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Sayaka Miki vs Guts

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The skyscraper only crushed her leg though right? A skyscraper has 80% hollowness and i can almost gurantee it didn't hit her hand otherwise her hand should be broken too. Is there an example of them tanking an explosion or something? The aoe from that, implying it's enough to hurt the rest of their body to a decent extent while the gem is completely fine could work.
 
Uh... no, a the skyscraper was so big it slammed her entire body and the entire building behind her.
 
Yes yet they're still hollow though, of course she took damage and yeah she got slammed into another building yet to say the entirety of it was put on her or her hand/soul gem is a stretch, if I recall her keg was crushed her head was bloody but her hands and abdomen seemed fine. It's assumptions at that point and even some evidence exists for the contrary hence why if there's tanking an explosion that should be sufficient since ya can't exactly block something that covers your entire body that or an explicit scene or a statement. I've seen the anime but I'm aware there's games and manga so there has to be something else that's undebatable.
 
You, do know that she was right in the middle of the path of the skyscraper? It is quite literally impossible that she wouldn't have been hit including her hand.
 
Yeah and i even went back to check said scene but youre implying a full 45 tons of tnt was exerted on her soul gem/hand. That's not the case in fact it actually knocked her flying through things no less so chances are... Anyway what about the rest of my post, that only covers about half of it.
 
I get that, but its supposed to show that her soul gem can tank the same amount of damage as Homura's body can. As for the flying thing, we only see that happen after half the building had already collided with her.

Couldn't you just make the same argument with the explosion? How is this any different?
 
Because an explosion would cover everything, I can't debate that, its AOE would not only completely cover her body and then some, she's obviously not gonna put her hand in her pocket and call it a day or someone like Mami ain't gonna instinctively protect her hairpin. An explosion is obviously gonna hit the gem too and if the explosion causes substantial damage to the body yet the gem is fine? I'll concede or if there's an instance where the gem us shown taking a hit from something worth it's salt that should be fine too.
 
"completely cover her body and then some"

is the front of the body (which should include her hand) not comparable, at least in this case?
 
There's a chance of course but consudering she's immediately ragdolled back by the force of the building it's just as likely that's not the case.
 
As I pointed out earlier, she was ragdolled after nearly half of the building had already been destroyed by the collision, so she had to have stood the initial floors directly.
 
Yes but whos to say it even touched her soul gem? Its not like she held her hand out to take the brunt of the force and even if she held her arms up to guard her shield would likely prevent a good chunk of debris from hitting her hand anyway.
 
She pretty much went trough all the skyscraper being ragdolled. Hard for the soul gem to not be hit at all. Also a reminder that we saw Soul Gems only being broken by magical girls and never from regular weaponry or similar
 
She actually did.

Also she wanted to use her shield to time stop, not as a defensive method in this case so that wouldn't happen, not to mention her hand is nearly at the same place as her shield, so it should still take a big blow.

Screenshot 2017-08-17 at 22.55.49
 
Yeah but to say it took the entirety of the 45 tons and for the entire duration? Nah, gonna need a bit more. And Kaltias, that honestly shouldn't matter, Dragon Slayer sure ain't normal and even then, saying Soul Gems only being broken by magical girls and never from regular weaponry or similar is a huge NLF.
 
Wot.

My point was that they where only broken by people who are at the very least 8-B. Not that only magical girls can break them.

Also you don't need to tank an attack for multiple seconds for it to be durability
 
Obviously not, but surface area and all that is a thing plus ya mentioned the weaponry part, it was my understanding that you were implying Guts' weapons would be ineffective, if I misunderstood then sorry.
 
We never take surface area into account while calculating dura tho
 
Why not? If someone tanked the outskirts of an explosion it obviously wouldn't be the same as tanking it point blank. In fact I'm pretty sure the explosion calc page actually mentions that, not sure why it would be different otherwise.
 
We don't do it for KE calcs because calculating the way the KE would disperse is a pain. Not to mention that i'm pretty sure that Homura tanked all of it or the skyscraper would have decelerated instantly
 
I don't man, that seems really sketchy. But surely there's something else, and ya mentioned magical girls breaking soul gems, ignoring Kyoko, who else did so?
 
Madoka when she destroyed Mami's soul gem, Mami during the Different Story when she destroyed her own and Homura when she destroyed Madoka's in a flashback
 
Yes. But Madoka wasn't transformed, and she had just took a massive beatdown from Walpurgisnacht to the point where she was dying. So not exactly at her strongest
 
Btw the skyscraper managed to hit both Homura's head and hers legs so she most likely took it with the entirety of the body
 
Well let me ask this? Did the soul gem look fine prior to being shot? Because if so that means any argument of the soul gems look unscathed are moot, for all I know the Sayaka or Homura examples above could have the gems be at the breaking point despite looking fine and even a slight bit if trauma could cause them to shatter.
 
Soul gem looked fine but it was corrupted.

Also why this makes the argument moot exactly? It doesn't invalidate the fact that they tanked attacks... Also Sayaka wasn't definitely at her breaking point because she could keep fighting for a day or two
 
Not Sayaka's breaking point, the gem's breaking point. If Homura, one of the weakest magical girls can shatter a gem of one of the stronger girls despite it looking fine than who's to say the other ones are fine despite it looking so? Or maybe they're frail enough to where Homura can do it anyway?
 
Homura's AP is still> than Guts's AP. Also it just means that you can't tell just by looking at it, not that they aren't 8-B
 
Homura's AP is actually almost identical to Guts last I checked, they're both in the 40-45 ton range no? So if Homura can do it easily then so can Guts. And that's extremely sketchy man, either they show damage or if they dont show damage i can claim that building being thrown could have put the gem's integrity at the breaking point and i could very well be right. And is there anything that implies they dont take visible damage then sudden they pop like a balloon? if not than im to assume it's not the case which means Homura>a gem quite easily because why would i assume they dont show damage?
 
And im not arguing the gems are so frail anything can break them, im currently arguing if Homura can shatter one quite easily, saud gem being from a stronger magical girl, than so can Guts and if they dont show visible damage than in every other scene they could very well be at their breaking point
 
Homura can do it easily to someone heavily weakened. But fine, i'll concede the point about the Soul Gem's durability.

Sayaka still takes this relatively easily thanks to the AP advantage, equal stamina, borderline instant regen, life absorption and invisibility (thouh i'm not completely sure where this comes from).
 
And yet Guts just needs one good hit and he can easily block her attacks with Dragon Slayer and stuff like sleep gets noped when the armor takes over since it's no longer Guts himself fighting unless he has outside help. Even if Guts dies he'd likely end up taking out the gem first before succumbing to his (probably severe) wounds. If this was Homura or Mami I can see Guts not hitting the gem but Sayaka has it in a spot That's bound to get hit.
 
I'm pretty sure that the armor doen't work if you are dead for good. Also Guts need a good hit on a very specific point that he doesn't know of. Sayaka needs a hit on just about every part because she would basically pulverize said part. Also doesn't Berserker Guts almost avoid blocking to attack more?
 
The armor will work untill ya bleed out every last drop, decap will probably neg that though but he could block. And so? One swing from the Dragon Slayer will be hitting most of her body, the chances of it being collateral is relatively high. He avoids things he can since he tends to blitz opponents, he has blocked attacks before using the Dragon Slayer when in the armor. Plus there's his cannon, fires that up close (which he has done in the armor before, even when feral) she can't block it, it's an explosion, ya can't really block an explosion.
 
Can't block a miniature typhoon either. Also as big as Dragonslayer is, it's still a sword. He won't use it to pummel her into a bloody paste, he would try to slice her. In which case it would just cut trough her body like this. Also she kept fighting for a week or so without the Soul Gem being destroyed. So since i conceded the point about the durability, this means that she was able to prevent it from being hit during all this time. She ain't being killed with the very first strike
 
>won't use it to pummel. I'm actually not so sure on that one but regardless. And then there's the cannon, ya can't block an explosion and if he uses it up close? That's gonna be hard to dodge especially since him Firing it out of his arm will be a surprise. Also coincidently, the scans ya showed have him slicing right where her gem is located.
 
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