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Hey, apologies for the delay, but here's an image that helps substantiate the fear and soul hax stuff.
This statement is directly referring to the fear manipulation, and specifically referring to it digging into Beryl's soul.
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Routine Hax Buff - DMC
- Thread starter GilverTheProtoAngelo
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This statement is directly referring to the fear manipulation, and specifically referring to it digging into Beryl's soul.
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I'll also note, I find this persuasive. I was fine with the abilities at a glance but I didn't give them as thorough of a consideration as perhaps I should have, because I am not terribly familiar with how those abilities are typically assigned. So I am now neutral on those pending the outcome of DG's inquiry.
Palito266
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After having read the thread and saw arguments from both sides, i can concur a more solid answer now.
Clarividence seems fine, but as others pointed out, Causality Hax and BFR lack context, as it seems to be refering to Clarividence.
Disagree on Soul Hax via Fear Hax FRA. It seems to be refering to the spirit of will and not actually your actual-actual soul, it doesn't matter if the series refers to the word as souls literally, we need to look at the context separately and not do a generalization. [Now i kind of agree because of a new scan i forgot about lol]
Info Analysis for Gilver seems more like Info Manip since he's directly absorbing the information out of the weapon. This also could explain how Dante gains insane knowledge of every weapon he gets a hold of it, like Gilver.
Reactive Evolution for Sparda Kin is fine by me. This "higher magnitude" refers to the inky void Dante is in at that moment, which is the Nexus that is overriding the Human World, and where Gilver and Dante have their fight. Narration even goes as far as telling us that the presence is the same as the Oz Club and Sanatorium (other Nexus that Dante went into) but that the atmosphere was a magnitude higher, which would suffice for RE and 2 Layered Resistance.
Info Analysis for Dante feels like an Intelligence Feat rather than Info Analysis, since he already know what the DW looks like (DMC 3, DMC Novel and DMC 1) and he already has a lot of experience with these wacky effects. Sensing seems fine.
Further Analytical Prediction is fine.
Void Resistance for Dante is a nope, since the destruction of said Void shouldn't be something that could harm Dante since a void is something non-existent, it can't hurt you unless it's specified.
Neutral on Yamato shenanigans.
Disagree on Void Manipulation for Mundus. We don't know if Mundus's attacks were literally made out of void or anything like that, it even says Mundus summons swords, arrows and lightnings. I honestly don't think those attacks were made out of void since it's never specified.
Clarividence seems fine, but as others pointed out, Causality Hax and BFR lack context, as it seems to be refering to Clarividence.
Disagree on Soul Hax via Fear Hax FRA. It seems to be refering to the spirit of will and not actually your actual-actual soul, it doesn't matter if the series refers to the word as souls literally, we need to look at the context separately and not do a generalization. [Now i kind of agree because of a new scan i forgot about lol]
Info Analysis for Gilver seems more like Info Manip since he's directly absorbing the information out of the weapon. This also could explain how Dante gains insane knowledge of every weapon he gets a hold of it, like Gilver.
Reactive Evolution for Sparda Kin is fine by me. This "higher magnitude" refers to the inky void Dante is in at that moment, which is the Nexus that is overriding the Human World, and where Gilver and Dante have their fight. Narration even goes as far as telling us that the presence is the same as the Oz Club and Sanatorium (other Nexus that Dante went into) but that the atmosphere was a magnitude higher, which would suffice for RE and 2 Layered Resistance.
Info Analysis for Dante feels like an Intelligence Feat rather than Info Analysis, since he already know what the DW looks like (DMC 3, DMC Novel and DMC 1) and he already has a lot of experience with these wacky effects. Sensing seems fine.
Further Analytical Prediction is fine.
Void Resistance for Dante is a nope, since the destruction of said Void shouldn't be something that could harm Dante since a void is something non-existent, it can't hurt you unless it's specified.
Neutral on Yamato shenanigans.
Disagree on Void Manipulation for Mundus. We don't know if Mundus's attacks were literally made out of void or anything like that, it even says Mundus summons swords, arrows and lightnings. I honestly don't think those attacks were made out of void since it's never specified.
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Don’t understand the hurry,we should wait for more staff to get their input in the matter, since we ain’t rushing anything.
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I don’t see the reason to not wait for more stuff to give their input on the matter, more staff input will surely be better to get the most accurate result.
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Yeah, we are unnecessarily rushing things, more staff were already asked to reply here
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The reason is that this already has sufficient staff input. We don't keep threads open indefinitely waiting for more and more staff input. Four is sufficient to conclude a thread, and no one has commented here in several days, it isn't being rushed.
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No? Planck and glassman agreed on most of not all abilities ( glass is not sure about the void stuff) so no there are 2 agrees with most of the stuff that were in the thread too.
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4-2 is probably sufficient on those matters, but at least one more staff opinion would be nice if only because it could also clear up the current 3-2 vote.
Being 100+ messages in isn't exactly a "rush", also. Most threads experience multiple stages of hibernation, I think wanting a reasonable end time is sensible.
Being 100+ messages in isn't exactly a "rush", also. Most threads experience multiple stages of hibernation, I think wanting a reasonable end time is sensible.
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Sorry for late reply fellow members, thanks for your patience, I was just caught up in irl stuff and the Hypertimeline shenanigans on forrum here. Now I have time to clarify all Grath's doubts.
Smh I should have included the entire novel page, i left out a crucial detail.
Note how Ducas' yacht was swallowed up and spat back out by the weather. Courtesy of Beastheads. Chen notes this himself with the "plucking" statement and how distant events can be brought to oneself.
That's my argument for Causality Hax, manipulation of events non-physically and esoterically counts as causality hax.
The entire Imgur post again, for your convenience.
I have added more scans for support in same imgur post.
For context these DW invasion event happens 3 times in novel.
First time Tony encounters a schism of DW (Oz Club), he is assailed by cancerous energy of DW. But in short span he grows accustomed to the energy, adapts and fight unaffected. Which we have already indexed.
2nd time Tony encounters another pocket of DW invading HW, it's in a mental asylum. which is what I gave scan of above. Tony notes the rotten energy is a magnitude stronger than the one he had experienced at Oz Club, where he had adapted and faught normally. This is a clear case of resistance overcame by more potent hax. In same location after short time Tony again recovers and evolves spectacularly to survive the cancerous energy.
3rd time was Dante vs Gilver at end of Novel, where Gilver spawned entire Nexus of DW, which was rewriting HW and replacing it with a new DW. Again he is affected by this stronger energy but adapts nevertheless even more glamourously. All this we have also indexed.
We never bothered with 2nd encounter untill now because we have found a direct statement of difference of power between the first two pockets of DW, which helps us in layering.
After sometime he does find someone to interrogate, and he confirms his assessment like a good detective before forming a definitive conclusion.
Being able to deduce you are in alternate timeline via just esoteric senses and little clues is definitely an info analysis feat.
2) The proposal was that Dante figured out mental/psychic powers were being used to destroy bullets via sensing and analyzing Ducas and his aura, this is an exception because 99% of the time supernatural powers are some application of demonic energy. This is a rare and out of norm application of pure psychic power rarely depicted before in series. The fact that Dante notes this so correctly is worth noting. Demonic energy does have soul/mind effects, but Ducas uses psychic powers specifically.
Thus I thought this warranted a info analysis feat.
We have similar feats indexed of many characters as information analysis, for example :- https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Sherlock_Holmes_(2009_Movie)
You don't need to absorb literal information for info analysis. It can be a case of intelligent observation and deduction skill, which is what I am arguing for Dante.
vsbattles.fandom.com
So I was wondering if there was more to the scene than just simple power sensing and deduction, since Ducas will be using precognition we were curious how Dante counters, we were correct, there is prediction feats to counter Beasheads precognition.
I know above was a very offhand analogy, but I think it works, void is a completely non physical element made of non existence. Void Mundus can warp and bend his element all kinds of way to attack Dante, among other summoned magical attacks, Dante avoided everything up untill that point, only getting touched by exploding void and then crumble. I do not see how that is anything unimpressive or non-notable.
In fact we do similar stuff for space-time resistance, if some survives unscathed in a place where space-time was getting destroyed and disintegrated that would award a space-time resistance to the survivor. And in this case void is more esoteric then space-time.
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vsbattles.com
""Power Nullification and Summoning for Yamato (Yamato's blade is capable to neutralize demonic/magic powers, like when nullified Credo's powers when he was stabbed in the gut and also when did make Nero powerless when the katana was stabbed on his Devil Bringer and the sword also came to help Vergil when he was a kid)(Accepted)""
vsbattles.fandom.com
Resistances
Power Nullification (Is unaffected by the Yamato when the sword is capable to neutralize demonic/magic powers, like when nullified Credo's powers when he was stabbed in the gut and also when did make Nero powerless when the katana was stabbed on his Devil Bringer) (Accepted)
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People just forgot to add it to the page. I just remembered it, decided to add it know, one extra attached power( resistance neg) pending this CRT.
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Any more questions you have you can ask.
Smh I should have included the entire novel page, i left out a crucial detail.
Note how Ducas' yacht was swallowed up and spat back out by the weather. Courtesy of Beastheads. Chen notes this himself with the "plucking" statement and how distant events can be brought to oneself.
That's my argument for Causality Hax, manipulation of events non-physically and esoterically counts as causality hax.
The entire Imgur post again, for your convenience.
I can understand the evaluation you gave, under default circumstance your deduction is the default assumption. However, I have posted more scans in the imgur post which shows more examples of that spirit = soul is literal, we have multiple feats of aura directly impinging on soul, it's a standard thing in DMC everything is powered from soul and everything affects soul. I have posted more scans to support this, along with official version of translation which depicts sprirt as soul, instead of will power.
I have added more scans for support in same imgur post.
Okay, there's context here. Gilver is an artificial demon from Demon Realm, with very little knowledge of humans and their culture. This the first time he is holding a human gun, the scene is depicting Gilver figuring out how to use the gun by "absorbing information". Which explains why Sparda kin can master weapons with a mere glance. Thus I feel this is not an analogy but literal. If at least application wise even if not process wise. i.e even if you disagree he was actually absorbing abstract information, he definitely did something equivalent to learn it. Later in the novel Gilver uses the gun deceitfuly and expertly to surprise Dante and catch him off guard. So ultimately it is fitting as information analysis.
My mistake again for not giving context, we already have documented feats of evolved resistances for DWE in same novel. The only reason we wanted this is because it helps in layering.
For context these DW invasion event happens 3 times in novel.
First time Tony encounters a schism of DW (Oz Club), he is assailed by cancerous energy of DW. But in short span he grows accustomed to the energy, adapts and fight unaffected. Which we have already indexed.
2nd time Tony encounters another pocket of DW invading HW, it's in a mental asylum. which is what I gave scan of above. Tony notes the rotten energy is a magnitude stronger than the one he had experienced at Oz Club, where he had adapted and faught normally. This is a clear case of resistance overcame by more potent hax. In same location after short time Tony again recovers and evolves spectacularly to survive the cancerous energy.
3rd time was Dante vs Gilver at end of Novel, where Gilver spawned entire Nexus of DW, which was rewriting HW and replacing it with a new DW. Again he is affected by this stronger energy but adapts nevertheless even more glamourously. All this we have also indexed.
We never bothered with 2nd encounter untill now because we have found a direct statement of difference of power between the first two pockets of DW, which helps us in layering.
1) Dante just deduced he was in an alternate timeline just by putting his senses through over drive and studying the environment, in which he notes similarities and differences with some places he had experienced before. Under no circumstance can someone figure they are in alternate timeline just by scanning environment. There are no direct cues or pieces of information that will reveal this to them. Especially if this is first time you have been sent to alternate timeline. Up unstill that point Dante had been in nothing but a cave and a forest. Nothing urban or anything approaching even a living settlement to get information.
After sometime he does find someone to interrogate, and he confirms his assessment like a good detective before forming a definitive conclusion.
Being able to deduce you are in alternate timeline via just esoteric senses and little clues is definitely an info analysis feat.
2) The proposal was that Dante figured out mental/psychic powers were being used to destroy bullets via sensing and analyzing Ducas and his aura, this is an exception because 99% of the time supernatural powers are some application of demonic energy. This is a rare and out of norm application of pure psychic power rarely depicted before in series. The fact that Dante notes this so correctly is worth noting. Demonic energy does have soul/mind effects, but Ducas uses psychic powers specifically.
Thus I thought this warranted a info analysis feat.
We have similar feats indexed of many characters as information analysis, for example :- https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Sherlock_Holmes_(2009_Movie)
You don't need to absorb literal information for info analysis. It can be a case of intelligent observation and deduction skill, which is what I am arguing for Dante.
Information Analysis
Information Analysis, or Scanning, is the ability to gain information on a character or object by analyzing them. A basic analysis can grant only rudimentary data on the target, such as their level of strength, speed, durability, or intelligence, while more powerful analyses can grant extensive...
vsbattles.fandom.com
It's the first para from the same info analysis scan. Usually analytical prediction and skill based info analysis go hand in hand with how characters analyze and predict each other in a face-off. And in given context, Ducas has been doing nothing but constant precognition with help of Beastheads, for example winning gambling games and seeing his own future of death.
So I was wondering if there was more to the scene than just simple power sensing and deduction, since Ducas will be using precognition we were curious how Dante counters, we were correct, there is prediction feats to counter Beasheads precognition.
I didn't understand why Dante needs to be part of the void. Aside from that, let me explain this with an analogy, imagine you were fighting an fire elemental being made of of ... well fire. You have avoided all attacks up untill that point and you inflict a finishing blow upon the elemental whose body explodes in your face and you survive unscathed. Would that not warrant heat/fire resistance?
I know above was a very offhand analogy, but I think it works, void is a completely non physical element made of non existence. Void Mundus can warp and bend his element all kinds of way to attack Dante, among other summoned magical attacks, Dante avoided everything up untill that point, only getting touched by exploding void and then crumble. I do not see how that is anything unimpressive or non-notable.
In fact we do similar stuff for space-time resistance, if some survives unscathed in a place where space-time was getting destroyed and disintegrated that would award a space-time resistance to the survivor. And in this case void is more esoteric then space-time.
Yes actually, conceptual in nature in fact. But it's an uber power, only displayed two times in series. What I am proposing is lesser version. Btw we had already gotten power null part accepted, we were just attaching resistance negation with given context.
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This is the true power of the descendants of Sparda (Devil May Cry)
More Accelerated Development (Passive) type and more Reactive Evolution feats for the Sparda's bloodline: Also keep in mind some of them are the same from the Sparda Heritage page is for organization sake and for us to just copy paste from here to there. (They are capable to gain pretty high...
Yamato (Devil May Cry)
The Yamato is Vergil's trademark dark-forged katana, a legendary sword that was wielded by his father Sparda, when he created it alongside the Rebellion and his own Devil Sword Sparda when the Legendary Dark Knight split his power into 3 pieces, and Sparda named the Yamato as such to embody the...
vsbattles.fandom.com
Power Nullification (Is unaffected by the Yamato when the sword is capable to neutralize demonic/magic powers, like when nullified Credo's powers when he was stabbed in the gut and also when did make Nero powerless when the katana was stabbed on his Devil Bringer) (Accepted)
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People just forgot to add it to the page. I just remembered it, decided to add it know, one extra attached power( resistance neg) pending this CRT.
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Any more questions you have you can ask.
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Gil's assessment looks good at a glance but I'll wait for Grath to go over it.
Edit: I've been told that Grath might be too busy so take this as my agreement for now. She can hop in and correct it whenever she's free.
@DarkGrath @Elizhaa @UchihaSlayer96 @KingTempest
Edit: I've been told that Grath might be too busy so take this as my agreement for now. She can hop in and correct it whenever she's free.
@DarkGrath @Elizhaa @UchihaSlayer96 @KingTempest
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Yes, that is correct. I will be unavailable for the next 3 days. I apologise if this causes any delays. I will gladly give my input when I return if it is still needed.
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I understand, real life.
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Gilver’s arguments look fine except for the void stuff, still not really convinced on that stuff, if Grath still wants to comment I wouldn’t mind waiting for her.
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I am neutral about the void point; the rest seem fine.
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I share the same sentiments as Elizhaa.
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I stand on this too
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