The Presence was severely harmed by Mandrakk?

[Black_monitor]

According to this scan https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11136/111364822/6657709-0853014497-55097.jpg https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11136/111364822/6658790-8284659406-74358.jpg


Mandrakk harmed the Presence and was a dying god who left the multiverse and the Pax Dei Angels wanted to get revenge for Presene against Mandrakk.

Should Mandrakk be upraded to 1-A?

 

[Antvasima]

That was never stated within those scans.

 

[Black_monitor]

The first scan, Mandrkak said "The dying god left your universe, wounded, broken, defenseless" how do we know this is the Presence who was wounded, broken and defenseless? Because in the same scan, Mandrakk drained Spectre and Mandrakk called him the servant of God. Meaning God in that story was the Presence and was the god broken wounded and defenseless. Mandrakk killed God's defenders "Spectre for example" and Mandrakk said the dying god left your universe, wounded, broken and defenseless. It's stated there in the scan!

 

[Antvasima]

That is not remotely evidence. It was more likely boasting.

 

[Sandman31]

That's just speculation, probably boasting or it could have been easily referring to Darkseid, who's also a dying, wounded and broken god who fled the universe. Also, Rox Ogama was weak, got defeated by Green Lanterns and is nowhere near Dax Novu plus being weakened because of his exile to the Orrery of Worlds

 

[DMUA]

Not to mention one feat out of years and years of PIS riddled comics does not really measure up for an upgrade

You'd need to have entire comic runs of Mandrakk being able to kill the Presence to be solid enough for our standards.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, we would at least need more than a very ambiguous mention.

 

[Black_monitor]

What? How could it have been Darkseid?

In the same panel, he calls Spectre as the "Defender" of this God he destroyed? Spectre serves Presence, not Darkseid. The Pax Dei Angels is also there in the second scan, and they want revenge against Nix in the second scan and they're servants of the Presence. Why? Because he harmed the Presence and they want revenge for the God they serve.

How is it Darkseid? There are already two strong suggestions he screwed up the Presence real badly. And the identity of this God is the Presence.

Pax Dei Angels want revenge, Spectre was a "Defender of this God" who Mandrakk drained. In context, the God that Spectre was defending and the God he said was dying and weak is the same because it's in the same panel and page.

Spectre does not defend or serve Darkseid. Neither do Angels from Silver City, they don't serve Darkseid either when they're coming for Mandrakk for revenge.

Just read the scan please. I'm probably wrong, but I'm using your arguments against another guy who is arguing for this.

Boasting it may be, but don't forget that Grant Morrison has been trying to screw up the Presence since he's was always trying to replace the Presence with the Primal Monitor as DC's TOAA.

Outlier this may be or not, but please, at least admit, that this outlier is there. This will potentially change our outlook on DC's Cosmic Hierarchy.

 

[Antvasima]

Again, there is no proof involved, just a subjective interpretation.

I will close this thread now. Do not push this issue here again. Thank you.