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I jump on the Spamwagon with an old man with a bag and an evil wishgranter.

Welp, steel yourself cause you'll probably have to face Weekly in single combat.
 
Just so we're clear, are the Brothers Death allowed to do anything in this fight other than bring the Old Man back to life? I've lost track of what is/isn't allowed in his matches these days.
 
He can use the prizes from the brothers, and considering BFR which Calypso is going to immediately start with, Immortality won't really be problematic......

I think.

Although The Brothers death may bring him out of where Calypso BFRs him off to so that he can continue serving their plot do destroy the world and such.
 
I meant to say, are they allowed to intervene in any way outside of bringing him back to life?

Also, the title of this thread is never gonna attract anybody. Just saying. lol
 
No, not really.
 
Yes, they are, in the same way that Khorne is allowed to do everything but bring Kharn back to life
 
I mean, Khorne doesn't really do anything except power null, resurrecting and enjoying the bloodshed
 
The brothers dont do much other than ressurect, move him around, and enjoy his suffering on their terms
 
Can he circumvent causality manipulation? Because if not, Calypso can quite easily just think "You were never born" and be done with it.

Can also just send him backwards in time.

Or turn him into a baby.

Snap his fingers and cause him to be desired by everyone in the world, effectively forcing him to be chased by an ever-growing mob for the rest of eternity.

Or just bind him in plants like he did to Amber Rose. Hell, so much as switching out the Old Man's clothes with a straitjacket would be enough, seeing as the guy is just an everyday human physically.

There's a lot he could do here, tbh. And unless we decide to just have the Brothers take the entire fight into their own hands (which would be dumb), I don't see how 1440 will get a chance to use any of his equipment, especially since Calypso's powers can be activated with a thought.

And really, if the Brothers like to enjoy the Old Man's suffering, then Calypso proverbially kicking him into paste with his hax would be to their benefit, would it not?
 
Yes actually, his spear passively overrides causality on a 1-B scale due to being imbued with the Scarlet Kings power

Brothers would bring him forward in time

Brothers would restore him

Passive probability manip would actually inadvertently kill everyone who gets close to him

Brothers would free him and move him like they did when he tried to bury himself alive or sink himself to the bottom of the ocean

No it wouldnt, they need 1440 alive so he can kill everyone on earth so they can have more soldiers for the army of the dead to fight the scarlet king. And theyre not the pyhsical torture type, more the psychological torture.
 
Concede.

If he's still serving his purpose of killing people with his presence, then there's no reason for the Brothers to bring him back in time.

See above. He's actually much more likely to gain people's attention as a baby than he is as an old man, which only furthers the Brothers' goals.

This would also further the Brothers' goals, and judging from the file reports on him, the passive probability manipulation wouldn't kill these people the moment they stepped into his vicinity.

No reason to fix him if he's stuck in a straitjacket, since he's still not dead or incapable of traveling.

Most of Calypso's hax won't actually kill him, so overall, he's hardly going to be in any position that the Brothers would have a reason to reverse for his benefit.
 
They wouldnt have the time to wait for him to make it back the present as the entire reason they cursed him is so their army could frow due to the scarlet king growing in power. Its also entirely possible that age manip won't work in general due to the Brothers locking him at age 50 perpetually for dozens of years.

Except the psychological torment they made specifically to torture and break him would be rendered moot, which wouldn't sit well with them.

Yes but how does that stop him from fighting Calypso exactly? And technically they would, there are tales where things die instantly around him.

They brought him back from burying himself alive, throwing himself into canyons, and sinking himself to the bottom of the ocean, there's no reason they wouldn't do the acme here.
 
People dying in the past = retroactive growth of their army in the present. Which furthers their agenda in the end.

You're saying he would lose all of his memories just because his age has been reversed? What proof is there of that? Also, what's keeps them from just giving him his memories back and leaving him as a child? Is there a reason they would want him as an old man and nothing else if he's still furthering their goals in the end?

Straitjacket = Can't use his items, which are the only real threat to Calypso in this fight. Probability Manipulation is a subset of Fate Manipulation, which doesn't work on acausal characters unless there are feats of it doing so.

Those were suicide attempts, which obviously would have thrown a massive wrench in their plans if they had let them succeed. Not the same situation here.

Also, if Calypso decides to teleport him somewhere, who's to say the Brothers will do him the favor of teleporting him back to the battleground? What reason do they have for bringing him back into a fight when he could be out and about causing death and destruction to further their plans? Has he had an actual fight before where the Brothers chose to act as cosmic "respawning points" just so that he could continue to engage an enemy? And if so, what were the circumstances?
 
Dante - this party getting crazy! Let's rock!
Dante - this party getting crazy! Let's rock!
 
We need 1440 to go up against more Masadaverse characters.

Or at least Mami OvO
 
Such chaos is for another day my friend.
 
Sorry I'm taking so long to respond, at work and busy. Rest assured i will be countering all of your points ovo
 
Yobobojojo said:
>Sees this thread

My dissapointment is I M M E A S U R A B L E, and my day is ruined.
Click to expand...
Is it because I ninja'd you or something?
 
I am dissapointed with your spam of pitting two people against each other.

I also just wanted to use the meme ovo
 
Here's a funny meme:

Novel Kars vs 1440 OvO

It was a joke. Don't actually make that thread. Please.
 
It does actually because they wouldnt be gaining any new soldiers and it would set back their growth immensely since the Scarlet King wouldnt be affected, meaning he'd be growing stronger while their army's growth would stagnate.

Yes, there is a reason they want him as an old man, one of their biggest methods of torture involves an artificial copy of his wife, the wife he watched die at the hands of the Small Death without being able to save her, that only has one single purpose in its existence; to tell 1440 how much she despises him. Its meant to be the final straw that would drive him insane. Also, my mistake, he is locked at 80, not 50

His probability manip comes directly from the Brothers, and 1440's fate manip works on a 1-B scale, so unless Calypso has feats of resisting 1-B powers he's not resisting them.

Ether way he'd end up dead and in the eyes of the Brothers theyre no different as the result is the same. And he's cut off from death anyways so unless they say he can he wouldnt be able to succeed.

Because Calypso would make a powerful addition to the Army of the Dead? Because they'd need 1440 beat Calypso so he could either be saved from the Scarlet King within the Halls of the Dead or sealed to prevent the Scarlet King from using Calypso's power himself? The Brothers are simultaneously extremely spiteful and extremely cunning, they wouldnt have any reason to not have 1440 defeat a reality bender like Calypso for one reason or another.
 
Wouldn't set them back at all, though. Even if they perceive their army as "stagnating", the truth of it is that the army will have grown considerably depending on how far back Calypso has sent him. And actually, if he's truly immortal and can't die, then they won't need to "wait" for him to "return" to the present. He'll already be there (albeit mentally quite a bit older than before), because he won't have died or anything. And if we take this to its logical conclusion, then another version of him exists in the past, which means they will have had twice as many dead folks joining their army as they did before.

This doesn't explain why he would lose his memories in the first place just because his age was regressed a bit. It also doesn't tell me why that form of torture would be moot in the first place; I assume the artificial wife would berate him just the same.

What exactly do you mean by "comes directly from the Brothers"? Being granted a power by a 1-B does not necessarily mean said power itself is 1-B unless there's evidence of it. Also, proof of the Old Man's powers operating on a 1-B scale?

He would end up dead just because Calypso swapped his clothes out with a straitjacket and then sent him somewhere else? I'm doubtful about that.

I'll ask again; have they ever actually attempted to bring 1440 back into a fight just so that he could defeat something/someone extremely powerful? That seems as detrimental to them as not, seeing as a failure would mean they've wasted (apparently quite precious) time instead of taking the route that would further their plans surefire.

And what if he can't defeat a powerful reality bender like Calypso on his own? Even if he does get around one of the many things that Calypso could do to him with a thought, there's nothing stopping Calypso from continually screwing him over with the many, many applications of his reality-warping powers. Which he may or may not decide to do, depending on the circumstances.

Also, now I'm imagining Calypso being to the Scarlet King what Randall Flagg is to the Crimson King. That is one horrific mental image.
 
Touching on the bit about making him desired by everyone in the world, when Calypso did this to Gene Ruttish, it caused everyone to swarm him en masse and carry him off to God knows where. So that would prevent him from fighting Calypso and serve the Brothers' plans, since that would take him away from Calypso and eventually lead an entire city's population dying of some catastrophe somewhere down the line.

As far as the stories that depict people dying instantly the moment they step within his vicinity (whatever those may be), his SCP page states that his anomalous properties take effect after he's been within the vicinity of others for a few days or more. Having people die of horrible causes the instant they meet him directly contradicts what's on his SCP page, which takes priority over other forms of canon. So those stories can be disregarded.
 
>The Old Man's Fate Manipulation working on an 1-B scale

I know The Cards are one of The Brothers' possessions and all, but i am pretty sure it was just said 1440 manipulated fate to avoid wars and conflicts so The Great Death never came to reap those who died in said conflicts. He never used them to directly oppose him or something like that
 
@Ultima

"The prize of the Second was greater, like the Second himself. With the cards, he could challenge the Second's authority, hold the power of the Great Death at bay. When war was brewing, when man turned against his brother, he was there, to challenge the Second, to turn the tides of fire and steel."

Yes, he directly opposed the Great Death's powers
 
That quote is literally what Ultima just said; he used the cards to "turn the tides of fire and steel", meaning he manipulated the wars in order to keep the Great Death from using his power. He didn't use the cards to literally keep the Great Death away.

And before you point out "greater, like the Second himself", that doesn't mean the cards are equal to the Great Death. It means they are greater than the prize of the First.
 
No, youre not understanding, they need him in the time period he is in now for the specific reason of being able to wipe out humanity in one fell swoop the way he did solely because the Scarlet King grew in power so quickly and because it would cause him so much anguish and destroy his hope.

If you turn someone into a baby logically their mind would regress to that of a baby's, meaning he'd forget his wife and thus render their torture moot. Hell it would mean that he'd forget everything and have no understanding of what is happening around him or why he should be upset about it.

What I mean the Brothers' probability manipulation is what directly causes the damage in the first place. The Sack of the All Death can seal the All Death, who is 1-B, and the Fourth Spear of the Scarlet King severely damaged the Scarlet King, who is 1-B. The Cards of Fate can counter the Great Death's influence

1440 has fought otherworldly monsters before and won, yes. And if you really want to get into this, 1440's Spear passively nullifies RW by overriding the timeline and defining normalcy in the localized area.

Meanwhile 1440 literally just has to open a bag or throw his spear once and Calypso will be dead beyond anything the Twisted Metal verse could ever hope to encounter.

All of them would either die or the Brothers would return him to fighting Calypso

The page does not take priority, never has, and never will.
 
He held that power at bay by manipulating the wars so that said power couldn't be used. Literally just said that.

The surrounding context does not at all suggest that he used the cards to directly oppose the Great Death.
 
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