universes and structures while you're bringing up the most irrelevant analogies such as tigers and humans...
This is ridiculous
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When they used the word 'seemed' they are talking about its appearance. from heaven's point of view, the IMMENSITY of creation seemed spangled. creation is immense but heaven sees it as tiny little sparkles....this is qualitative superiority.
Vondoom
Username Only- 395
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As a blur is good also.
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nothing
The revision blog already proposed that heaven is Low 1-C but transcending disagreed
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Seemed, so it's not literal. It's just how creation looks like from there. And why is that a qualitative superiority?
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Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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Again, Heaven was never stated to view creation as tiny little sparkles. It said creation appeared to be spangled, which just means creation appeared to be sparkling from Heaven. The word "appear" is objectively vague. If it was meant to be literal, "was spangled and blurred" would have been stated instead of "seemed spangled and blurred". Qualitative transcendences require explicit evidences here to count, not vague ones.
Immortal brought up cats, and I presented an analogy. An analogy isn't something that is an exact equal, it's a separate case that has similarities with the original case. My analogies were presented to prove the word "seemed" is vague, and I established that. It's your job now to prove "seemed" in the context was being used literally.
The word "spangled" means "covered with spangles", which doesn't make sense literally. You are changing the wording to "Heaven saw creation as sparkles", which was not what was stated. It didn't even say creation appeared as spangles but instead spangled. There's a key difference.
Creation simply appeared to be glittering to the Archangel.
We don't have to do anything right now since this is not the Tiering thread, but the blog for the split said Heaven was Low 1-C with the reasoning that it was stated to transcend creation, when our FAQ explicitly says statements transcendence is not grounds for any kind of superiority, and much less a qualitative one. So I just disagreed with the blog.
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Yeah thats what i was thinking
@Transcending if you have an issue with the revision blog then explain your issues in the next thread
Transcending
He/Him- 1,998
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Okay, sorry, I will do so next thread.
