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Towa (DBH) Abilities + Resistances

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DarkDragonMedeus said:
Commenting on the 5th one; it sounds more like durability reduction; so it's added to the list of statistics reduction, but unless it outright drops durability all the way down to 0; it isn't quite "Negation" but rather reduction. Furthermore, DonTalkDT also mentioned a game mechanics about ignoring defense stat isn't enough to be true durability negation. It needs to have some kind of association with a hax ability that does negate durability whether it be poison inducement, spatial manipulation, existence erasure, matter manipulation, ect. Otherwise it would just be statistics reduction.

But the rest looks solid taking Dominodalek's input in mind.
Click to expand...
I'll try to Answer this as best as i can for you

1. Towa isn't reducing an enemies defense, she's straight up ignoring it.
2. It doesn't reduce enemies defense to zero but rather disables the defense stat altogether essentially treating it as if it didn't exist
3. Disabling the Defense Stat is akin to treating a enemies durability as non existent. For Example A rock has a defense of 9999, disabling defense would essentially mean all that defense would be ignored completely. Its not reducing the stat to zero but more like treating the defense stat as if it were completely removed
4. Not being truly durability negation doesn't mean its not. Its still durability negation just by different means
5. "Ignoring Defense Stat isn't enough to be true durability negation" yeah tell that to Fire Emblem 7 Fire Dragon and Grima who you gave Durability Negation to for the EXACT SAME REASON of ignoring defense stats and always doing the same damage regardless of what the opponents defense stat is
6. Towa has Spatial Manipulation but I often see her using it defensively rather than offensively
 
I want to make it abundantly clear that the ability isn't doing anything to the defense stat, the character's defense is still present, the attack just bypasses it.

(Otherwise it isn't tied to any particular hax, abilities of that type (ie activating when a character successfully attacks, and adding an additional effect to the attack) are very common in Heroes and pretty much anyone can have one.)
 
To further back up the point, the ability that allows the DBH character to negate or bypass durability also says on Goku's profile that it bypasses defensive skills as well. Just as an extra note. I don't think it makes sense for a durability negation to be restricted from a character if they don't have durability negating hax, having a technique or move that ignores that stuff should be enough.
 
Ss3micah said:
5. Conceptual Erasing of Opponents Durability (I say this because as you all know the defense stat is a core part of the entire DBH game and it applies to all characters, its an in game rule that all characters have a defense stat and the fact that towa can just remove an opponents defense stat right from the very game itself says alot
Click to expand...
woah, conceptual dbh???
 
Dominodalek said:
I want to make it abundantly clear that the ability isn't doing anything to the defense stat, the character's defense is still present, the attack just bypasses it.

(Otherwise it isn't tied to any particular hax, abilities of that type (ie activating when a character successfully attacks, and adding an additional effect to the attack) are very common in Heroes and pretty much anyone can have one.)
Click to expand...
Well She still is DISABLING an opponents so how would you interpret that exactly?
Based on your comment it sounds alot like durability Bypassing/Ignoring
 
Yuraga said:
To further back up the point, the ability that allows the DBH character to negate or bypass durability also says on Goku's profile that it bypasses defensive skills as well. Just as an extra note. I don't think it makes sense for a durability negation to be restricted from a character if they don't have durability negating hax, having a technique or move that ignores that stuff should be enough.
Click to expand...
Separate ability (Goku does actually have a few cards with this ability) though neither bypass defensive skills. They work the exact same way, negating defense and DMG Reduction for that specific attack.

Ss3micah said:
Well She still is DISABLING an opponents so how would you interpret that exactly?
Based on your comment it sounds alot like durability Bypassing/Ignoring
Click to expand...
That should fall under Durability Negation, Durability Bypassing/Ignoring isn't a thing here.
 
Yuraga said:
To further back up the point, the ability that allows the DBH character to negate or bypass durability also says on Goku's profile that it bypasses defensive skills as well. Just as an extra note. I don't think it makes sense for a durability negation to be restricted from a character if they don't have durability negating hax, having a technique or move that ignores that stuff should be enough.
Click to expand...
I Agree as well
Cause as i said before Fire Emblem 7 Fire Dragon and Grima have Durability Negation and No Durability Negating hax to speak of

Furthermore i'd like to point out that DarkDragonMedeus said a person can have durability negation if they can drops an opponents defense to zero so clearly the he either made a mistake or Durabilitiy Negating hax aren't necessarily a prerequisite for Durability Negation
 
Hey Guys I was Reading through the DBH Big Bang Mission Manga and I found a few things that can be added to Towa's Profile

BFR and Dimensional Travel
Towa Appearing and Transporting all the members of the Time Patrol Away

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e690d5a807d807fb18a51101828ddb37/38.jpghttps://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e690d5a807d807fb18a51101828ddb37/39.jpg

Continued along with possibly Sleep Manipulation and Paralysis Inducement
She transported everyone to the time Chasm and as we can clearly see everyone except pan are asleep/unconscious which means that Towa must have put them to sleep cause i heavily doubt that they all decided to take a Nap at that time and I seriously doubt Towa defeated and KOed all the members of the time patrol all at the same time without a scratch. Furthermore, the time patrol are bound by Towa's Ki Cross Structures and there movements were stopped completely. Even if you want to make the point that Towa probably beat Gohan and Goten into submission, there is still the fact that goku, vegeta and trunks were all asleep with not a single scratch on them. Also in a later scan you will see that pan is struggling to stay awake/conscious.

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e3fe331bab5756ca9e5dbc20c9ad9687/24.jpg
https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e3fe331bab5756ca9e5dbc20c9ad9687/25.jpg

Continued Along with Possibly Energy Absorption
Now this is why I said possibly sleep manipulation cause the other alternative is that Towa's Ki Crosses were simply Absorbing Trunks and everyone else's energy as well which is what caused everyone to fall unconscious. As trunks said he doesn't have any power left and it would offer a good explanation as to why both Goku and Vegeta have reverted back to base due to having there Energies Absorbed and drained, there is also the possibility that Pan also fell unconscious and that may be a result of having her energy drained to nothing as well. BUT Trunks' lack of Energy could have another reason. During this Chapter Trunks gives ALL OF HIS ENERGY AWAY to goku and vegeta which could explain his lack of energy and I dont think Goku and Vegeta would be able to maintain Limit Breaker SS4 in an unconscious state. So either Towa's Power Induces Sleep or Drains Energy or Maybe even both

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e690d5a807d807fb18a51101828ddb37/25.jpg

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/f60d1e30a71417d7df6984b41bab9621/12.jpg

Further point for BFR and Dimensional Travel and Paralyses Inducement
Trunks and the time patrol had to be rescued by Demigra's Faction in order to escape the time chasm which evidently Towa can move to and from very easily and freely and Towa was surprised they could escape on their own with the situation only making sense to her after hearing that it was Demigra's Secretary that helped them escaped

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/f60d1e30a71417d7df6984b41bab9621/13.jpg
https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/f60d1e30a71417d7df6984b41bab9621/23.jpg

So to list it all out

Towa should be given:
BFR
Dimensional Travel
Paralyses Inducement
More than Likely Sleep Manipulation
And Maybe Energy Absorption

What do you guys say?
 
Ss3micah said:
Hey Guys I was Reading through the DBH Big Bang Mission Manga and I found a few things that can be added to Towa's Profile

BFR and Dimensional Travel
Towa Appearing and Transporting all the members of the Time Patrol Away

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e690d5a807d807fb18a51101828ddb37/38.jpghttps://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e690d5a807d807fb18a51101828ddb37/39.jpg

Continued along with possibly Sleep Manipulation and Paralysis Inducement
She transported everyone to the time Chasm and as we can clearly see everyone except pan are asleep/unconscious which means that Towa must have put them to sleep cause i heavily doubt that they all decided to take a Nap at that time and I seriously doubt Towa defeated and KOed all the members of the time patrol all at the same time without a scratch. Furthermore, the time patrol are bound by Towa's Ki Cross Structures and there movements were stopped completely. Even if you want to make the point that Towa probably beat Gohan and Goten into submission, there is still the fact that goku, vegeta and trunks were all asleep with not a single scratch on them. Also in a later scan you will see that pan is struggling to stay awake/conscious.

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e3fe331bab5756ca9e5dbc20c9ad9687/24.jpg
https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e3fe331bab5756ca9e5dbc20c9ad9687/25.jpg

Continued Along with Possibly Energy Absorption
Now this is why I said possibly sleep manipulation cause the other alternative is that Towa's Ki Crosses were simply Absorbing Trunks and everyone else's energy as well which is what caused everyone to fall unconscious. As trunks said he doesn't have any power left and it would offer a good explanation as to why both Goku and Vegeta have reverted back to base due to having there Energies Absorbed and drained, there is also the possibility that Pan also fell unconscious and that may be a result of having her energy drained to nothing as well. BUT Trunks' lack of Energy could have another reason. During this Chapter Trunks gives ALL OF HIS ENERGY AWAY to goku and vegeta which could explain his lack of energy and I dont think Goku and Vegeta would be able to maintain Limit Breaker SS4 in an unconscious state. So either Towa's Power Induces Sleep or Drains Energy or Maybe even both

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/e690d5a807d807fb18a51101828ddb37/25.jpg

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/f60d1e30a71417d7df6984b41bab9621/12.jpg

Further point for BFR and Dimensional Travel and Paralyses Inducement
Trunks and the time patrol had to be rescued by Demigra's Faction in order to escape the time chasm which evidently Towa can move to and from very easily and freely and Towa was surprised they could escape on their own with the situation only making sense to her after hearing that it was Demigra's Secretary that helped them escaped

https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/f60d1e30a71417d7df6984b41bab9621/13.jpg
https://cdn.**********.com/manga_5f0a6ba165175/f60d1e30a71417d7df6984b41bab9621/23.jpg

So to list it all out

Towa should be given:
BFR
Dimensional Travel
Paralyses Inducement
More than Likely Sleep Manipulation
And Maybe Energy Absorption

What do you guys say?
Click to expand...
I guess I agree, I don't see a reason why she wouldn't have those based off those scans. I'll reread them but I think this checks out.
 
I agree with BFR and Dimensional Travel, not so sure about Sleep Manipulation, Paralysis Inducement or Energy Absorption - their trouble remaining conscious appears to be from their location more than anything (other media supports this), plus being worn out from the fight with Janemba. Gohan and Goten were knocked out (other media supports this) which is why they aren't conscious, Trunks clearly is conscious in those scans, Goku presumably also is since he gets a thought balloon. They obviously aren't paralyzed given that we can clearly see their bindings are holding them in place.
 
I agree with what Domino said, upon secondary review, I don't think Sleep hax applies here, but definitely BFR and Dimensional Travel. I think the Energy Absorption is just her taking energy for the Dark Factor in that scene with the black stuff leaving Pan. I could be wrong though.
 
Upon reviewing your comment i must agree with you. I was kinda confused when i saw that before being bfr goku and vegeta were in ss4 and after being sent to the time chasm, they were in base form unconscious and tied to a cross which i assumed only happened because towa drained them out of ss4 or put them to sleep since they cant maintain the form while unconscious But more or less that could be a result of the location affecting them rather than towa herself. I also was going for paralyses inducement cause i thought maybe towa's dark cross was stopping them from moving and when trunks fell off the cross he still couldn't move or at least i didn't see him trying to anyways but i suppose you could chalk that up to lack of energy. In any case at least BFR and D.Travel gets added.
 
Dominodalek said:
I agree with BFR and Dimensional Travel, not so sure about Sleep Manipulation, Paralysis Inducement or Energy Absorption - their trouble remaining conscious appears to be from their location more than anything (other media supports this), plus being worn out from the fight with Janemba. Gohan and Goten were knocked out (other media supports this) which is why they aren't conscious, Trunks clearly is conscious in those scans, Goku presumably also is since he gets a thought balloon. They obviously aren't paralyzed given that we can clearly see their bindings are holding them in place.
Click to expand...
Domino I have a question for you
As you say, If the trouble of remaining conscious was because of the location, which Towa was in and completely fine, able to remain conscious without any visible difficulty

Would you equate that as Resistance to sleep manipulation or Type 3 Self Sustenance? Or if not any of those then something else maybe?
 
Ss3micah said:
Domino I have a question for you
As you say, If the trouble of remaining conscious was because of the location, which Towa was in and completely fine, able to remain conscious without any visible difficulty

Would you equate that as Resistance to sleep manipulation or Type 3 Self Sustenance? Or if not any of those then something else maybe?
Click to expand...
Considering they complain in both the arcade and manga about being unable to breathe, the problem may be lack of oxygen, in which case Towa would have Type 1 Self-Sustenance.
 
Ss3micah said:
5. "Ignoring Defense Stat isn't enough to be true durability negation" yeah tell that to Fire Emblem 7 Fire Dragon and Grima who you gave Durability Negation to for the EXACT SAME REASON of ignoring defense stats and always doing the same damage regardless of what the opponents defense stat is
Click to expand...
Sorry to burst in, but that's exactly what Fire Dragon does, and if you think treating Durability as half isn't Durability Negation either then make a CRT ig

They also have literally nothing to do with DB so why are you talking about them

Anyways I think lowering someone's durability is statistics reduction, not durability negation, which "disabling" durability sounds a lot like reducing it to me

The difference between lowering someone's durability and negating it via an attack is simple

Reduction: Their durability is now gone, you can attack for higher damage, so can an ally or anyone else

Negation: You treat their durability as if it's gone, attack for massive damage
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
Anyways I think lowering someone's durability is statistics reduction, not durability negation, which "disabling" durability sounds a lot like reducing it to me

The difference between lowering someone's durability and negating it via an attack is simple

Reduction: Their durability is now gone, you can attack for higher damage, so can an ally or anyone else

Negation: You treat their durability as if it's gone, attack for massive damage
Click to expand...
Sorry but the card effect is not dura reduce either, it is straight up ignore defensive stats of opponent and damage their HP directly at max damage of the card, without being reduce through opponent defensive stats. It is perfectly reasonable as Dura Neg definition
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
Ah, the wording got me, attacking HP directly is definitely Durability Negation
Click to expand...
Well the OP could make thing get confuse cause Yugara just post the card effect here and there and forget to organize the line, plus a bunch of other card that have stat reduce effect make it hard to observe what card have dura neg, what don't
 
From now on I will be adding a post like this to my starting thread posts to help make things simple for everyone. Thanks for the notes guys! ^_^

The Abilities:
-Passive and Active Probability Manipulation
-Passive and Active Damage Boost
-Regeneration/Healing Reduction + Stamina Recovery Reduction
-Status Effect Inducement with Limited Resistance Bypassing against foes with little to no stamina
-Passive and Active Statistics Reduction [Power, Durability, Stamina]
-Limited Fire Manipulation via Burning God Meteor
-Limited Ice Manipulation (Likely Absolute Zero scaling from Base Demigra) via Extremely Cold God Meteor
-Durability Negation
-Summoning [Mira, Dabura: Xeno, Great Devilman, Base Demigra, Slug: Xeno, Dark Shenron (Dark Shenron is specifically for enhancing damage or stamina damage as well as reducing stats]
-Passive and Active Damage Reduction
-Life-Force Absorption
-Statistics Amplification
-Power Nullification [Can seal the ability to use powerful techniques or abilities while acting as a supporter]
-Passive Statistics Stealing
-Portal Creation
-BFR
-Dimensional Travel
-Darkness Construct Creation

The Resistances:
-Stamina Reduction Resistance
-Status Effect Inducement Resistance
-Damage Reduction Resistance
-Time Stop (Likely Time Manipulation as she scales to the Demon Gods note on multiple DBH pages of them resisting Chronoa's hax)
-Possibly Sealing
 
Last edited:
Why does Demigra have Absolute Zero in the first place?

For the sake of being pedantic I should note that the official translation of "Extremely Cold God Meteor" is Arctic God Meteor, and that the names of "Dabura: Xeno" and "Slug: Xeno" should be rendered as Dabura (Xeno) and Lord Slug (Xeno) respectively.

Otherwise yep, all good.
 
Dominodalek said:
Why does Demigra have Absolute Zero in the first place?

For the sake of being pedantic I should note that the official translation of "Extremely Cold God Meteor" is Arctic God Meteor, and that the names of "Dabura: Xeno" and "Slug: Xeno" should be rendered as Dabura (Xeno) and Lord Slug (Xeno) respectively.

Otherwise yep, all good.
Click to expand...
I believe they have it placed as Absolute Zero Ice Manipulation on Demigra's profile because he should scale above Eis Shenron who in the games can output Absolute Zero Ice Manipulation though I fail to see how that necessarily means Demigra himself would have such manipulation. I think the reason to explain that was he's directly controlled Eis Shenron before and so due to being stronger should be able to replicate a similar level of cold. I personally find it to be quite a bit of a loopty loop logic for why he would have it. Think it just makes sense to have the cold be rated as colder than space since it's actually affecting people who even the cold of space can't affect. Also thank you for the notes.
 
Yuraga said:
So CC Goku, Towa, Demigra, and any other DBH character with an ability that affects an opponent's stamina should all have Status Effect Inducement if that's the case then. Cool! ^_^
Click to expand...
Dominodalek said:
I agree that it should be limited to characters that actually have such abilities.
Click to expand...
I'm really trying to not sound like a broken record here, but please don't forget to mention the Status Effect Inducement with Limited Bypassing of Resistance. Towa, Demigra and CC Goku should have it, Thank You
 
Ss3micah said:
I'm really trying to not sound like a broken record here, but please don't forget to mention the Status Effect Inducement with Limited Bypassing of Resistance. Towa, Demigra and CC Goku should have it, Thank You
Click to expand...
I'm noting it in the Mechikabura CRT I'm making as well as the Stun Status should be capable of applying to those even with a resistance so long as they have little to no stamina based on what you described. It would make sense based off this statement you put in:

"Even if a character resists status ailments, if they have no stamina then they are LOGICALLY going to be in a state where they simply cant fight nor defend themselves. Its common knowledge in all things real life and fictional. So if someone resist status ailments then logically speaking they cant be stunned but at the same time if they have no stamina then they are still gonna be under status conditions that reflect being stunned

If that is the case then should we treat stun as a status condition that bypasses resistances and activates automatically once you have little or no stamina or do we treat it not as a status ailment but an inevitable natural side effect that automatically occurs as a result of losing most or all your stamina"
 
Okay, but we need to know what they agree and disagree about. So far we can only add what all three of them have approved.
 
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