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MCU Phase 5 General Discussion Thread

Deagonx said:
Let me preface this by saying, I have no intention of becoming involved with MCU scaling on the site, and the last time I mentioned this it was taken far too personally by the supporters. This is just my opinion, and I don't want this thread to become a venue for a full blown debate about the subject.

But essentially my opinion is that the speed ratings for the verse are so comically beyond what the movies actually demonstrate that we are essentially willfully ignoring the majority of the portrayals and source material to pretend everything is happening many many orders of magnitude faster than it actually is, based on a small small handful of cherry picked instances.

I don't believe it's reasonable to think that nearly everything we see on screen is happening in relative slow-motion, and IMO the reality is that most characters, including those like Thanos, are more or less moving at human speeds. They aren't moving at supersonic speeds, and certainly aren't moving at the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Thankfully the DCEU will never have to deal with human level speed allegations 💪

 
The moments that get me to believe some level of hugh speed reactions are Scott shrinking before the the compound explodes, while off guard, and Tony actually viewing everything in slow motion when his mansion is attacked.
 
vsbattles.com

MCU CRT: Thanos is not stronger than Carol

Thanos’ profile says: While extremely wounded and near-death, he could overpower Captain Marvel. He did not, at most, this is some Lifting Strength scaling, not Attack Potency. We see later on the movie that Carol overpowered past Thanos in Lifting Strength too, so even LS is not a guaranteed...
vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
 
Deagonx said:
Let me preface this by saying, I have no intention of becoming involved with MCU scaling on the site, and the last time I mentioned this it was taken far too personally by the supporters. This is just my opinion, and I don't want this thread to become a venue for a full blown debate about the subject.

But essentially my opinion is that the speed ratings for the verse are so comically beyond what the movies actually demonstrate that we are essentially willfully ignoring the majority of the portrayals and source material to pretend everything is happening many many orders of magnitude faster than it actually is, based on a small small handful of cherry picked instances.

I don't believe it's reasonable to think that nearly everything we see on screen is happening in relative slow-motion, and IMO the reality is that most characters, including those like Thanos, are more or less moving at human speeds. They aren't moving at supersonic speeds, and certainly aren't moving at the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Human lvl speed be like:
https://youtu.be/ic224dhaElo?si=uM5wCByayb9RH3cT
 
Reyne said:
Could you imagine the budget needed to do this at all times?
Click to expand...
That's not really an argument in favor of it. They didn't do it. We can't assume they intended that.

Suigetsuhyugs said:
But you see her arms and spear movement which should be in the realm of subsonic or sonic speed
Click to expand...
Why? I'm not going to assume her spear is moving faster than we see on screen. If the spear was slowed down massively from being the speed of sound, the bullets would've been slowed down too, but they weren't.
 
Deagonx said:
Why? I'm not going to assume her spear is moving faster than we see on screen. If the spear was slowed down massively from being the speed of sound, the bullets would've been slowed down too, but they weren't.
Click to expand...
Probably because Marvel doesnt want to have a 4 hours zack snyther cut
 
Deagonx said:
That's not really an argument in favor of it. They didn't do it. We can't assume they intended that.


Why? I'm not going to assume her spear is moving faster than we see on screen. If the spear was slowed down massively from being the speed of sound, the bullets would've been slowed down too, but they weren't.
Click to expand...
I'm not saying the any of these creative intend for their characters to be MHS or lightspeed or any of the power scaler bilge. Just that these characters do blocks bullets and react to things that are simply not possible. I think it is reasonable that slow mo isn't done more often because of budget, given how overworked artists have been, it's understandable that prolonging explosion #15 or blast #237 isn't really a necessity.
 
Suigetsuhyugs said:
Probably because Marvel doesnt want to have a 4 hours zack snyther cut
Click to expand...
But you're making up reasons why the evidence directly contradicts you, instead of drawing a conclusion based on what... actually happens in the scenes. The spear isn't slowed down, the bullets are clearly much much faster than it, which is why they impact instantaneously.

ThePrimalHunter said:
Yep, human level speed guys
Click to expand...
You can literally see how fast Spiderman is moving. The only thing that moves remarkably fast during the slo-mo is the webs.
 
Deagonx said:
But you're making up reasons why the evidence directly contradicts you, instead of drawing a conclusion based on what... actually happens in the scenes. The spear isn't slowed down, the bullets are clearly much much faster than it, which is why they impact instantaneously.
Click to expand...
It just appears like that but again to react to bullets she would be already moving at above human level by a considerable amount but the fact that she had time to move the spear around it shows. And sure you can blame that but remember that we have the scene with the men shooting then cut and we see her moving the spear and doge it we dont even see the bullets entire path
Deagonx said:
You can literally see how fast Spiderman is moving. The only thing that moves remarkably fast during the slo-mo is the webs.
Click to expand...
except even before than that Electro uses lightning which moving but Spiderman moves fast enough to dodge and put up a car in the way while seemingly moving normal human speed,
 
Suigetsuhyugs said:
It just appears like that but again to react to bullets
Click to expand...
...or she's reacting to the men pointing guns at her? Two of the bullets hit her dead on.

Suigetsuhyugs said:
except even before than that Electro uses lightning which moving but Spiderman moves fast enough to dodge and put up a car in the way while seemingly moving normal human speed,
Click to expand...
Other humans are moving in the scene at the same time.
 
Deagonx said:
I've rarely participated in MCU threads on this site, but I gotta say it's the verse that gives me some of the most cognitive dissonance as someone that has seen everything the MCU has put out. The speed stats in particular are insane, but yeah Tier 4 Thor is... something.
Click to expand...
Deagonx said:
Let me preface this by saying, I have no intention of becoming involved with MCU scaling on the site, and the last time I mentioned this it was taken far too personally by the supporters. This is just my opinion, and I don't want this thread to become a venue for a full blown debate about the subject.
Click to expand...
I'm a little confused why you felt the need to pop up into this thread and make this comment and then proceed to say that you don't wanna get involved into the scaling, knowing its a hot topic.
 
Valiant_Abyss said:
you don't wanna get involved into the scaling,
Click to expand...
By "getting involved in the scaling" I'm referring to participating in revisions. This is a general discussion thread, which is an ideal place for expressing one's opinion without trying to get involved in the scaling.
 
Deagonx said:
...or she's reacting to the men pointing guns at her? Two of the bullets hit her dead on.
Click to expand...
We clearly see she moving after the bullet was fired, and most likely she let those bullets go because they would hit her armour
Deagonx said:
Other humans are moving in the scene at the same time.
Click to expand...
No, humans only show up later not when Electro directly throws lightning at spiderman's face
 
Sure man. Agree to disagree. I don't care to go in circles about it, I've made my stance clear that I think it's flatly ridiculous.
 
Deagonx said:
By "getting involved in the scaling" I'm referring to participating in revisions. This is a general discussion thread, which is an ideal place for expressing one's opinion without trying to get involved in the scaling.
Click to expand...
Sure, that's fine not wanting to make revisions, but it seems oddly baity to come in and throw in something that you've acknowledged as a heated topic.
 
I mean, if an opinion someone disagrees with is "bait" to them, then that's on them. People disagree all the time.
 
Deagonx said:
I mean, if an opinion someone disagrees with is "bait" to them, then that's on them. People disagree all the time.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure they're saying you saying you don't want to get involved, and then get involved, is bait, not your view on speed scaling.
 
So if we're voicing our thoughs on things we disagree with on MCU powerscaling, I think that the Star level scaling is a bit ridiculous. That feats is billions of times more powerful than anything else the characters in the MCU have ever shown, but ig we all forgot outliers are a thing and added it in anyways. A little while ago didn't we think that Large Country level was an outlier?

6-B pre-awakening and High 6-B/High 6-A Post-Awakening, awesome!
High 6-B/High 6-A pre & post-awakening, ehh, no thanks
Low 4-C pre & post-awakening, no

At the very least, pre-awakening characters should 100% not be Small Star level. If that was the case, why did loki need to use the bifrost when destroying Jotunheim? A single blast with Gungnir would've delt with that instantly. Why did ultron need to do his whole elaborate asteroid with a city plan when he could've just accidentally stepped a little too hard and wiped out all of life in an instant? Why did Tony need to weaken the core of Sokovia for Thor to destroy it? Is the city of Sokovia harder to destroy than a small star?

I really don't see how in the actual hell this got passed

Also how did Hulk scaling to Thanos get passed? Iron Spider could tank hits from Thanos without too much damage. Doc Oc could do more damage to the Iron Spider than Thanos did. Star level Raimi-Verse? All the Spider-Men are relative to each other. Star level Amazing Spider-Man duology? Totally makes sense seeing how Lizard got hurt by M16s and Spider-Man was bleeding after a shot from a police officers Glock 17. Star level firearms? I think I know my next CRT guys. There are just as ridiculous as the examples we have in the Power-scaling Rules for Marvel and DC comics.

We have outliers on this wiki for a reason, and at minimum this is a massive outlier for Pre-Awakened characters. It's also an outlier for Post-Awakened characters imo, but it's at least a little bit more understandable

If there's a CRT working on this could someone link it to me?
 
ThePrimalHunter said:
So if we're voicing our thoughs on things we disagree with on MCU powerscaling, I think that the Star level scaling is a bit ridiculous. That feats is billions of times more powerful than anything else the characters in the MCU have ever shown, but ig we all forgot outliers are a thing and added it in anyways. A little while ago didn't we think that Large Country level was an outlier?

6-B pre-awakening and High 6-B/High 6-A Post-Awakening, awesome!
High 6-B/High 6-A pre & post-awakening, ehh, no thanks
Low 4-C pre & post-awakening, no

At the very least, pre-awakening characters should 100% not be Small Star level. If that was the case, why did loki need to use the bifrost when destroying Jotunheim? A single blast with Gungnir would've delt with that instantly. Why did ultron need to do his whole elaborate asteroid with a city plan when he could've just accidentally stepped a little too hard and wiped out all of life in an instant? Why did Tony need to weaken the core of Sokovia for Thor to destroy it? Is the city of Sokovia harder to destroy than a small star?

I really don't see how in the actual hell this got passed

Also how did Hulk scaling to Thanos get passed? Iron Spider could tank hits from Thanos without too much damage. Doc Oc could do more damage to the Iron Spider than Thanos did. Star level Raimi-Verse? All the Spider-Men are relative to each other. Star level Amazing Spider-Man duology? Totally makes sense seeing how Lizard got hurt by M16s and Spider-Man was bleeding after a shot from a police officers Glock 17. Star level firearms? I think I know my next CRT guys. There are just as ridiculous as the examples we have in the Power-scaling Rules for Marvel and DC comics.

We have outliers on this wiki for a reason, and at minimum this is a massive outlier for Pre-Awakened characters. It's also an outlier for Post-Awakened characters imo, but it's at least a little bit more understandable

If there's a CRT working on this could someone link it to me?
Click to expand...
The CRT to dowgrade them back was already accepted just not applied yet, only Carol will scale to low 4-C because she made the feat herself and it was important to the movie itself to the point it cant be ignored. i think Quantum bands and their users will keep the low 4-C
 
Ikaris could output country level energy without issue but he can't get out from under Deviants who can be harmed by shotguns.

Like, the cloud feat is the definition of outlier.
 
Why are the quantum bands on "standard equipment" in captain Marvel's profile? She used it for a few seconds on a movie and she aint even using them by the end, if it was me that wouldnt be not even on optional gear surely not on standard equipment
 
Suigetsuhyugs said:
Why are the quantum bands on "standard equipment" in captain Marvel's profile? She used it for a few seconds on a movie and she aint even using them by the end, if it was me that wouldnt be not even on optional gear surely not on standard equipment
Click to expand...
I think it's because she was waring one when unpacking at the house, as if she'll be keeping it with her from now on.

Mam, I don't think we'll be seeing those sweet new duds going forward, given they were one of a kind.
 
Reyne said:
I think it's because she was waring one when unpacking at the house, as if she'll be keeping it with her from now on.

Mam, I don't think we'll be seeing those sweet new duds going forward, given they were one of a kind.
Click to expand...
She was unpacking boxes at "kamala´s house"
 
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