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Minor revision towards resisting destruction energy

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AwkguyDB said:
Then you need to look into why those profiles are the exception I see no difference here
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I never said it was different. I'm saying that using the logic of one verse got it so yeah this one should isn't a good argument because they could be wrong as well or there could be more behind it. It's just not a good reason regardless of if it's looks good or not. Use the what's provided in the verse and not another to prove your point is all I'm saying in the general sense.
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
I'm actually on the fence regarding this. Sure EE is beyond normal levels of destruction but that's because it's erasing it from esistance. However, EE isn't usually done by force like raw destruction so in some cases it's different.

Now on one hand I get it, it sounds really odd if you could survive against your soul being erased but fall to it being destroyed by a lesser approch but on the other hand, we in no way give someone resistance to matter/biological manipulation simple because they resisted getting erased because they aren't always comparable.

However, in terms a Dragon Ball, they can physically muscle against it in some instances so the argument could be had that they can withstand the power that erases the soul, they could withstand something that destroys it. In the end, I don't think it's inaccurate considering we treat it as the top level of destruction.
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It would be listed as Soul Destruction since it can erase the soul

I didn’t really understand your example for the db muscle stuff
 
omegabronic said:
no it isn't? i don't understand why you used invulnerability as an example at all, like how does that even address my point at all?
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That's cause you claimed my logic is that resistance to EE gives you a resistance to getting destroyed by AP which isn't my point at all and misinterprets it as a form of invulnerability.
omegabronic said:
then just say 4D hax, that kind of wording can lead to misunderstandings
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Low 1-C hax, 1-B hax, and 1-A hax are very common terms. So having a misunderstanding over low 2-C hax isn't my problem if you don't know the teiring terms.
omegabronic said:
i am not, you said with ap terms, not with dimensionality terms
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If I said something in terms of AP around teir 3 you'd be right, but I'm talking about scailing in hax around teir 2 unless your gonna nickpick I didn't say 4D hax in potency.
 
godofice said:
It would be listed as Soul Destruction since it can erase the soul

I didn’t really understand your example for the db muscle stuff
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Erasure is in a tier of it's own, it doesn't always = it's lesser variant. I have an example of characters that have stronger level of a hax that is a different variant from the lower. My example was explaining that if it's pointed to in that way, it would be fine, which is why I don't have a major issue.
 
Ikelaggan said:
That's cause you claimed my logic is that resistance to EE gives you a resistance to getting destroyed by AP which isn't my point at all and misinterprets it as a form of invulnerability.
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no? that is exactly what your logic implies, the way the soul is destroyed matters here significantly, like, are you going to tell me that attacking the soul directly with ap is the same as having said soul erased from existence? of course not

Ikelaggan said:
Low 1-C hax, 1-B hax, and 1-A hax are very common terms. So having a misunderstanding over low 2-C hax isn't my problem if you don't know the teiring terms.
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i know the tiering terms, i was just giving a tip, i was not really complaining

Ikelaggan said:
If I said something in terms of AP around teir 3 you'd be right, but I'm talking about scailing in hax around teir 2 unless your gonna nickpick I didn't say 4D hax in potency.
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read above, sorry for any confusion regarding my advice
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
Erasure is in a tier of its own, it doesn't always = it's lesser variant. I have an example of characters that have stronger level of a hax that is a different variant from the lower. My example was explaining that if it's pointed to in that way, it would be fine, which is why I don't have a major issue.
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I see so you’re saying they’re merely different variants not a necessarily a stronger version of EE So are you okay with Soul Destruction being listed?
 
godofice said:
I see so you’re saying they’re merely different variants not a necessarily a stronger version of EE So are you okay with Soul Destruction being listed?
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I don't follow DB like I use to, but I'm more neutral. Though if it gets accepted then I don't have any major problems. I'm just here to add my thoughts.
 
omegabronic said:
no? that is exactly what your logic implies, the way the soul is destroyed matters here significantly, like, are you going to tell me that attacking the soul directly with ap is the same as having said soul erased from existence? of course not
Click to expand...
I'm really not trying to imply my logic works like that, since soul attacks with AP scailing vs Soul erasure are different since one works on scailing while the other ignores durability. I hate mentioning that sans is the only undertale character with soul durability negation
 
Ikelaggan said:
I'm really not trying to imply my logic works like that
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i know that this is not what you are trying to imply, but it is what it is implied even if you didn't intended to

Ikelaggan said:
, since soul attacks with AP scailing vs Soul erasure are different since one works on scailing while the other ignores durability.
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well, if so then still i don't much point in the thread tbh, like, we already list it as "soul ee" so i am still feeling like it is redundant
but we are going in circles, let us leave the staff to decide, agree to disagree for us both sounds reasonable for you?

Ikelaggan said:
I hate mentioning that sans is the only undertale character with soul durability negation
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not really no, they all have, sans was just the one that didn't got downgraded
 
omegabronic said:
well, if so then still i don't much point in the thread tbh, like, we already list it as "soul ee" so i am still feeling like it is redundant
but we are going in circles, let us leave the staff to decide, agree to disagree for us both sounds reasonable for you?
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I'm okay with staff making their points on the matter.
omegabronic said:
not really no, they all have, sans was just the one that didn't got downgraded
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I've noticed the changes, thankfully he's not a thunder McQueen gimmick character anymore
 
CryoTheMayo said:
I agree with this. Makes zero sense that resistance to soul destruction wouldn't give you resistance to soul manipulation. If your soul can handle literal erasure from all existence it can resist a dude trying to manipulate it.
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Well, no. Soul Erasure is destroying it, while Soul Manipulation is controlling it. It's like Durability against a punch vs body puppetry. A character can take a punch but still be effected by someone manipulating them physically.

For the OP, unless Frieza's Hakai is super bad I don't know why Goku wouldn't get some form of resistance to EE and Void Manipulation.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Well, no. Soul Erasure is destroying it, while Soul Manipulation is controlling it. It's like Durability against a punch vs body puppetry. A character can take a punch but still be effected by someone manipulating them physically.

For the OP, unless Frieza's Hakai is super bad I don't know why Goku wouldn't get some form of resistance to EE and Void Manipulation.
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The ops question was why hakai doesn’t have soul destruction but he just copied and pasted that off the profile they already have void manip

but his question led to adding soul destruction to hakai since it destroys souls
 
Qawsedf234 said:
EE already includes Soul Destruction. You just have to prove it can effect souls. Soul Manipulation requires active influence over a soul afaik.
Click to expand...
EE doesn’t include Soul Destruction by default so we wanted to add Soul Destruction but we aren’t trying to add Soul Manipulation just Soul Destruction like the manga does
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Well, no. Soul Erasure is destroying it, while Soul Manipulation is controlling it. It's like Durability against a punch vs body puppetry. A character can take a punch but still be effected by someone manipulating them physically.
Click to expand...
I see, so as long as manp involves destruction (concept erasure) it would get that manp in specific? Also, I think our soul manp page isn't specific towards controlling or puppet soul stuff but even interaction such as interaction with souls, eating soul would get soul manp and other soul related applications.
Qawsedf234 said:
EE already includes Soul Destruction. You just have to prove it can effect souls. Soul Manipulation requires active influence over a soul afaik.
Click to expand...
EE doesn't include soul by default but can can include. In some fictional series EE includes concepts and causality itself (which has been referenced as causality manp and concept manp in profiles via EE).
 
Yeah this isn't matter manipulation. It's just erasure. Like you don't get temperature manipulation for controlling or producing fire unless that's a separate ability for example.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Yeah this isn't matter manipulation. It's just erasure. Like you don't get temperature manipulation for controlling or producing fire unless that's a separate ability for example.
Click to expand...
it still fall under destruction aspect of matter manipulation, unless you want to list a guy with an ability to erase physical object, matter only as EE
 
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