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Pokémon General Discussion Thread Gen VIII: Dragon keeps editing the title

Oh is that a best of set? Like legendary collection or clash of legends?
 
I was fanboying very hard over that twitter post lol. Exicitng news indeed.

I think we should wait until the actual english translations come out before making any threads, but yeah, welcome to the 4-B club Zygarde.
 
NeoZex6399 said:
NeoZex6399 said:
Should the Lake Trio have some kind of reality manipulation?
"Known as "The Being of Willpower." It sleeps at the bottom of a lake to keep the world in balance."

~Azelf; Pokémon Diamond

"Three beings were born to bind time and space."
"Two make matter, and three make spirit, shaping the world."
"Those three beings I read to mean the three Pokémon of the lakes. It's about Uxie, Mesprit, and Azelf."
"The myth describes how they gave spirit to the world, shaping it."

Balance
Click to expand...
?
Click to expand...
What do you think about this?
 
Enryu The Red Tower said:
Well, it looks like Zygarde 100% defeated Ultra Necrozma with relative ease in this chapter, so Zygarde 100% as 4-B is confirmed? And what are the other Legendaries Pokémon's that scale to Zygarde 100%?
Click to expand...
You sure it's Zygarde that won? Cause at the end Ultra Necrozma exploded or something and made Perfect Zygarde defuse.
 
Peter1129 said:
You sure it's Zygarde that won? Cause at the end Ultra Necrozma exploded or something and made Perfect Zygarde defuse.
Click to expand...
This was after Ultra Necrozma got knocked down by Zygarde's Thousand Waves attack. Perfect Zygarde very likely used up a good amount of it's power when doing that and I guess you could consider Necrozma blowing itself up to be a surprise attack that caught it off guard.
 
Well we know Perfect Zygarde scales to Ultra Necrozma but I just wanted to make sure for certain which of the two was stronger. Cause it seemed like Perfect Zygarde can fight Ultra Necrozma but it seems like it's still overall weaker. So right now the 4-B scaling chain is

Ultra Necrozma > Perfect Zygarde > Dawn Wing/Dusk Mane Necrozma > Base Necrozma > Solgalelo = Lunala > Silvally > Melmetal > Type: Null > Tapus = Ultra Beasts = Zeroara
 
From what I gather here, it seems to take Complete Zygarde most his power to defeat/weaken Ultra Necrozma. Seems like both are pretty even. Just that Zygarde was smart enough to use a near full power attack off the bat.
 
So personally who do you think is stronger? Ultra Necrozma or Perfect Zygarde?

I'm siding with Ultra Necrozma btw.
 
>Zeraora being the weakest

>_<

But anywho, I can't say 100% since the chapter isnt actually out yet, but I still think Perfect Z is at least equal to Ultra Necro. Ultra Necro could have just regained consciousness after being knocked out and just sneak attacked Perfect Z after using up a good amount of his power.
 
Well more like Zeroara along with the Ultra Beasts and Tapus are the weakest of the 4-Bs based on scaling.

I mean nobody said they aren't comparable it's just which one seems to be overall stronger based on this fight. Though I do agree it's better to wait for the full scans.
 
So, Ash has a Low 6-B (Melmetal), has consistently fought Tapu Koko, Zeraora, Guzzlord and other UBs, defeated Nihilego, defeated Sivally and has now succesfully overpowered and blown Guzzlord into a portal with the combined might of Naganadel and Pikachu.

Last time I questioned if Ash would get an upgrade, I was informed that it was an 'outlier' for Ash's Pikachu to battle Guzzlord but at this point it's pretty clear that Ash has consistently fought, and even defeated, pokemon that are considered to be 5-B. Is Ash and his SM team going to be upgraded to 5-B with all of these consistent feats?
 
Well, you can argue that Tapu Koko and Tapu Bulu held back against Ash, but that still brings into question the several 5-Bs that Ash battled.

Zeraora is currntly considered to be 5-B for battling Guzzlord in the anime, but Pikachu was just considered an outlier. At this point, it's clear that it wasn't an outlier. So unless UBs are being downgraded or Zeraora receives a revision, it seems hypocritical to not make SM Ash 5-B.
 
Right...but Zeraora is 5-B for the exact same feat, within the exact same series, within the exact same context? And a Lucario is 2-C, possibly 2-B for knocking a Darkrai out of hypnosis, which was asleep and weakened and hit by an amped Aura Sphere and didn't have any feats to make 2-C other than "Other Darkrai in other universes are 2-C, possibly 2-B'? Or how about Origins Red being 5-B for matching and catching a featless Mewtwo?

This wiki's obsession with outliers is out of control. Either the scaling for UBs and Island Guardians is incorrect or Ash is a 4-B due to most of his team having feats of scaling to 4-B.

  • Pikachu
Defeated Nihilego and contested with Zeraora, Guzzlord and Sivally.

  • Lycanroc
Trained against Tapu Bulu and damaged UBs.

  • Melmetal
Is a mythical that took on Sivally in 1v1 combat.

  • Naganadel
Heavily contributed to blasting Guzzlord into the Ultra Wormhole. Species is only considered 7-A for being 'starters' in another dimension, even though every other UB is considered to be 5-B (soon to be 4-B) and even though nothing indicates being a 'starter' refers to its power not to mention the part where Poipole is stronger than any 2nd stage starter and Naganadel is stronger than any final stage starter.

That's four pokemon that have feats or statements backing them as 4-B on SM Ash's team and Ash has had such feats against 10 different 4-Bs. That's more consistent than most upgrades on this wiki.

If you disagree with 4-B Ash, then you don't actually agree with 5-B or 4-B UBs and Alola Legends.
 
Sooo, been looking around out of curiosity for how people feel about Ash's victory on the Alola League. Surprisingly it's being pretty divisive in several ways. While fans are unanimously are happy that Ash won, many feel the league itself had many issues: that the arc felt anticlimatic, that the rivalry with Gladion felt incomplete, that despite the massive achievement that it meant for Ash it was underplayed as a minor victory for him (characters like Oak and Deliah reacting very little), that the league had a very low entry bar due to Prof. Kukui's mindset of a league for everyone (some even agreeing with Guzma's stance that the league was too friendly to be called a true competition) or how the Guzzlord invasion suddenly happening takes away from Ash' victory spotlight. Also something about Hau's fight being iffy, but I really don't know know about that.

I haven't watched the league but, dude... >_> that's a lot.
 
Not gonna lie, despite it being a league victory, it's really only that in name. It's the most underwhelming league ever, except maybe Hoenn? But Hoenn had more skilled trainers and an actualy entry requirement none the less. Kukui's mindset is inherently flawed, you cant have a league for everyone. The league by definition is to figure out what trainers are the best of the best, who can become a pokemon master, you cant do that if the entire league is filled with youngster joeys and those that had nthing to do that day. Joining the league is a task in and of itself, you need to prove your worth, gather badges from elite traiers and journey the region. Kukui's league is more of a for fun thing then an actual league.
 
Chariot190 said:
Kukui's mindset is inherently flawed, you cant have a league for everyone. The league by definition is to figure out what trainers are the best of the best, who can become a pokemon master, you cant do that if the entire league is filled with youngster joeys and those that had nthing to do that day. Joining the league is a task in and of itself, you need to prove your worth, gather badges from elite traiers and journey the region. Kukui's league is more of a for fun thing then an actual league.
Click to expand...
The problem with this argument is that Alola has no gyms or anything to "prove your worth" besides the Island trials, which not everyone in Alola partakes in. And since when can't you have a league for everyone?

It's like I said before. Realistically, a league in a region has to start somewhere. Did you think the leagues in Kanto - Kalos immediately started out with having high requirements to join it? Of course not. Because if only a select few can enter the league, it will barely get any traction at all and it won't be popular or supported enough to be continued as a national event for the region. You can't compare the Alola league, a NEWLY made league thats basically on a trial run, to other leagues which have been established in their regions for over decades. Especially since Kukui's objective is to make the Alola league well known in Alola, who has never had one and has stuck to its own unique customs for generations. The Alola league will become more and more challenging the more it is done obviously.

Besides, I wouldn't call someone with a Sivally a "youngster joey" whatsoever. Gladion by himself is honestly the most challenging opponent Ash has ever faced on his journey as Gladion's the only character in the anime to use a legendary in the league since the train-wreck we call Tobias. Only this time, Ash was able to actually wi. If you ask me, thats an accomplishment better than anything Ash has done in the previous 6 leagues.
 
Ash beat a Legendary with a Legendary. I mean sure Melmetal lost but he did all the work for Pikachu to deliver the finishing blow.
 
The real cal howard said:
Ash beat a Legendary with a Legendary. I mean sure Melmetal lost but he did all the work for Pikachu to deliver the finishing blow.
Click to expand...
Melmetal did do most of the work, sure, but Sivally was still at the point where it could continue to fight and beating a weakened legendary, a UB level one at that, is still remarkably impressive compared to pretty much any opponent Ash has taken on sans Tobias. I doubt Paul, Alain, or any of Ash's previous rivals would have been able to do anything.

Besides, this match wasn't the first time Ash took on Sivally in battle either y'know.
 
The latter im unsure of, the former yes but he lost kind of quickly. The only thing his Charizard could do was cut through a part of Groudon's precicipice blades with dragon claw and dodge its attacks.

Groudon quickly knocked it out with a part of the move.
 
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