SauceGod1.1
He/Him- 174
- 13
Don't red hear, strawman me, or assume why, just prove to me what part of the cannon or continuity of terraria restricts the use of hellstone at the beggining.
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The Terrarian vs the Cyberdemon
- Thread starter Keeweed
- Start date
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- Tags
- cyberdemon doom terraria terrarian
- 7,050
- 1,923
- Thread starter
- #82
I'm sorry if I make you feel like I'm straw manning you (probably worded that wrong but it is late where I live). But I feel like your arguing ad nauseum (hopefully that doesn't come off as rude). I don't know what else to say because I've said why I disagree with you, but let me try to phrase it differently.SauceGod1.1 said:
The Guide is clearly telling you what equipment you should have. He isn't making suggestions he's telling you for a fact that you need certain amounts of health and equipment for certain bosses. The Dryad's and explosive experts dialogue doesn't make any sense if the Terrarian had the Reaver Shark because they are trying to give the Terrarian ways to get pasted the Corrupted blocks, but if the Terrarian in canon had the Reaver Shark it would be unnecessary. Hellstone Equipment easily slaughters the bosses while all the dialogue from the clothier and Guide say the Terrarian slowly became stronger via fighting the bosses rather than be-lining it to Hellstone.
Even if we do assume a single optional object holds more priority than all the NPC Dialogue, boss requirements, and the general scaling of the bosses; we would still need the 8-B key for the Terrarian's 8-B Equipment and the Terrarian's pre Hardmode key would stay the same for scaling and his 8-A weapons that don't scale to Hellstone. The Guide mentions the Terrarian going to Hell as the final part of pre Hardmode and says how much health the Terrarian should have for each boss.
The game is yelling to the players face what they should be doing and when they should be doing it; one optional item that's hidden off in the corner that requires RNG to get does not take propriety over everything else in pre Hardmode telling you to fight the bosses to get stronger. For example the Chosen Undead has the option to become 6-B before fighting any of the bosses, does that mean the beginning game Chosen Undead should be 6-B, no because the rest of the game repeatedly tells the player to kill bosses and get stronger; just like how Terraria has an option to skip pre Hardmode but repeatedly yells in your face to kill the bosses normally and even forces bosses to spawn in if you are passing the equipment you are supposed to have during their fights.
SauceGod1.1
He/Him- 174
- 13
I'm sorry if I make you feel like I'm straw manning you (probably worded that wrong but it is late where I live). But I feel like your arguing ad nauseum (hopefully that doesn't come off as rude). I don't know what else to say because I've said why I disagree with you, but let me try to phrase it differently.
Disagreeing with someone is different since it doesn't matter if you disagree, what matters is who is wrong
The Guide is clearly telling you what equipment you should have. He isn't making suggestions he's telling you for a fact that you need certain amounts of health and equipment for certain bosses. The Dryad's and explosive experts dialogue doesn't make any sense if the Terrarian had the Reaver Shark because they are trying to give the Terrarian ways to get pasted the Corrupted blocks, but if the Terrarian in canon had the Reaver Shark it would be unnecessary. Hellstone Equipment easily slaughters the bosses while all the dialogue from the clothier and Guide say the Terrarian slowly became stronger via fighting the bosses rather than be-lining it to Hellstone.
He isn't telling for a fact, he's telling you base on what he knowns, that's why he uses words like should and i think, again basing it on what he knows, can you prove the guide is omniscient and everything he says is the absolute truth? Also, why would any NPC suggest the reader shark if they have no knowledge of it? they can't tell you about it nor do they know anything about it, they're suggesting you do these things and passing it on their current knowledge, again can you prove that any NPC is omnidcient and everything they say is absolute fact rather than them just giving advice and directions on how to o things based on their understanding of it? None of what you said refute why using the reavershark isn't part of the terrarian's continuity since you can't prove that the other NPC know about it since they are just giving you advice on what they know, if they knew about the reavershark they'd tell you to get it because it's better than what they're suggesting but they don't know about it so they cant suggest it.
Even if we do assume a single optional object holds more priority than all the NPC Dialogue, boss requirements, and the general scaling of the bosses; we would still need the 8-B key for the Terrarian's 8-B Equipment and the Terrarian's pre Hardmode key would stay the same for scaling and his 8-A weapons that don't scale to Hellstone. The Guide mentions the Terrarian going to Hell as the final part of pre Hardmode and says how much health the Terrarian should have for each boss.
Again, You're strawmanning me as i never said any of this since I'm not assuming anything, the reader shark is in the game, you have to prove why using it to mine hellstone shouldn't be included in the main continuity of the terrarian's cannon, what I'm saying is that the terrarian's key should include everything that he has access to at that stage, he doesn't need an 8-B key since you'd just have to specify what equipment the terrarian is using, just saying pre-queen bee doesn't specify anything as hellstone is available at that stage and you STILL haven't present why it can't be included in the cannonicity, everything you have presented implies why it isn't supposed to be included but you have yet to show why it can't be included.
The game is yelling to the players face what they should be doing and when they should be doing it; one optional item that's hidden off in the corner that requires RNG to get does not take propriety over everything else in pre Hardmode telling you to fight the bosses to get stronger. For example the Chosen Undead has the option to become 6-B before fighting any of the bosses, does that mean the beginning game Chosen Undead should be 6-B, no because the rest of the game repeatedly tells the player to kill bosses and get stronger; just like how Terraria has an option to skip pre Hardmode but repeatedly yells in your face to kill the bosses normally and even forces bosses to spawn in if you are passing the equipment you are supposed to have during their fights.
Bro you just keep making the same argument, The game isn't saying you should because like I've said previously they aren't obligating you to it, you aren't obligated to fight any boss other than WOF to progress into hardmode so they aren't saying you should do it if not you should consider doing it. you keep saying one optional item yet, and I'm tired of saying this, EVERYTHING IS OPTIONAL BECAUSE IT'S A SANDBOX, available to be chosen but not obligatory is the definition of optional, everything the NPCs tell you are optional because they aren't obligating you to do it, and like bruh you're saying it takes RNG yet every potion has a degree of RNG yet it's still included, I'm not sure why you keep bringing up darksouls but dud you even read my previous arguments? souls is a series of action role-playing games developed by FromSoftware, Terraria is an action-adventure sandbox game developed by Re-Logic. and you said previously that "I can get 6-B equipment in Dark Souls at the beginning of the game without cheating but the Dark Souls protagonist is still 8-B in canon until he was supposed to get to the 6-B bosses." So for the 100th time that I've been asking "what part of the continuity restrict the use of hellstone?" at the begging of hardmode? The bosses don't spawn if you pass the equipment requirement those, all the requirements must be met so why are you using a half truth to further your point? you can have end game equipment and EOC wont spawn until all conditions are met. and again assume means generally assumed or believed to be the case, but not necessarily so it isn't necessarily so that you have to have that equipment if not you're supposed to. But I'll just end this here since you're committing ad verbosium and the argument itself has turned into ad nauseum to where i am just repating myself and respoding to arguemnt you've already made and i've debunked, you've litterally given me a headache by reading the same thing over and over and since it isn't important and you aren't gong to chage your mind nor can you prove why the use of reaver shark to aquire hellstone isn't or can't be allowed in the continuity ot cannonicity of terraria. All you've done is regurgitate the same argument over and over and over again with them containing Half-Truths, False Equivalences, Red Hearing, Overly Verbose and Strawmanning so instead of trying to change your mind or continuing this debate I'll just end it, I'll read what you respond with and I'll reply if you present something different that actually proves why using the reader shark to mine hellstone is contardicted in the cannonicity of terraria, but that's literally impossible since that evidence doesn't exist.
Disagreeing with someone is different since it doesn't matter if you disagree, what matters is who is wrong
The Guide is clearly telling you what equipment you should have. He isn't making suggestions he's telling you for a fact that you need certain amounts of health and equipment for certain bosses. The Dryad's and explosive experts dialogue doesn't make any sense if the Terrarian had the Reaver Shark because they are trying to give the Terrarian ways to get pasted the Corrupted blocks, but if the Terrarian in canon had the Reaver Shark it would be unnecessary. Hellstone Equipment easily slaughters the bosses while all the dialogue from the clothier and Guide say the Terrarian slowly became stronger via fighting the bosses rather than be-lining it to Hellstone.
He isn't telling for a fact, he's telling you base on what he knowns, that's why he uses words like should and i think, again basing it on what he knows, can you prove the guide is omniscient and everything he says is the absolute truth? Also, why would any NPC suggest the reader shark if they have no knowledge of it? they can't tell you about it nor do they know anything about it, they're suggesting you do these things and passing it on their current knowledge, again can you prove that any NPC is omnidcient and everything they say is absolute fact rather than them just giving advice and directions on how to o things based on their understanding of it? None of what you said refute why using the reavershark isn't part of the terrarian's continuity since you can't prove that the other NPC know about it since they are just giving you advice on what they know, if they knew about the reavershark they'd tell you to get it because it's better than what they're suggesting but they don't know about it so they cant suggest it.
Even if we do assume a single optional object holds more priority than all the NPC Dialogue, boss requirements, and the general scaling of the bosses; we would still need the 8-B key for the Terrarian's 8-B Equipment and the Terrarian's pre Hardmode key would stay the same for scaling and his 8-A weapons that don't scale to Hellstone. The Guide mentions the Terrarian going to Hell as the final part of pre Hardmode and says how much health the Terrarian should have for each boss.
Again, You're strawmanning me as i never said any of this since I'm not assuming anything, the reader shark is in the game, you have to prove why using it to mine hellstone shouldn't be included in the main continuity of the terrarian's cannon, what I'm saying is that the terrarian's key should include everything that he has access to at that stage, he doesn't need an 8-B key since you'd just have to specify what equipment the terrarian is using, just saying pre-queen bee doesn't specify anything as hellstone is available at that stage and you STILL haven't present why it can't be included in the cannonicity, everything you have presented implies why it isn't supposed to be included but you have yet to show why it can't be included.
The game is yelling to the players face what they should be doing and when they should be doing it; one optional item that's hidden off in the corner that requires RNG to get does not take propriety over everything else in pre Hardmode telling you to fight the bosses to get stronger. For example the Chosen Undead has the option to become 6-B before fighting any of the bosses, does that mean the beginning game Chosen Undead should be 6-B, no because the rest of the game repeatedly tells the player to kill bosses and get stronger; just like how Terraria has an option to skip pre Hardmode but repeatedly yells in your face to kill the bosses normally and even forces bosses to spawn in if you are passing the equipment you are supposed to have during their fights.
Bro you just keep making the same argument, The game isn't saying you should because like I've said previously they aren't obligating you to it, you aren't obligated to fight any boss other than WOF to progress into hardmode so they aren't saying you should do it if not you should consider doing it. you keep saying one optional item yet, and I'm tired of saying this, EVERYTHING IS OPTIONAL BECAUSE IT'S A SANDBOX, available to be chosen but not obligatory is the definition of optional, everything the NPCs tell you are optional because they aren't obligating you to do it, and like bruh you're saying it takes RNG yet every potion has a degree of RNG yet it's still included, I'm not sure why you keep bringing up darksouls but dud you even read my previous arguments? souls is a series of action role-playing games developed by FromSoftware, Terraria is an action-adventure sandbox game developed by Re-Logic. and you said previously that "I can get 6-B equipment in Dark Souls at the beginning of the game without cheating but the Dark Souls protagonist is still 8-B in canon until he was supposed to get to the 6-B bosses." So for the 100th time that I've been asking "what part of the continuity restrict the use of hellstone?" at the begging of hardmode? The bosses don't spawn if you pass the equipment requirement those, all the requirements must be met so why are you using a half truth to further your point? you can have end game equipment and EOC wont spawn until all conditions are met. and again assume means generally assumed or believed to be the case, but not necessarily so it isn't necessarily so that you have to have that equipment if not you're supposed to. But I'll just end this here since you're committing ad verbosium and the argument itself has turned into ad nauseum to where i am just repating myself and respoding to arguemnt you've already made and i've debunked, you've litterally given me a headache by reading the same thing over and over and since it isn't important and you aren't gong to chage your mind nor can you prove why the use of reaver shark to aquire hellstone isn't or can't be allowed in the continuity ot cannonicity of terraria. All you've done is regurgitate the same argument over and over and over again with them containing Half-Truths, False Equivalences, Red Hearing, Overly Verbose and Strawmanning so instead of trying to change your mind or continuing this debate I'll just end it, I'll read what you respond with and I'll reply if you present something different that actually proves why using the reader shark to mine hellstone is contardicted in the cannonicity of terraria, but that's literally impossible since that evidence doesn't exist.
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- #87
I'm going to bed right now but before I go completely to sleep I'm remaking this thread due to this one being derailed. I'll keep this thread open for now, but in the morning I'll try to get it closed and I'll message Sauce on his message wall to continue the Hellstone conversation there. Sorry for any inconvenience or if I said anything that could be seen as rude. It is late where I live and I definitely am not a night person, but I also couldn't sleep so I felt like I need to continue the conversation.
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