Satoru Gojo VS Reinhard Van Astrea PART 2 (3-8-3)

[Arkenis]

Floral lenguage.

Its accepted on the page so, unless u wanna make a crt then this isn't an argument for this match.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

funny, the author: "Reinhard cut the world itself" sound familiar right

No, because functionally it doesn’t target existences.

why was it debunked ?

Because it countered all your points.

 

[Arkenis]

...so, is that a yes or no?

Yeah.

 

[Passersby]

Yeah.

so it's not a regular space slash then

if that's the case then yeah, reinhard wins

 

[Fezzih_007]

Its accepted on the page so, unless u wanna make a crt then this isn't an argument for this match.

Wow, someone use the argument i use all the time against me.

Not that a good response to what i said anyway.
Because the Scan is still not refering to the world itself.

 

[Arkenis]

Because the Scan is still not refering to the world itself.

It says "and along the arc of his sword, the world... slid" "the slide in the world was repaired" "the sword saint had both ended the world and simultaneously brought about it's re-creation"

This is the slash targeting the world. If this isn't talking about the world then what was cut?

 

[Zabazab]

I think spatial slashes being referred to as 'cutting the world itself' may just be common phrasing, since this is similarly used for Reinhard's slashes as seen here:

Against Julius, who had gambled and unveiled the secret ritual, Reid Astrea’s actions were terribly simple.

To swing down the sword he had swung up, a deed of sword strikes likely repeated the most in this world―― it obliquely bisected the world, becoming a light which wrecked all in its path to ruin.

Neither a special magic, nor a special move.

With a mere swing of the sword, the world was scorched by light. Impossible to understand. - Arc 6 Chapter 85 "Good Loser"
...
Simultaneously, since he also possessed the emotions enunciating this was how things must be overflowing within his chest, he found his own self to be irredeemable as well.

With a swing of the sword, the world fissured.

That, was the special move of the Sword Saint which transpired when Reinhard swung the sword as well. - Arc 6 Chapter 85 "Good Loser"

Furthermore, Sukuna's targetting "the world" stuff isn't even on his or Gojo's profile. Based purely on Gojo's profile it seems that he just brings Zeno's paradox that motion isn't real into reality by making space infinitely divisible such that nothing can ever approach the destination that is Gojo, just as infinite divisions of distance means the hare can never surpass the tortoise.

A slash that cuts space itself doesn't use space as a medium for travel (or it wouldn't be cut), therefore it would not be subject to the infinite division of space.

 

[Phoenks]

So like, can Reinhard cut or not? This would invalidate some of his votes.

Debatable.. that's the entire reason there's votes on both sides.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Reinhard has the same exact statement of cutting the world as Sukuna and I dont see how that is any different at all

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

reinhard FRA

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

He manipulates curse energy at an atomic level to control space. Idk what makes this sound like sr.

Do you think he give atoms around him some kind of spacial properties ?

 

[Arkenis]

Do you think he give atoms around him some kind of spacial properties ?

No he manipulates curse energy at an atomic level to control space.

 

[Passersby]

Reinhard has the same exact statement of cutting the world as Sukuna and I dont see how that is any different at all

you just have to read both of the statements to know they both mean 2 completely different things th

A slash that cuts space itself doesn't use space as a medium for travel (or it wouldn't be cut), therefore it would not be subject to the infinite division of space.

It would be however subject to the infinite distance/space separating th 2, the slash needs to have sufficient range to slash the infinite space separating them then reach gojo

 

[Zabazab]

It would be however subject to the infinite distance/space separating th 2, the slash needs to have sufficient range to slash the infinite space separating them then reach gojo

The space is not infinite- there is infinite divisions within a finite space that normally must be travelled through to reach Gojo as everything usually travels through space. A slash that cuts space does not travel through space as a medium.

As Phoenks pointed out, it's akin to there being infinite points on a finite sheet of paper, but if one uses scissors to cut that sheet of paper, the infinite points need not be travelled through.

 

[Phoenks]

 

[Arkenis]

This looked fun so I did one myself lol.

Gojo loses basically.

 

[Passersby]

The space is not infinite- there is infinite divisions within a finite space that normally must be travelled through to reach Gojo as everything usually travels through space. A slash that cuts space does not travel through space as a medium.

As Phoenks pointed out, it's akin to there being infinite points on a finite sheet of paper, but if one uses scissors to cut that sheet of paper, the infinite points need not be travelled through.

the finite distance is not an infinite amount of space, but it contains an infinite number of spaces

The reason your proposition doesn't work is because we can sum an infinite number of things and still get a finite number.
I bleive Gojo's ability doesn't work like that?

If it did attacks wouldn't stop before they reach him as you can move through an infinite number of points in space and still only move a finite distance, from what I understood he manifests an infinite distance between him and the attack so it wouldn't reach, basically the paper is infinite in size and the scissors aren't


This is getting confusing really but bleive I understand the ability a bit more now

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

so to put it simply: infinity is space,, the slash cuts space, infinity and all inside gets cut.

 

[Passersby]

so to put it simply: infinity is space,, the slash cuts space, infinity and all inside gets cut.

If it was that simple we wouldn't have 2 pages with of discussions

Why do people simplify infinity as a simple space barrier

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

If it was that simple we wouldn't have 2 pages with of discussions

Why do people simplify infinity as a simple space barrier

probably because thats what his feats implies

 

[Passersby]

probably because thats what his feats implies

the description of the ability implies something entirely different satella, don't catch on straws

 

[Zabazab]

If it did attacks wouldn't stop before they reach him as you can move through an infinite number of points in space and still only move a finite distance, from what I understood he manifests an infinite distance between him and the attack so it wouldn't reach, basically the paper is infinite in size and the scissors aren't

The manga gives the best explanation of Infinity by likening it to Zeno's paradoxes: As distance is divided into infinite fractions, objects approaching Gojo slow down endlessly to the point where all motion effectively stops. That's the crux of the paradox- that motion is actually impossible. Gojo's technique simply manipulates space to make that paradox a reality.

 

[Passersby]

The manga gives the best explanation of Infinity by likening it to Zeno's paradoxes: As distance is divided into infinite fractions, objects approaching Gojo slow down endlessly to the point where all motion effectively stops.

...i still don't get it, me you and everyone else can move an infinite ammount of space points in a limited space with no problems, i can only see gojo's ability as something that expands on those infinite points and creates an infinite distance btw the attack and gojo since they effectivle need to cross a infinite distance so they seem frozen


in order for infinity to work as shown, it needs to either slow down any and all attacks or simply widen the distance between the attacks and gojo himself so much so they can't cross the distance at all so they seem frozen

can you link the explanation?
that would probably help end this discussion

 

[Spilxson2]

Has this reached grace already?

 

[Fezzih_007]

Has this reached grace already?

Not yet.

 

[Zabazab]

can you link the explanation?
that would probably help end this discussion

Here's an explanation of Zeno's paradox, the way people tried to disprove it with maths, and how it can be disproved with physics. Gojo just makes this paradox a reality.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

This looked fun so I did one myself lol.

Gojo loses basically.

Peak debating here lol.

I remember trying to figure out Zeno's paradox cause a VN character I made had the ability, and DontTalk? Showed up and explained it to me.

Anyway Reinhard fra.

 

[Passersby]

Here's an explanation of Zeno's paradox, the way people tried to disprove it with maths, and how it can be disproved with physics. Gojo just makes this paradox a reality.

...that doesn't solve anything, altough thank you for linking an article about the paradox, much appreciated


my question was if all gojo's technique does is divide space into an infinite number of spacial points then why can't attack pass trough it like we always do?
since it doesn't do anything then, or does it "divide" those spaces?
as in make them seperate entities, seperate "spaces" that you need to cross spereating gojo from what's outside them?
does it "seperate" an infinite ammount of space point in a finite space each smaller than the other so you can only touch the outermost space point and not the infinite others since they're seperate?

if that's the case what guarantees that reinhardt can slash all of them at once?
since the spaces are now sperated by "something" or "nothing" ig, can he slash that?

...how about we all just vote incon?

this is getting nowehere

 

[Fezzih_007]

I don't think Reinhard would result to nuking Gojo for no reason anyway.

 

[Phoenks]

Thread concluded. This can be added and closed.

 

[Passersby]

Thread concluded. This can be added and closed.

does it work like that?

isn't there some 48 hours grace periode or is that only for CRTs

 

[Phoenks]

does it work like that?

isn't there some 48 hours grace periode or is that only for CRTs

CRTs only. Grace for vs matches is 24 hours.

 

[Passersby]

CRTs only. Grace for vs matches is 24 hours.

aight, thanks for the info

still have no idea how infinity works tho

 

[Zabazab]

my question was if all gojo's technique does is divide space into an infinite number of spacial points then why can't attack pass trough it like we always do?

Because Gojo's Limitless manipulates space to function as it does in Zeno's paradox, rather than how it functions normally. I'm really not sure what you're stuck on at this point...

I don't think Reinhard would result to nuking Gojo for no reason anyway.

His EE nuke != His spatial slash. His space slashing is just from any time he chooses to seriously swing a sword.

Anyways 24 hours done I guess. It is what it is.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Whatever, we gonna do a part 3 of this match anyway in december.
Or sooner, maybe

 

[Phoenks]

Whatever, we gonna do a part 3 of this match anyway in december.
Or sooner, maybe

lmfao why?? nothing will change.

 

[Passersby]

Because Gojo's Limitless manipulates space to function as it does in Zeno's paradox, rather than how it functions normally.

i'm stuck on how does space in zeno's paradox function and how is it different from how actual space, since you treate those 2 as completely different

oh well

 

[Zabazab]

i'm stuck on how does space in zeno's paradox function and how is it different from how actual space, since you treate those 2 as completely different

In Zeno's paradox, motion is impossible as you need to cross an infinite number of fractional distances to reach your destination.

In reality though, the relationship between distance, velocity, and time solve this.

This is the resolution of the classical “Zeno’s paradox” as commonly stated: the reason objects can move from one location to another (i.e., travel a finite distance) in a finite amount of time is because their velocities are not only always finite, but because they do not change in time unless acted upon by an outside force. If you take a person like Atalanta moving at a constant speed, she will cover any distance in an amount of time put forth by the equation that relates distance to velocity.

 

[Passersby]

In Zeno's paradox, motion is impossible as you need to cross an infinite number of fractional distances to reach your destination.

In reality though, the relationship between distance, velocity, and time solve this.

...my friend, we very much all need to cross an infinite number of fractional distances to reach our destinations, that's an objective truth that we experience evryday, what you offered was the explanation how we do so

it seems like you're confused over this, what zeno's paradox explained was how motion in our reality should be impossible, which was explained to be possible via what you provided, space is still the same in both scenarios and motion in zeno's pradox is still possible because we can in fact move trough an infinite of fractional distances and still move trough a finite space in a finite time

even if gojo didn't have the infinity you still need to cross an infinite number of space points to reach him, that's why i'm confused over what the ability actually does to stop any and all incoming attacks from reaching him

 

[Zabazab]

motion in zeno's pradox is still possible

There's the issue in your thought process. Motion is not possible in Zeno's paradox. That's the entire point of the paradox- that logically, motion should be impossible. The infinite fractions of distance must be travelled through in order to to go anywhere, therefore it'd take infinite time to go anywhere, and thus we should go nowhere.

This obviously isn't true as motion is possible, but Limitless makes it true and applies this Infinity to the space surrounding Gojo.