Legendary Birds upgrade (plus probably others)

[The_real_cal_howard]

So remember when I tried to upgrade the birds before? Well, it's kinda back. For the record, the feat was that in the 2000 movie, the three birds' latent energy kept the planet from flooding. The reason it wasn't accepted was that DT said that because of time, it wouldn't surpass their current tiering. But @Dark calced it, using a reasonable assumed timeframe of a day, and it would still be High 6-A, albeit on the lower end of it. This would affect a lot of individuals, because a lot of Pokémon are scaled to Moltres' other latent energy feat. So here's what I propose:

The three legendary birds: 6-A+ (divide the feat by 3)

Logia and Ho-oh: High 6-A (gets the whole feat as they're equal to all 3 birds combined)

Mew and Mewtwo: 6-A+, possibly High 6-A (same reason as current)

The three legendary "beasts": 6-A+ (Should be comparable to the birds)

Other featless/lesser legendaries: This is a tricky one, as they're currently scaled to another Moltres feat. OBD has them at country. We can either continue scaling them to Moltres' old casual feat, scale them to Shaymin's raising of Seabreak Path at 6-C, or scale them to 6-B via Lugia's casual wing flap and be in line with OBD's ratings.

 

[SomebodyData]

Hmmm, can you link the calc?

Seems legit if the math is correct, however, are the legendary birds, and by extension the other legendaries, composite still?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Gen 1 and 2 are for certain. Along with the CT and gen 6, but they don't matter.

 

[SomebodyData]

K, tho I'm rather confused why only those gens are composite.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I mean, all legendaries are currently composited.

 

[SomebodyData]

...Huh. I'll make a thread asking why later then, but for now, assuming the math is correct (preferably link calc), then the upgrade is a-ok.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I didn't calc it, I was going to but I was also incredibly tired. Basilisk1995 calced a basic, flooding of the Earth awhile ago, though.

The flood that drowned the planet

So its 18 Petatons devided by three.

 

[LordAizenSama]

Why a day? It doesnt seem right that a day is used and it's still multi continent level. Very fishy.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Aizen. The effects were immediate, said immediate results were happening all over, and it was a high stress situation. If they had more time, it wouldn't have been as serious.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Dark. Isn't that calc for being immediate?

 

[LordAizenSama]

I think I found out why the result seems too high.

For a feat like this, we usually use energy per second.

The calc Dark linked assumes it to be immediately (I think)?

So we're not actually taking into account the day timeframe at all.

 

[LordAizenSama]

Going off my rough math the result should actually be 208 gigatons.

 

[LordAizenSama]

And even then I have some issues with the calc itself. Id definitely prefer opinions from more calc members.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

Whats your issue with it?

 

[LordAizenSama]

@Dark The second part is using vaporisation for some reason, I don't understand why or how

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I always thought it was using Latent Energy, not vaporization. I guess it works for some specific cases of World Flooding but clearly not all. The low end is more universal, which leads to no real upgrades.

 

[LordXcano]

Earth's Land Area - 148,847,000 km^2

Tallest Mountain - 8848 m

Density of Water - 1000 kg/m^3

Gravity - 9.81 m/s^2

Seconds in a Day - 86,400 s

148,847,000 km = 148,847,000,000 m^2

148,847,000,000 * 8840 = 1.3158075e15 m^3

1.3158075e15 * 1000 = 1.3158075e18

PE = (m)(g)(h) = (1.3158075e18)(9.81)(8848) = 1.14e23 J = 27.25 Teratons

27.25/86,400 = 0.00032 Teratons = 320 Megatons/s

320/3 = 106.6 Megatons per bird per second

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

@Cano

I did a calc using the same parameters and got around Teraton grade results (I never converted it into tons but that was my estimate). Using the timeframe will likely be in the Megatons.

 

[DontTalk]

Literally me from the last thread:

"The power holds that current together, but who said one would require that much work to do so? The flooding of the planet is an indirect result of the change of the current. As far as I remember the movie one can basically interpret it in terms of climate change that the change of such currents can bring. For example I once read that some scientists believe if the gulf stream stops that the ocean could rise up to 1 meter in some places (however that works).

That aside we could talk about a process that possibly takes weeks, month or more to be complete." "You can not equate those to the energy necessary to keep the current from forming. The storms are caused by the current changing, not by the birds. Heck the current is not directly causing the storms either.

All that happens through a change in the global weather system and current system, in other words we talk about a complicated chain reaction here. Even if it happens fast there is no saying that all of this is directly fueled from the energy of the current and even less the energy of the birds that basically just had to influence things to a certain degree.

And the flooding of the planet that we want to use as attack potency here never happens (obviously), so timeframe isn't given. Even if it is just one day then we would talk about 1/86400th of the energy. But with no timeframe and a phenomen that clearly takes a longer timeframe even that would be a too nice assumption."

Pretty sure I even had basilisks calc in mind there.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Timeframe: weeks to months is severe downplay, no offense. And there's a ton of calc that make reasonable assumptions. A day is clearly the best option.

Chain reaction: Yet its not one when one uses rainclouds or something similar? The point of the matter is that no Birds equal flooded planet. It's not a little bit at a time, it's not through cracks, it's a current.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I think Howard makes sense.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I agree with Cal here.

 

[LordAizenSama]

Well it doesnt even matter since Xcano made a proper calc and as expected its nowhere near a upgrade.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that DontTalk, LordAizenSama and LordXcano make sense.

 

[ArbitraryNumbers]

I don't know about scaling the Legendary Dogs to each other. What is it that suggests they're comparable in the slightest, other than the fact that they're both legendary trios?

 

[GameHearo266]

Their trio masters, Lugia and Ho-Oh, are equals.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, if I remember correctly, the problem here was that we have a system that focuses on quick attack strength, not ones that accumulate energy over time, so our standard is to use energy for 1 second of a certain power manifestation, for feats that take considerably longer than that.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

A thing I noticed but I forgot to say is that a majority of the people who get that High 6-A rating from that calc don't do it instantly. Also, and correct me if I'm wrong, but Xcano didn't use the accepted calc for flooding, and instead made a different calc.

I've moved on from this, so I won't argue if I'm wrong. Thank you for considering this, and sorry if I wasted time.

 

[LordXcano]

The calc I did was just raising enough water to cover the top of Mount Everest over the entire landmass of Earth over a day

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I understand.

Please note that I'm not saying that your calc is necessarily wrong, btw. Just that it's not the one linked above. Sorry if I possibly offended you. We cool?

(Idk why I'm reverting to my timid self from the beginning of my VSBW carreer. Guess I"m just in that kind of mood)

 

[LordXcano]

I wasn't offended I was just saying what the calc was

Imagine if all the continents disappeared and in their place a giant plume of water in their shape rose 9 km into the air over 24 hours

That's what I did

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I understand that, bud.