Xeno Goku VS Mario

[Warren_Valion]

Also, this is what the scenario would be if we are ignoring that Goku has the AP advantage.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Also, this is what the scenario would be if we are ignoring that Goku has the AP advantage.

Why isn't sealing on Goku's profile?

 

[Warren_Valion]

Also, this is what the scenario would be if we are ignoring that Goku has the AP advantage.

Why isn't sealing on Goku's profile?

I have no ******* clue.

Someone forgot to put it in I guess.

 

[The_Causality]

If the actual upgrade has been accepted, goku scream and mario die, literally

 

[DragonEmperor23]

I guess now we can put it in and have the () with the scan of it so people stop thinking it's Mafuba.

 

[Warren_Valion]

If the actual upgrade has been accepted, goku scream and mario die, literally

I wouldn't be so sure, as I believe it would be in-character for Goku to limit himself to Mario's level for a good fight.

Although I still think that Goku has the advantage for these reasons:

"Anyway, I still vote for Goku because of his better range, his spamming teleportation in character, his superior skill in Martial Arts, and his Info Analysis warning him of any hax abilities that Mario has, and since they are all projectiles, that means they can be dodged."

 

[Warren_Valion]

I guess now we can put it in and have the () with the scan of it so people stop thinking it's Mafuba.

Lol.

Shouldn't we add the Dragon Balls to his standard equipment as well?

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Yeah, people didn't know that either.

 

[BajaBlastoise1329]

Mario takes this. Goku may have higher AP, but he doesn't have any useful hax. Mario, on the other hand, can reflect Goku's ki blasts right back at him, can put Goku to sleep, can flip into another dimension to avoid Goku's attacks, can possess Goku, can use Zone Speed to easily avoid Goku's attacks while landing in many of his own, can use a Capture Card to seal Goku, can turn Goku into a tree or a coin and can nullify Goku's attacks.

Yup. I still don't know who wins but I have this one user on my Piccolo VS Donkey Kong thread talking about Piccolo using Mafuba. Piccolo would need a container and Donkey Kong can easily stop it with Zone Speed. So DK has a way of beating Piccolo but I won't get too much into that thread.

 

[Warren_Valion]

@AlienFoam1329

Have you read any of my reasoning?

 

[BajaBlastoise1329]

@AlienFoam1329
Have you read any of my reasoning?

Yes. I was thinking about it and I thought Goku would win by a bit.

 

[Sptflcrw]

@Sptflcrw
All of Mario's hax is active and projectile based, which can be dodged.

And the reasons why Goku will dodge said hax is because his Info Analysis will warn him of whatever ability Mario is using, and his spamming teleportation in-character, better flight and maneuverability in the air, and superior martial arts skill will allow Goku to do as such.

This is a lie. The Capture Cards, Music Keys, and Zone Speed are not projectile based.

That's not what his info analysis does. It tells him how strong his opponent is, nothing more. It doesn't tell him Mario's abilities or when Mario will use them. Goku doesn't IT spam in character either.

 

[HST_Master]

>Goku doesn't spam IT

His fights with Beerus, Pikkon, and Cell beg to differ

His ability to sense Ki =/= His info analysis we've said this multiple times over.

 

[Warren_Valion]

This is a lie. The Capture Cards, Music Keys, and Zone Speed are not projectile based.

That's not what his info analysis does. It tells him how strong his opponent is, nothing more. It doesn't tell him Mario's abilities or when Mario will use them. Goku doesn't IT spam in character either.

Doesn't he throw the capture cards?

Anyway, the person who I quoted was Cal, and Cal is knowledgeable on Mario, and I trust his knowledge. So the burden of proof is on you to show us that it is not projectile based.


And what?

Goku's Ki sense tells him how strong his opponent is, Goku's Info Analysis tells him their abilities.

Goku doesn't spam IT, huh?

I feel like you think this is normal Goku, it isn't normal Goku, this is Xeno Goku.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

Still waiting for a scan of Goku's info analysis.

 

[HST_Master]

His Info analysis comes from both Beat and The Future Warrior who show that DBH and Xenoverse characters have the ability to see opponents Abilities and Techniques with and without a Scouter.

 

[HST_Master]

All Characters can do this btw, not just FW

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

Wouldn't that's just apply to those two? Why would we assume Xeno Goku has it?

 

[HST_Master]

Because all characters in the games can use it. not just them

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Because all characters in the games can use it. not just them

^

 

[The_Smashor]

 

[WindGodAcheron]

Additionally, I'd like to say that Akira Toriyama himself has stated that Goku uses Instant Transmission for his fighting style.

 

[DMB_1]

Also, saying that Goku is a "brawler" is wrong because he's an actual expert strategist and martial artist in battle.

At best you can say he prefers close-range fighting, but that's only when he knows he can take on the opponent one-on-one.

 

[Warren_Valion]

Yeah, Broly is a brawler. Goku is a genius when it comes to fighting and a master martial artist.

And while Goku likes fighting and having a good fight, he knows when he's outclassed, and will try to find any way to win.

 

[Sptflcrw]

@Warren Valion

No? What made you think that?

So am I, but fine. I'll prove it. Mario holds the Catch Card over his head, and boom. For Zone Speed, all Mario does is concentrate and boom, time slows down. If Goku's Info Analysis is just the scan thingy from Xenoverse, then it's shit. All it does is tell him the name of the move. Not any of the effects of the moves. But even ignoring that, almost all of Mario's hax comes from items as opposed to a natural ability, and I don't think the Info Scan from Xenoverse told you what items the opponent had.

For one, that's an Instant Kamehameha. You perform that by ITing before firing a Kamehameha. Of course he's going to IT before using it. But even ignoring that, he isn't even using IT to dodge something, he's using it for offensive purposes. Plus, I wouldn't call using IT twice "IT spam".

lol then why did you link normal Goku "spamming" IT? They're different characters, but they have similar battle tactics.

 

[Warren_Valion]

@Warren Valion
No? What made you think that?

So am I, but fine. I'll prove it. Mario holds the Catch Card over his head, and boom. For Zone Speed, all Mario does is concentrate and boom, time slows down. If Goku's Info Analysis is just the scan thingy from Xenoverse, then it's shit. All it does is tell him the name of the move. Not any of the effects of the moves. But even ignoring that, almost all of Mario's hax comes from items as opposed to a natural ability, and I don't think the Info Scan from Xenoverse told you what items the opponent had.

For one, that's an Instant Kamehameha. You perform that by ITing before firing a Kamehameha. Of course he's going to IT before using it. But even ignoring that, he isn't even using IT to dodge something, he's using it for offensive purposes. Plus, I wouldn't call using IT twice "IT spam".

lol then why did you link normal Goku "spamming" IT? They're different characters, but they have similar battle tactics.

I'm pretty sure the Catch Cards are like the Pokeballs. You throw them at your opponents and it may or may not capture them. I'm pretty sure him holding it above his head and it working is just game mechanics, like how could you even guide it to capture the right enemy otherwise?

Are the sports games even canon lol?

Even if they are, it doesn't matter since Goku resists Time Stop which is infinitely greater than time slow.

And what are you talking about? His Info Analysis tells him the abilities and techniques of his opponents.

He's used IT for defensive purposes, remember?

And I posted the video to show he can spam IT if needs to.

 

[Sptflcrw]

That's literally just your headcanon. Holds absolutely no relevance here. It's not a game mechanic.

Do you even know how we treat Mario "canon" here? We don't. There is no canon.

lol Goku's resistance to time stop is shit. He resisted Hit's time stop, which doesn't even work against opponents stronger than himself. No other time stop is like that.

It tells him the name of the ability. It doesn't tell him what it does, nor does it tell him what items the opponent has.

I thought this was Xeno Goku, not normal Goku. Do you see the problem with that arguement? It doesn't work both ways. But either way, dodging one attack with IT isn't spamming it.

Except that video doesn't have Xeno Goku, nor does regular Goku even spam IT in that clip.

 

[HST_Master]

>Goku's Resistance to time stop is shit.

You mean him and the other time patrollers moving fine while in a 2-B timestop caused by Towa? Cuz Xeno Goku didn't experience anything in Super besides BoGs and that was after GT for him. In other words he didn't fight Hit.

Except Beerus wasn't attacking 1st of all he quite literally was on the offense(Goku that is). You're trying to make it seem as if Xeno Goku has never done anything normal has and that's definitely not true. Your argument relies on ignoring Z and the movies for his mindset.

 

[Sptflcrw]

Not what the profile says. It says his resistance comes from resisting Hit.

Um, so? Warren Valion said I was acting like this was normal Goku as opposed to Xeno Goku. In response, I've been trying to prove they have nearly identical mindsets.

 

[Warren_Valion]

Not what the profile says. It says his resistance comes from resisting Hit.
Um, so? Warren Valion said I was acting like this was normal Goku as opposed to Xeno Goku. In response, I've been trying to prove they have nearly identical mindsets.

What?

Hit's Timestop is shit just because Goku was able to resist it? What kind of logic is that?

And I am pretty sure that isn't why Xeno Goku has Time Stop resistance, or at least it shouldn't be since Xeno Goku doesn't go through Dragon Ball Super and he doesn't have the God forms.

And you misconstrued what I said

Xeno Goku is normal Goku + GT Goku + Heroes shit.

And what I meant by that is that this Goku had abilities that normal Goku doesn't. Like how you confused his Ki Sensing with his Info Analysis.

Obviously, they'd have similar mindsets, it's the same person. Although I think Xeno Goku takes confrontations more seriously.

 

[Kepekley23]

> He resisted Hit's time stop, which doesn't even work against opponents stronger than himself

Different canons.

 

[Sptflcrw]

> He resisted Hit's time stop, which doesn't even work against opponents stronger than himself
Different canons.

Look at his profile.

 

[Sptflcrw]

@Warren Valion

It's shit because you can resist it via AP.

That's what his profile says.

Yeah, I know. But his Info Analysis isn't very good either.

 

[Kepekley23]

Can you provide a quote from the DBS anime suggesting Hit's time-stop works the same way as it does in the DBS manga? That's why I said different canons.

 

[Warren_Valion]

The profile clear needs additions.

I mean, it doesn't even have his sealing.

Fixing up where he got his Time Stop is just another thing that needs correction.

 

[Warren_Valion]

@Warren Valion
It's shit because you can resist it via AP.

That's what his profile says.

Yeah, I know. But his Info Analysis isn't very good either.

No. It's not resisted via AP.

If it was, Goku wouldn't have the resistance, Hit's Time Stop would have a weakness.

Goku powered through the time stop, but couldn't hold on long enough and was affected by it once again.

 

[Sptflcrw]

Can you provide a quote from the DBS anime suggesting Hit's time-stop works the same way as it does in the DBS manga? That's why I said different canons.

Literally everyone notably stronger than him that he fights ends up overpowering the technique. Plus, I'm pretty sure we take the manga as long as it doesn't contradict something in the anime, but I might be wrong on that.

 

[Kepekley23]

Jiren being able to resist Hit's Timeskip makes people literally shit themselves, yet half of the people who did so can also do it?

No. You also talk about profiles, but nobody accepts Hit's Time-Skip only working on those weaker or equal to him.

The manga is equal to the anime in canonicity, but it's a separate universe altogether and Xenoverse mostly draws from the anime.

 

[Warren_Valion]

Hit has only been overpowered by Goku and Jiren, and Jiren has a statement from Vados that says "he transcends time", so I don't see how "Literally everyone notably stronger than him that he fights ends up overpowering the technique".

And the manga and anime are two different continuities and we consider them separate.

 

[Bobsican]

It seems I have to point out Mario has Duplication, which can easily allow him to distract Goku while one of the copies just transmutates him or something.

In other words, I vote for Mario.