Masadaverse Discussion Thread 9

[VoidGoji]

She vaporized the park. It was High 7-C iirc, but, as Kei herself stated, Eleonore was holding back and conaining the explosion

 

[Dziga]

Technically the feat is 7-A since it One-Shotted Liza alongside the Park. But eh, I was expecting something to finally upgrade the Commanders.

 

[VoidGoji]

Welp, theres Eleonore's feat of dispersing an entire storm with her entrance in the world (5/8 Swastikas)

 

[VoidGoji]

It can be Tier 6

 

[Dziga]

That would be nice. I still think the Commanders should be At least 7-A since they're all capable of casually One-Shooting regular LDO with only 3 Swastikas opened and a weaker, base Wolfgang has a casual 384.32 Megatons feat.

 

[VoidGoji]

Ye, his Berlim busting feat. It was a weaker version of him.

 

[VoidGoji]

Eleonore vaporized Cain with an extremely casual action too while heavily nerfed

 

[Dziga]

Eleonore insta-killed Liza with only 3 Swastikas opened in Kei's route, and in Marie's route, with 6 Swastikas, she only need a spark of her cigar to one-shot Cain. She repeated the same in Rea's route, but with only 5 Swatikas opened. Tubal Cain himself is one of the strongest members of the LDO, he can easily cause severe wounds in lesser LDO members with only one attack, and is superior to Wilhelm, who is in turn considerably superior to the other regular LDO members.

 

[ALRF]

so, like we know how we say Wolfgang has limited regen in his true Briah? I don't agree with it.

Einherjar have infinite amount of souls due to their connection to Gladsheimr, giving them the ability to use their soul stocks without having to worry about running out of it

This is seeing when Wilhelm had a statement being having infinite life force after becoming an Einherjar.

So basically, the Wolfgang running out of souls is wrong. Besides didn't he die from Ren's curse rather than soul consumption?

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[Dziga]

I don't have the scans now, but wasn't it outright stated that Wolfgang would run out of souls / had ran out souls during his fights with Wilhelm and Ren respectively in Rea's route?

 

[ALRF]

Don't remember to be honest

It's most likely a retcon if there was such statements. It would be pretty much weird to say he has limited souls when others Commanders don't and how IwKBEY explains that due to their connection to Reinhard Briah, they pretty much are given infinite amount of souls for supplementation

 

[Dziga]

Wolfgang's Briah is completely out of the norm anyways, I wouldn't be surprised if his proprieties as an Einherjar were altered.

 

[Yamatoryujin]

Pretty much what ALRF said, ikabey served as a little chronicle for Wilhelm and as well as expanding the lore behind Merc's heaven. Like how we found out that there used to be gods all over, each reprsenting their own concept, as well as the concept of mystery. I mean the only reason Wilhelm could fight against Meth was becuase he had access to the entirety of Gladshemir's soul stock, in otherwords he became an Einherjar. Normally I would be against power-scaling because it introduces a whole slough of issues and has tons of implications, but revising the 3 commanders seems like the way to go.

 

[ALRF]

Don't think it did anything to his nature as one.

Besides like i said, it's pretty much given he has that infinite soul supplementation as the prequel (see the excerpt i posted) pretty much says it applies to all Einherjar.

I'd say it's some kind of a retcon

Hence i believe discussion on this is needed.

 

[Yamatoryujin]

The fight between Wilhelm and Meth was even, with Wilhelm gaining the advantage by impaling him with his Yetzirah, before we get to see anything else Reinhard just goes:"lol my turn" and throws his spear. Wilhelm being boosted to Einherjar status is no different from the 3 commanders in DI. Essentially, if you're going to scale the three commanders scale them to the Wil/Meth fight.

 

[Dziga]

Cof cof, Planet level commanders, cof cof.

 

[VoidGoji]

cof cof, 1-A power on base Reinhard, cof cof

 

[ALRF]

Commanders need some improvements

Most in the form of keys (5 swatiska, 8, ect)

That's so we can end up some confusion such as Commanders losing to others members (when they were not at their peak)

 

[Yamatoryujin]

I can't remember how it was quantatised, what would they're strength be at 5 open? over 50%?

 

[Dziga]

Not quantifiable as far as I know. There are several things that I would like to insert / change in the DI profiles, I am currently reading the novel for the second time, If you would like I can make a list of things I want to revise.

 

[ALRF]

Sure (to the Dziga about doing the list of things)

@Yama nice Fan avi. Opium dream is the best ovo

 

[Yamatoryujin]

Thanks, it's a shame that he got jumped by 3 other people. Imagine a highschooler, an Imperial Japanese officer, and a Nazi join up to beat the shit out of a drug addict. Very heroic and courageous.

Like how was this fair?

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Don't remember to be honest
It's most likely a retco if there was such statements. It would be pretty much weird to say he has limited souls when others Commanders don't and how IwKBEY explains that due to their connection to Reinhard Briah, they pretty much are given infinite amount of souls for supplementation

>A retcon

>RETCON

Masada, why do you hurt me like this?

 

[ALRF]

I just like how they all love humanity and want the best for it but in their own way and then they goes:

• Let's gang up on a drug addict who's ideal world is no shittier than us

I'd pay everything to get to see Fan getting more screen time maybe a sequel or even a prequel about him. Sadly, Light is milking the hell out of Dies Irae (and generally Shinza)

 

[ALRF]

@Monarch i thought Kaneki Ken from that other wiki with metapotence was even more awful ovo

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

• O M N I P O T E N T G H O U L A B I L I T I E S

 

[ALRF]

Ghouls can screw up concepts with their tentacles


.....


.....


Sounds weird

 

[TISSG7Redgrave]

It was stated he ran out of fuel yes stated by narration. Though if that is wrong then lolz recton GG. Also @yamatoryujin GG 3 unconventional ppl ganging on drug addict kek

@Alrfy that sounds wrong in SO many ways

 

[Dziga]

Ren Fuji: Add an Eine Faust Scherzo Key (Has completely different powers from his normal Incarnation, not to mention he has feats of his own, mainly one-shooting 7 Swastikas Machina).

Change his base to Key Speed to "Massively Hypersonic+, FTL, possibly FTL+ with Briah" (In the Yetzirah degree, he is only on the level of the Regular LDO in terms of speed, keeping up with the Lightning -Fast Tubal Cain in the Kasumi / Kei common route and in Kei's route with a bit of struggle, and all his FTL / FTL+ were in his different Briah degrees).

Upgrade Eine Faust Finale to Up to MFTL and everyone who scales. (He was stated to have boosted his speed by a thausand, after having Marie, using his body and Briah, was already boosted to 3000x his speed. Lightning Speed x 3000 (EFO) x 1000 (EFF) = MFTL speeds (Although this might be a somewhat of a hyperbole).

The Three Commanders: Should have two Keys (as mentioned by ALRF). One being 5-7 Swastikas and the other being 8 Swastikas. The 8 Swastikas Keys should be At least Mountain level (Considerably stronger than before). I'd even dare to say that their 5 Swastikas Key should be At least Mountain level (Check my post about it above).

They should also be given Resistance to Time Manipulation. (At 5 Swastikas, it took quite some time to the Commanders to start being noticeably negatively affected by Ren's EFF Time Slow. At 8 Swastikas, they were completely demolishing Ren and Eleonore even scolded him for using a Hadou Briah on them, when they are easily able to resist it when used against 3 people at the same time. When Marie ascends Ren to Atziluth degree, Eleonore and Wolfgang are frozen, but are still able to Think and even Talk, while Machina was fighting normally, like nothing happened. Remember this is a 1-A Time Stop).

Wilhelm, Beatrice, Kai and Tubal Cai: These three should be solid Mountain level, at least with their Briah's (They're repeatedly stated and shown to be stronger than the lesser LDO members. Beatrice herself was able to defeat, albeit barely, and with a bit of Plot Power, 7 Swastikas Eleonore. Wilhelm was able to somewaht keep up, but ultimately inferior to Berserk Wolfgang. Kai is able to fight with Beatrice evenly and Tubal Cain is stronger than Kai and stated to be stronger than Wilhelm).

Kai should also get a separate Key (as he doesn't possess all the powers Cain has and is somewhat weaker due to Cain being literally Kai + 2 Other Sakurais + Beatrice). I'm also a bit skeptic about scaling Beatrice's upmost speed to Eleonore since they were clearly on equal footing when fighting.

All the Ewigkeit Users: Everyone that isn't a God should have their Type 1 Immortality removed and changed for Longevity (Rusalka blatantly states that their souls can't go long past over 300 Years without decaying. While their bodies remain Young forever, their Soul still decays with time. Most normal human souls can't go much past 100 years, while the LDO members extended that time. But they're not eternally Immortal by themselves, Rusalka herself wished to gain complete Immortality as her prize for serving Reinhard, and they all rely on Reinhard's Gladsheim).

That's all I remember so far, I might add or remove some things as I read more and as people suggest.

 

[Yamatoryujin]

I think that they should be scaled to Einherjar Wilhelm for the 8 Swastikas key, and around low tier 6 for the 5 swastikas key. But for the most part I agree with you. Whilst on the topic of Senshinkan, I think that Amakasu's summons should be listed on his page, namely Balor, Kouryu and Lucifer, since I don't think that they warrant having their own pages, and since Kouryu and Lucifer are stated by the narration to be significantly stronger than their Tatari counterparts. I'll include some screenshots as well.

Balor: Irish God, King of the Formorians and is thought to be the personification of blight and drought. Alaya states its demonic eye could kill gods and Rosei alike with a simple stare. As we all know Rosei are just dreams, so the concept of an "ultimate death" isn't something that would normally apply to them, but Balor's gaze can make it happen.

Formoria Crom Cruach - Denizen of the Deep sea: The Bloodstained Crescent Moon: Another Irish god, but in the context of Senshinkan he takes the form of a giant black dragon, when he descended from the heavens Yoshiya upon seeing it's size and jaw, immediately compared the event to the moon being devoured by the sun. His roar differs from Kouryu/Kuubo, rather than it having a physical affect, it attacks the very soul in the sense that it destroy's a person's will. Yoshiya notes this difference and states that he felt the inexplicable urge to die, and that him living on held no meaning.

Kouryu: The true form of Kuubo, takes the appearance of a giant golden dragon roughly the same size as the Kanto Region, his roar was powerful enough to destroy one million of Jinron's Tatari in a single strike and literally warp the very terrain. Like Kuubo's roar, it destroys space-time, souls, dreams, physical aspects, and leylines, it's just that it's at a greater scale.

Lucifer - The Dawn's Morning Star: One of the many composing parts of Shinno. The strongest angel and once stood at the peak of Seraphim. From his wings he can call upon thousands of falling meteors, at their heart carrying the sacred flame. His light brings about salvation, one that can cover the very world and cleanse all impurities within it.ÒÇÇ

Of course, I want to preface this by saying I'm not the most confidant in my translation abilities, that's why I'd like to include the screenshots as well and see if anyone can spot any mistakes that I may have made and if anyone has any criticism.

https://imgur.com/a/CSQ7Ds7

https://imgur.com/a/zDm3HuF

 

[Warren_Valion]

Could someone explain to me the LDO's "Mid-Godly with Gladshemir"?

As in, when it happened?

I have to be fair, I never got the chance to finish the Rea Route, so maybe something happened there.

But from what I remember from Kei's Route is Mercurius saying something along the lines of: "I'll give your group a small chance to win by not instantly reviving the commanders if they were to lose their fights."

I think it was a conversation was with Reinhard before the climactic battle and it was agreed by Reinhard that he wouldn't resurrect the commanders either.


If what I remember is right, then that isn't Regenerationn, but resurrection for Reinhard and Mercurius.


So is my memory or understanding faulty or did they regenerate from nothingness in a different scene?

 

[Yamatoryujin]

@Warren It's a property of Reinhard's briah, Gladshemir renders them immortal. For example, during the 60 years they were away, the three commanders would fight against each other all out, die to each other and resurrect, and if I recall correctly Eleonore states that she's been hit by Machina's briah. Meaning she's had her existence erased and has recovered from that. In Ikabey they'd get into all-out fights as well since they'd recover anyway.

Put some respect on Bey's name.

 

[ALRF]

Yeah, Wilhelm does get punched by Machina

And in their fight against Meth, he used his time accel which also destroys the soul and they regenerate due to Glads presence

 

[Warren_Valion]

@Warren It's a property of Reinhard's briah, Gladshemir renders them immortal. For example, during the 60 years they were away, the three commanders would fight against each other all out, die to each other and resurrect, and if I recall correctly Eleonore states that she's been hit by Machina's briah. Meaning she's had her existence erased and has recovered from that. In Ikabey they'd get into all-out fights as well since they'd recover anyway.

Put some respect on Bey's name.

Yeah, I know. But what I was saying is that I remember Mercurius saying that he or Reinhard are the ones who resurrect them, not that they resurrect themselves.

On the other hand, I haven't read IKBey, so maybe there is a feat somewhere in that game.

 

[ALRF]

@Yama

I'm gonna completely rewrite his profile. I feel like i will do something like Haju (which is too in need of editing but laziness)

But you TL and scans help me save some time so thanks

 

[Warren_Valion]

I wish I had a scan of the scene.

 

[Yamatoryujin]

@ALRF Yeah no problem. But there's one more thing that bothers me that I was hoping you could explain. His profile states that he's weaker than Kuubo, but I don't recall that being in the narration whatsover. Kuubo is probably amongst his weakest summons, and he has trouble handling him because he's a mindless husk that most of the time talks like a child and just goes "µ╗à.µ╗à.µ╗à.µ╗à.µ╗à" and "õ║í.õ║í.õ║í.õ║í.õ║í".

@warren Don't worry I know the scene you're on about, the one in Kei's route where Beatrice asks Merc to keep things fair, I assume Reinhard is the one who has the final say on their resurrection, but the default state of his Briah will just bring them back.

 

[Extreme123dz]

https://www.stuffiliketodo.net/work/dies_irae_song_to_the_witch_2781

 

[ALRF]

@Yama another mistake on the profiles. While it states its "Nakiri" we technically are using his pure form stats.

 

[CynicalWeeaboo]

@Extreme

haha what the hell, why is Marilyn Monroe strong?

That guy also apparently did some side manga. https://www.stuffiliketodo.net/work/dies_irae_gy_9282 pretty neat stuff. Like the art.