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Shūkurō Tsukishima vs Yami Sukehiro

I see if Tsukishima hypothetically cut Yami he would overload his mind and one shot from there

however if they only clashed blades he would RPL rendering all of Yami's techniques useless but might loss cause of his Accelerated Development.
 
Yami: I'll surpass my limits!!!
Tsukishima: We are friends Yami, why would you fight me? Do you not remember when I helped you come to this country?
Yami: You're right, Tsukishima what was I-thinking


Me when people can't read the other abilities of Bote
Me when Yami doesn't win
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
Oh, you actually mentioned that... before...



Alright, even though Yami does not need Ki to win this I want to correct a few things wrong here. I know Bringer Light negs Ki here. I was arguing that Yami can use Ki before bringer light is used. Yami can still predict mere movements before he actually moves. He will know the direction he wants to go with BL before he actually uses BL. Nobody is arguing that it works when BL is used. It just works beforehand. Ki is precognition and not "analytical prediction", there is no way deducing the location of teleportation is an "analytical prediction" feat. Neither is blocking danmaku-style attacks without looking and taking any damage. Yami is capable of doing both simultaneously anyway. Why does BL even limited resistance if it just makes him harder to sense? you people make it seem like it is impossible to sense.

Since Bringer Light doesn't make the man invisible and it's just an FTE speed boost, Yami literally doesn't need to use Ki even though he can before BL is used. All Yami needs to do is to use a condensed Mana Zone to keep up with Bringer Light and blitz him with Death Thrust. depending on how much Yami condenses his Mana Zone it allows him to move at FTE speeds to match BL and surpass it.


LASTLY

Book of the ends needs to cut Yami for its weird shit to work. Yami won't let that happen and would just incorperate his Iai Slash and Death Thrust. However, if you manage to pull some bullshit that makes it possible for Tsukihima to somehow strike Yami even with regular Mana Zone active. Then Yami simply surpasses his limit and beats him. When Yami surpasses his limit he creates spells that are stronger than before and spells that are best fitted for the situation. Book of the end does not work on abilities never shown in the past so like @LIFE_OF_KING puts it earlier. If Death Thrust blitzing does not work the way it is supposed to, then Yami simply surpasses his limit. Of all people you picked Yami who is known for surpassing his limit and creating spells best suited for situatios in most of his battles. Thats how Tsukihima lost against Byakuya, thats how he loses here again.


Yami FRA
Click to expand...
Well you do have a point here. Yami FRA.
 
Arnold is unaware seemingly that Tsukishima can insert himself into more than just Yami. Tsukishima can cut the surrounding environment giving himself by far the environmental advantage, setting up traps as he so pleases. He could cut the ground and make a timed trap that shoots up to either knock Yami off balance or force Yami to move his position to evade. Tsukishima is eventually just going to cut Yami and obliterate that man.
 
Deceived said:
And Arnold not addressing the fact that Yami doesn't pull with using those two abilities in the very beginning of a fight as shown with Dante and Lucifero.
Click to expand...
^
9cCwdOr.jpg


Tsuki fra, Yami’s side seems to need to create some out-of-character scenarios as if Yami’s precog is Yhwach’s almighty where he is going to see Tsuki’s future moves and smh decide to use condensed mana zone or Death Thrust in the first second of the fight
 
YukaSama4 said:
^
9cCwdOr.jpg


Tsuki fra, Yami’s side seems to need to create some out-of-character scenarios as if Yami’s precog is Yhwach’s almighty where he is going to see Tsuki’s future moves and smh decide to use condensed mana zone or Death Thrust in the first second of the fight
Click to expand...
He just cuts him once and completely decimates his mind and memories for a win lmao. He’s done that in all his fights in this arc except for two (for specific plot reasons). I literally haven’t seen a counter to madness, memory, or mind manip from Tsukishima at all.
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
Alright, even though Yami does not need Ki to win this I want to correct a few things wrong here. I know Bringer Light negs Ki here. I was arguing that Yami can use Ki before bringer light is used. Yami can still predict mere movements before he actually moves. He will know the direction he wants to go with BL before he actually uses BL. Nobody is arguing that it works when BL is used. It just works beforehand. Ki is precognition and not "analytical prediction", there is no way deducing the location of teleportation is an "analytical prediction" feat. Neither is blocking danmaku-style attacks without looking and taking any damage. Yami is capable of doing both simultaneously anyway. Why does BL even limited resistance if it just makes him harder to sense? you people make it seem like it is impossible to sense
Click to expand...
Ki sensing doesn't have "precognition" in the sense of Yami being able to see into the future of things, what his precog allows him to do is predict the future movements of his opponents through sensing their Ki.

This is directly explained to use in the manga within Chapter 48, Page 4.

0048-004.png


"I read that Ki, Predicted his next move, then made my own"

What me and the other bleach debaters are trying to explain to you is that Yami's Ki sensing isn't so great that he can see into the exact future, understanding everything that'll happen in that future and create counter measures based of that exact future, he'll only be able to try and predict Tsukishima's future movements which aren't something that's set in stone and said future movements would **** over Yami's ability to sense Tsukishima.

The fact that Yami's "precognition" relies on his Ki sensing which would inherently be messed with by Tsukishima's current and future movements with Bringer Light would mean Yami's predictions of his future movements wouldn't be 100% true, which could cause Yami to get cut by an unpredictable attack from Tsukishima.

Also no one is acting like it makes Bringer Light completely nullifies sensing abilities, don't strawman the positions/arguments the Bleach debaters have been using in this debate.

What we've been saying is since Yami's precog relies on his Ki sensing, which is something that Bringer Light can greatly nullify, Tsukishima's movements wouldn't be easily sensible by Yami via his Ki sensing, which in turn would allow Tsukishima to cut Yami and activate the effects of BOTE before Yami activates Condensed Mana Zone and Iai Slash or Death Thrust.

That's it.

Arnoldstone18 said:
Since Bringer Light doesn't make the man invisible and it's just an FTE speed boost, Yami literally doesn't need to use Ki even though he can before BL is used. All Yami needs to do is to use a condensed Mana Zone to keep up with Bringer Light and blitz him with Death Thrust. depending on how much Yami condenses his Mana Zone it allows him to move at FTE speeds to match BL and surpass it.
Click to expand...
🗿

Yami would get cut before he uses either Condensed Mana Zone and Iai Slash or Death Thrust, these aren't go to abilities for Yami when the fight starts, he uses these abilities after regularly clashing with his opponents or after using some of his more basic abilities like dimensional slash as shown in his fights against Dante and Lucifero.

You have to address this argument Arnold, you can't keep ignoring it like you have been in the past posts.

Arnoldstone18 said:
Book of the ends needs to cut Yami for its weird shit to work. Yami won't let that happen and would just incorperate his Iai Slash and Death Thrust. However, if you manage to pull some bullshit that makes it possible for Tsukihima to somehow strike Yami even with regular Mana Zone active. Then Yami simply surpasses his limit and beats him. When Yami surpasses his limit he creates spells that are stronger than before and spells that are best fitted for the situation. Book of the end does not work on abilities never shown in the past so like @LIFE_OF_KING puts it earlier. If Death Thrust blitzing does not work the way it is supposed to, then Yami simply surpasses his limit. Of all people you picked Yami who is known for surpassing his limit and creating spells best suited for situatios in most of his battles. Thats how Tsukihima lost against Byakuya, thats how he loses here again.
Click to expand...
It doesn't matter if he would or wouldn't let that happen, he's getting cut regardless, he also doesn't use Iai Slash or Death Thrust instantly in a fight, can't believe i got to constantly tell you this.


Yeah... no that's complete and under bullshit, Yami isn't surpassing his limits to somehow create a spell that for someone reason Tsukishima couldn't dodge with Bringer Light, also don't forget that Tsukishima would sense the build up of magic within Yami since he has Information Analysis via Reiraku so even if Yami creates a new attack on the fly Tsukishima would sense this attack forming and such would act accordingly towards it, but the main point is why would Tsukishima even let Yami get the chance to do such a thing when he doesn't even do that in-character? the Byakuya example has heavy plot contexts behind it which is why he didn't instantly go for mind crushing Byakuya into oblivion, he didn't want to do that but instead he wanted to toy around with Byakuya after Byakuya called him a coward because of the way he fights against his opponents.

He would just completely destroy Yami's mind before he could go Garou mode and adapt gg's him.

Basically the argument for Tsukishima is that he'll get off BOTE's effects before Yami uses his Condensed Mana Zone an Iai Slash or Death Thrust, this would be helped by the fact Bringer Light would greatly nullify Yami's sensing capabilities through its own inherent effect, compounding on top of that Bringer Light allows someone to go FTE to people who are equal in speed means it's extremely hard for Yami to react towards such an attack, especially since Tsukishima's spams Bringer Light.

This spam would allow Tsukishima to get off a singular cut on Yami, which at the point basically gives Tsukishima the W since Yami can't deal with mind crush or Tsukishima turning Yami into his friend, family member or lover.

(Also Yami's profile doesn't even have any form of Reactive Evolution on it to let everyone know, so idk were this "Yami adapts gg" shit comes from)

Arnoldstone18 said:
Yami FRA
Click to expand...
Tsukishima FRA
 
Last edited:
I havent read anything you guys said since i dropped that last night, now i have a headache.

Is there a scan for this? there is scan for everything else but this.

Limited Resistance to Extrasensory Perception when using Bringer Light (Using Bringer Light makes the user harder to sense)

Although Yami can use ki to predict his next movement before using briger light, and intentions. I still want to see what makes Bringer Light "hard" to sense and why enhaning Ki isnt negging this limited resistance even though it just makes it hard not impossible.

Oh and trying to discredit Ki sensing as too weak of a precognitive ability is baffling. As far as I know Ki is used to keep up with FTE speeds as shown against Patri and Rhya at the time. But right now all i care about is seeing where this resistance is coming from while i read what you guys have said so far.
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
I havent read anything you guys said since i dropped that last night, now i have a headache.

Is there a scan for this? there is scan for everything else but this.

Limited Resistance to Extrasensory Perception when using Bringer Light (Using Bringer Light makes the user harder to sense)
Click to expand...
Link

Arnoldstone18 said:
Although Yami can use ki to predict his next movement before using briger light, and intentions. I still want to see what makes Bringer Light "hard" to sense and why enhaning Ki isnt negging this limited resistance even though it just makes it hard not impossible.

Oh and trying to discredit Ki sensing as too weak of a precognitive ability is baffling. As far as I know Ki is used to keep up with FTE speeds as shown against Patri and Rhya at the time. But right now all i care about is seeing where this resistance is coming from while i read what you guys have said so far.
Click to expand...
Already addressed these concerns above in my mega post.
 
He will also know Yami's weaknesses like he knew byakuya's safe zone with his bankai. Kinda maybe like how long it takes for Yami to sense ki or how long it takes for him to condense his mana zone for death thrust or Yami's inherent weaknesses etc. He would just need one hit and could mind **** Yami into believing Tsukishima is the one who helped him train to use dark magic as good as he does or even make Yami think his already established fighting style is useless since Tsukishima already knows it which will just make Yami "surpass his limits" when in reality he just goes and makes new spells, sadly those new spells still end up with having to deal with Yami's weakness anyway. Meanwhile Tsukishima needs one cut to his neck and its gg.
 
... Am kinda on the fence now, tbh. Tsukishima needing one hit to find out everything about Yami and/or mindfuck him seems like a good win-con. Yami's stuff also seems like a good win-con to me as well. So I kinda don't know who to vote for now, and thus, I retract my vote for Yami, for now.
 
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