• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Anti-Monitor Revision

Elizio33

Elizio33

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
3,032
2,558
Okay let's talk about COIE Anti-Monitor, his power level varied a lot and was inconsistent during the event. He was mostly absorbing energy from the universes he destroyed to become more and more powerful.

Yes, the Anti-Monitor was able to destroy an infinite amount of universes but he did it exclusively with his antimatter wave. The antimatter wave (in general) was so devastating mainly due to the fact that when antimatter comes in contact with positive matter, it wipes it out completely. Furthermore, the Anti-Monitor was damaged multiple times by Earth Heroes and others like his own Thunderer Quardians and Pre Crisis Supergirl (it was a surprise attack).

In his basic power level, if we consider the antimatter wave as one special attack, he was able to beat Pre Crisis Superman pretty easily and fought the Monitor for one million years and killed Pre Crisis Supergirl with a blast of antimatter. As for his durability, The Anti-Monitor's armor after weakened can take hits from both Kal-L of Earth-2 and Superboy Prime. Ultimately it was the Omega Beams from Darkseid that ended him. (Note that the scans for the durability happened before the fight between the Anti-Monitor and the Spectre)

To conclude this:

* Base power level: At least 2-C

* Antimatter wave: 2-A

* After absorbing energy: 2-A

so I propose a new rating for the COIE Anti-Monitor: "At least 2-C, 2-A with the antimatter wave. 2-A after absorbing energy"

Also, we should also create a rebirth key for the Anti-Monitor and the Monitor. I think Low 2-C or 2-C should be fine for their in-multiverse states.
 
Last edited:
Based on the scans here, wouldn’t he be 2-C in base and not 2-B? He’s being scaled to Pre-Crisis Supergirl, Superman, Kal-L and Superboy, who are all 2-Cs.
 
LordTracer said:
Based on the scans here, wouldn’t he be 2-C in base and not 2-B? He’s being scaled to Pre-Crisis Supergirl, Superman, Kal-L and Superboy, who are all 2-Cs.
Click to expand...
Oh! I thought that Pre-Crisis Superman and the others were 2-C. My mistake
 
San-Kakarot said:
He destroyed one universe after one universe, not because of his AP, but because anti-matter cancels positive matter.
Click to expand...
Destroying infinite universes over time still qualify for the 2-A rating.

The Anti-Monitor should be:

At least 2-C, 2-A with the antimatter wave. 2-A after absorbing energy.
 
Last edited:
I agree. At the end of the story when the Starlight Collector was destroying, which was being used to draw universes towards the Antimatter wave, he was forced to build an anti matter cannon to finish off the rest of the universes. The storyline doesn't really make sense without acknowledging that the destruction of the multiverse was a specific byproduct of the Antimatter wave, not something AM could do on his own.
 
How exactly was the Anti-Matter Wave made? I assume it was just one all-out/1 time attack because it left him much weaker in comparison. He was damaged by a weakened Supergirl and his own Shadow Demons. When the Anti-Matter Wave couldn't hit the Netherverse, he couldn't make a similar attack. He needed to build a cannon that draws and concentrates the Anti-Matter Energy.
 
Last edited:
Here are the different phases that the Monitors goes through in COIE:
  • Anti-Matter Wave
  • Base AM with Expanding AM Universe
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #5, August 1985
      • As Antimatter destroys each universe, the Antimatter universe grows more powerful.
      • The Anti-Monitor is aware of Apokolips and how it’s not one of the Infinite Universes. Darkseid would not escape him after he is done with the universes.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #7, October 1985
      • When a positive matter universe is destroyed, the antimatter universe expanded to fill the void. Its power grew and the Anti-Monitor fed on that power.
      • The Anti-Monitor is overpowering Earth 1 Superman in 2 hits, nearly killing him.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #8, November 1985
      • The Anti-Monitor returns with a new outer shell.
      • Desaad diverted all their power to cloak Apokolips
      • The Anti-Monitor builds an Anti-Matter Cannon to obliterate the remaining 5 universes.
      • The Anti-Monitor’s own Shadow Demons can harm him, damaging his armor as well.
      • The Anti-Matter Cannon draws together concentrated Anti-Matter, drawing power from even the Flash.
      • The Anti-Monitor Absorbs the energy of the Antimatter Universe, killing everything there.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #10, January 1986
      • Anti-Monitor had converted the Antimatter of Pariah’s experiment into energy, focused into his universe, destroying worlds to garner even more energy. With that extra power, he broke free from his prison to spread his rule.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #11, February 1986
      • With the rebirth of the universe, many realities have changed. Harbinger and Anti-Monitor got their original power energy back.
  • Post-AM Universe Absorbtion Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #8, November 1985
      • The Anti-Monitor Absorbs the energy of the Antimatter Universe, killing everything there.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #10, January 1986
      • Shadow Demons attacked New Genesis, Gemworld, and Olympus
      • The Empowered Anti-Monitor could get to the Dawn of Time, but Earth 1 Superman couldn’t without help.
      • 50 heroes combined attacks could destroy a solar system, but the anti-Monitor has absorbed the energy of his entire universe.
      • The Anti-Monitor expended his energy just breaching the wall of creation. He needed to absorb the Hero’s life energies to complete his task. His hand would destroy the positive matter universe now and forever.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • The Anti-Monitor absorbs the energy of his reborn Antimatter Universe like before.
      • Darkseid presses a button, and he lets out power through Alexander, striking the Anti-Monitor and throwing him into a binary sun's core.
  • Star Absorption Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • The Anti-Monitor Returns
      • Superman’s most powerful blows don’t make the Anti-Monitor blink. No one is doing any damage.
      • The Anti-Monitor is feeding on a star for power. After Dr. Light starts absorbing the star, he weakens but tries to resist.
      • Negative Woman begins to burn the Anti-Monitor with radiation. All heroes attack, and he begins to fall. Doctor Light unleashes the absorbed energy on the Anti-Monitor, causing his body to explode with light for a moment, his every organ burning through armor and flesh.
  • Weakened Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • A heavily damaged Anti-Monitor seemingly kills Earth 2 Wonder Woman.
      • The Magically changed Shadow Demons that Anti-Monitor absorbed are destroying him from within, but he’s still too strong for Earth 2 Superman.
      • Darkseid says that Earth 2 Superman can’t defeat the weakened Anti-Monitor Alone.
      • A blast hurts Superboy but not kills him. Anti-Monitor is weakening.
  • Remnant Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • Earth 2 Superman destroys the last remnant of Anti-Monitor
  • Weakened Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #2, May 1985
      • Anti-Monitor steals the Monitor’s strength, growing stronger.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #5, August 1985
      • On his death, the Monitor created a Netherverse out of his very being, temporarily absorbing Earth 1 and 2 Universes.
      • In the Netherverse, all time has become one. The vibrations which separate the universes are slowing down. The universes are merging. When they occupy the same space at the same time, they will destroy each other.
      • The Monitor began the process of merging the universes into one.
  • Harbinger
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #6, September 1985
      • Harbinger draws Earths X, 4, and S away from the Antimatter Cloud and through her, adding them to the Netherverse and losing her power.
  • Kryptonians
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #7, October 1985
      • The physical laws in the Antimatter universe are different. X-Ray vision doesn’t work.
      • Earth 2 Superman starts bleeding.
      • The attacks of the stone monsters hurt the Kryptonians, saying Captain Atom has the upper hand.
      • Kryptonians aren’t as powerful and invulnerable in the antimatter universe.
      • An enraged Supergirl breaks the Anti-Monitor’s Armor/Life Shell, waning his energies.
      • Supergirl runs herself and Anti-Monitor through the Solar Collector, presumably gaining power and fighting once more, destroying the rest of his shell.
      • Anti-Monitor fatally wounds Supergirl with a final blast. With his body gone, the Anti-Monitor leaves to heal.
  • Empowered Spectre
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #10, January 1986
      • The Spectre is able to resist the empowered Anti-Monitor after absorbing the power of 8 other heroes. Funneling more and more power causes him pain and damage.
      • The two opposing forces destroy everything at the dawn of time
 
Last edited:
Aren't we still scaling him to Monitor who draws power from infinite positive matter universes due to being linked with it, but lacking the power to shape it? Not sure if this is accurate but it's still currently the case.
 
Elizio33 said:
The antimatter wave (in general) was so devastating mainly due to the fact that when antimatter comes in contact with positive matter, it wipes it out completely.
Click to expand...
I doubt this matters at all since to destroy space-time rather than matter you still need tier 2 energy.
 
Greenshifter said:
Aren't we still scaling him to Monitor who draws power from infinite positive matter universes due to being linked with it, but lacking the power to shape it? Not sure if this is accurate but it's still currently the case.
Click to expand...
I don’t think just drawing power from something is enough to directly scale to it.
 
What tier do you think Rebirth/Scott Snyder Anti-Monitor should have? He's pretty featless but do you think he should scale to his classic version or New 52 versions?
 
Elizio33 said:
What tier do you think Rebirth/Scott Snyder Anti-Monitor should have? He's pretty featless but do you think he should scale to his classic version or New 52 versions?
Click to expand...
Yes, crisis on infinite earths is literally shown in death metal from my knowledge.
 
Elizio33 said:
The same for Darkseid War and yet, New 52 Anti-Monitor didn't scale from his classic appearance.
Click to expand...
Sure, but in this case it's pretty blatent. The Universe began a new when perpetua got sealed from there both the anti monitor and the monitor were reborn as shown in crisis on infinite earths, and this event is pretty important in the event, so I think he scales.
 
I just thought about it, base Anti-Monitor (classic) is superior to Pre Crisis Darkseid who is 2-B right? So, his classic appearance should 2-B
 
Just something i thought rn.

The monitor being empowered by infinite positive matter is a high 3-A and infinite stamina feat.

However, is he "empowered by positive matter from infinite universes" or is he "empowered by infinite positive matter universes"?

The former is high 3-A because infinite matter unless DC's positive matter works differently, but the latter would be 2-A because "positive matter universes" would just be the actual universes, unlike the anti-monitor's "anti-matter universe".

Actually wait, wouldn't it be infinite above baseline low 2-C, since you are supposed to destroy infinite universes at once for 2-A or something, kinda like 4-A requires one blast because distance?
 
@Antvasima

What are your thoughts on the matter?

Firestorm808 said:
Here are the different phases that the Monitors and others go through in COIE:
  • Anti-Matter Wave
  • Base AM with Expanding AM Universe
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #5, August 1985
      • As Antimatter destroys each universe, the Antimatter universe grows more powerful.
      • The Anti-Monitor is aware of Apokolips and how it’s not one of the Infinite Universes. Darkseid would not escape him after he is done with the universes.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #7, October 1985
      • When a positive matter universe is destroyed, the antimatter universe expanded to fill the void. Its power grew and the Anti-Monitor fed on that power.
      • The Anti-Monitor is overpowering Earth 1 Superman in 2 hits, nearly killing him.
      • When a positive matter universe is destroyed, the antimatter universe expanded to fill the void. Its power grew and the Anti-Monitor fed on that power.
      • The Anti-Monitor is overpowering Earth 1 Superman in 2 hits, nearly killing him.
      • An enraged Supergirl breaks the Anti-Monitor’s Armor/Life Shell, waning his energies.
      • Supergirl runs herself and Anti-Monitor through the Solar Collector, presumably gaining power and fighting once more, destroying the rest of his shell.
      • Anti-Monitor fatally wounds Supergirl with a final blast. With his body gone, the Anti-Monitor leaves to heal
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #8, November 1985
      • The Anti-Monitor returns with a new outer shell.
      • Desaad diverted all their power to cloak Apokolips
      • The Anti-Monitor builds an Anti-Matter Cannon to obliterate the remaining 5 universes.
      • The Anti-Monitor’s own Shadow Demons can harm him, damaging his armor as well.
      • The Anti-Matter Cannon draws together concentrated Anti-Matter, drawing power from even the Flash.
      • The Anti-Monitor Absorbs the energy of the Antimatter Universe, killing everything there.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #10, January 1986
      • Anti-Monitor had converted the Antimatter of Pariah’s experiment into energy, focused into his universe, destroying worlds to garner even more energy. With that extra power, he broke free from his prison to spread his rule.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #11, February 1986
      • With the rebirth of the universe, many realities have changed. Harbinger and Anti-Monitor got their original power energy back.
  • Post-AM Universe Absorbtion Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #8, November 1985
      • The Anti-Monitor Absorbs the energy of the Antimatter Universe, killing everything there.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #10, January 1986
      • Shadow Demons attacked New Genesis, Gemworld, and Olympus
      • The Empowered Anti-Monitor could get to the Dawn of Time, but Earth 1 Superman couldn’t without help.
      • 50 heroes combined attacks could destroy a solar system, but the anti-Monitor has absorbed the energy of his entire universe.
      • The Anti-Monitor expended his energy just breaching the wall of creation. He needed to absorb the Hero’s life energies to complete his task. His hand would destroy the positive matter universe now and forever.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • The Anti-Monitor absorbs the energy of his reborn Antimatter Universe like before.
      • Darkseid presses a button, and he lets out power through Alexander, striking the Anti-Monitor and throwing him into a binary sun's core.
  • Star Absorption Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • The Anti-Monitor Returns
      • Superman’s most powerful blows don’t make the Anti-Monitor blink. No one is doing any damage.
      • The Anti-Monitor is feeding on a star for power. After Dr. Light starts absorbing the star, he weakens but tries to resist.
      • Negative Woman begins to burn the Anti-Monitor with radiation. All heroes attack, and he begins to fall. Doctor Light unleashes the absorbed energy on the Anti-Monitor, causing his body to explode with light for a moment, his every organ burning through armor and flesh.
  • Weakened Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • A heavily damaged Anti-Monitor seemingly kills Earth 2 Wonder Woman.
      • The Magically changed Shadow Demons that Anti-Monitor absorbed are destroying him from within, but he’s still too strong for Earth 2 Superman.
      • Darkseid says that Earth 2 Superman can’t defeat the weakened Anti-Monitor Alone.
      • A blast hurts Superboy but not kills him. Anti-Monitor is weakening.
  • Remnant Anti-Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #12, March 1986
      • Earth 2 Superman destroys the last remnant of Anti-Monitor
  • Weakened Monitor
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #2, May 1985
      • Anti-Monitor steals the Monitor’s strength, growing stronger.
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #5, August 1985
      • On his death, the Monitor created a Netherverse out of his very being, temporarily absorbing Earth 1 and 2 Universes.
      • In the Netherverse, all time has become one. The vibrations which separate the universes are slowing down. The universes are merging. When they occupy the same space at the same time, they will destroy each other.
      • The Monitor began the process of merging the universes into one.
  • Harbinger
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #6, September 1985
      • Harbinger draws Earths X, 4, and S away from the Antimatter Cloud and through her, adding them to the Netherverse and losing her power.
  • Kryptonians
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #7, October 1985
      • The physical laws in the Antimatter universe are different. X-Ray vision doesn’t work.
      • Earth 2 Superman starts bleeding.
      • The attacks of the stone monsters hurt the Kryptonians, saying Captain Atom has the upper hand.
      • Kryptonians aren’t as powerful and invulnerable in the antimatter universe.
      • An enraged Supergirl breaks the Anti-Monitor’s Armor/Life Shell, waning his energies.
      • Supergirl runs herself and Anti-Monitor through the Solar Collector, presumably gaining power and fighting once more, destroying the rest of his shell.
      • Anti-Monitor fatally wounds Supergirl with a final blast. With his body gone, the Anti-Monitor leaves to heal.
  • Empowered Spectre
    • Crisis on Infinite Earths Vol 1 #10, January 1986
      • The Spectre is able to resist the empowered Anti-Monitor after absorbing the power of 8 other heroes. Funneling more and more power causes him pain and damage.
      • The two opposing forces destroy everything at the dawn of time
Click to expand...
 
I'll read through the thread in a bit, and come to a conclusion then. At the moment, I don't think COIE AM should be going anywhere under 2-C though, and I believe 2-A should still be fine, but that probably will change after reading the thread.
 
Being empowered by X source =/= Having the AP of the X source max output. Albeit the fact that is infinite positive matter might complicate it

Destroying something that is already infinite overtime... I'm not sure if 2-A tier ovetime should be given, because he could be destroying thousands of universes per second and still be infinitesimal lower than 2-A, and border that he will probably never reach as long as he is doing with a set time.

Idk, I will read the story and see what's up with this anti-matter wave.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

IdiosyncraticLawyer
  • Locked
DC Comics: Acausality revisions
2 3
Replies
84
Views
4K
IdiosyncraticLawyer
IdiosyncraticLawyer
Elizio33
  • Locked
DC Comics - Remove the Anti Matter Wave and Durability Downgrade
2 3
Replies
112
Views
5K
Antvasima
Antvasima
MrVenomYTX
Oni Garmadon VS Anti-Monitor
Replies
38
Views
1K
TheOrangeGuy09
TheOrangeGuy09
Elizio33
  • Locked
SCW and New 52 Anti-Monitor
2 3 4
Replies
158
Views
6K
Antvasima
Antvasima
PrinceStories
Added ability for The Great Darkness
Replies
30
Views
2K
Antvasima
Antvasima
Back
Top