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Possible Pokemon Speed Downgrade.

I don't see where the statement is on the calc that the beam is lightspeed to begin with.

The beam curving is definitely an indicator against lightspeed.
 
Cal told Kep that it was light speed.

There was suppose to be a seperate thread to discuss whether or not its light speed, but the thread was never made.
 
Are the pics provied the only proofs? Because beams "bending" like that can easily just be a visual thing only. I'd need more context.

Regardless, pretty sure that Pokémon dodging light moves (like Solar Beam, Flash Cannon and such) happens quite a lot in the anime, so not sure why this specific feat was used to scale everyone.
 
I actually noticed this on another Pokemon speed thread but forgot to even bring it up.

I don't think can be used because it's bending but I'll wait for the Pokemon people.
 
Ummm, while i do believe that Doom Desire is normally a SOL attack, this instace here could be not considered sol because of how they interpreted the move.

Like Light Screen, that is supposed to be a move that weakens Special Attacks moves, but it is used like an Protect in other medias, but i will wait for more input for now
 
@Saikou Other than the move being said to use sunlight to attack, i'm not sure there is anymore evidence of it being Light Speed.
 
It's old move description was ''"Summons strong sunlight to attack 2 turns later.''" which is why it was considered to be SoL. But if it wasn't light in that instance then that's that.
 
Depends, considering the core games the description came from is the primary canon, and the manga that image is from is secondary (or perhaps tertiary) canon, though I guess that doesn't matter if its only for a manga Poliwrath which uses the feat of dodging the manga Doom Desire which clearly isn't a normal light beam if it curves like that.
 
In the game canon Doom Desires is probably SoL. In the manga it seems to not function that way, so it shouldn't be treated as SoL.
 
https://www.********.tv/video/13-fighting-ire-with-fire

About 30 seconds in, Barry's Empoleon reacts to and blocks Mothim's signal beam.

In most Pokemon games, specifically gen 4 games, its description is "The user attacks with a sinister beam of light."
 
GyroNutz said:
https://www.********.tv/video/13-fighting-ire-with-fire
About 30 seconds in, Barry's Empoleon reacts to and blocks Mothim's signal beam.

In most Pokemon games, specifically gen 4 games, its description is "The user attacks with a sinister beam of light."
Click to expand...
Thats not enough evidence for light speed.
 
It's stated to be light, Pokemon like Ampharos and Volbeat and Illumise all use signal beam from a realistic source of light and Pokemon already has a sub-relavistic feat.
 
Isn't their also dozens of episodes where a Pokemon has reacted to Solar Beam?
 
Having a realistic source for the light is also evidence.

Btw 'far more evidence' is an exaggeration.
 
To clarify, Signal Beam was the signature move of Volbeat before it was distributed as a tutor move. Volbeat being a firefly.
 
Its not an exaggeration at all. The light standards on this wiki are pretty strict. Just being called a beam of light is not enough.
 
I agree that it is not enough on its own, but Signal Beam fits another of the criteria for being SoL.
 
If it is only Doom Desire, IMO, the manga interpretation is not SOL, however, other media, like the games, are problaby SOL
 
I'm not commenting about Doom Desire being SoL or not, but I disagree with using Red's Poliwrath to scale to normal final stages Pokémons.

Though I'm quite sure one can find more than a couple of instances about regular Pokémon dodging light based attacks.
 
Wrath Of Itachi said:
The poliwrath feat. This is the current feat that gives then their Rel speed.
Click to expand...
Then I think discussing alternative speed feats is relevant.
 
Anyway, from what i've seen, everyone here besides Saikou agrees that this Doom Desire in particular is not SOL and it shouldn't be used as a speed feat for third stage mons.
 
Apart from bending, the beam also seems to sink in Poliwrath's stomach. Causing that kind of effect will also go against it being light won't it?
 
Only thing I'll say is games take priority. Manga is based off the games.

Also Solar Beam is literally called a sun beam. I have no idea why it's not LS, especially when it's seen coming from a sun in Gen 6 onwards and GO.
 
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