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Kama's stats and skills/Big Fate 3-A to Low 2-C Revision

So, Vasavi Shakti could maybe be upgraded, but definitely not Karna himself.

If you scale Arcueid on the basis of the statement "she is the only one who can somewhat fight Amaterasu", a statement which is a pretty bold claim, then you would have to scale Types, which is something I disagree with.

I'm with Shiro on upgrading BB and CCC servants. BB has plenty of feats on her own, as well as having Tiamat's power (who is getting upgrade). Servants do fight Kiara at the end and I saw no indication that they were losing and Kiara was screwed by BB and the alter egos.

Basically, I agree with upgrading: Kiara, Saver, CCC playable Servants (especially Gilgamesh), BB, Goetia, Solomon, Tiamat, Alter Egos, Enkidu and Sefar.

I am unsure about: Arcueid, other Types, Slash Emperor and Zelretch.
 
>Servants do fight Kiara at the end and I saw no indication that they were losing and Kiara was screwed by BB and the alter egos.

They were losing actually, it's just because Kiara aborb BB and AE. Because of they're love for Hakuno that Hakuno's servant didnt die. In that fight you Kiara use Heavens Hole, it would leave 1 hp.

Yeah only the Vasavi Shakti of Karna scales, but Kavacha Kundala can't be destroyed by BB.
 
BB cant destroy Kavacha and kundala just mean you cant remove His Conceptual defense, so we cant scale it to his conceptual defense IMO
 
Kiara isn't in the best shape when she tanked Mara's flames, either. She was just a fragment of herself during that time and she laughed at how Mara's flames will be enough to accomplish what she tried to do, even at that state. I even try to say that she's more nerfed than she was in CCC.

BB has a statement as well and the fact that she has data of Tiamat.

I'm not sure on scaling one character in CCC though: Passionlip. What BB said can easily be an outlier and overall, it's just feel weak to me.
 
I don't see where it's shown that they are losing. Nontheless, she was screwed by BB and her crew, and someone like Gilgamesh is superior to BB.

I don't think Karna can survive universal attacks with KK. It seems just so outlierish to give him that.
 
What about the two Enuma Elish? Gilgamesh should have no problem killing someone like BB with his Enuma Elish and Enkidu should be able to match his with his own Enuma Elish. If I remember right, Enuma Elish was used to kill Tiamat, as well.
 
ThisIsMySwagPack said:
I don't see where it's shown that they are losing. Nontheless, she was screwed by BB and her crew, and someone like Gilgamesh is superior to BB.
I don't think Karna can survive universal attacks with KK. It seems just so outlierish to give him that.
Click to expand...
That's what I was saying, they only won because Kiara abosorb BB. And BB is the source of her power at that time. BB dont want to kill Hakuno that's why everytime Heavens Hole is use, even though the damage is 999999, there's always 1 HP remaining.

I do agree that the servant of Hakuno is above BB.

yeah Possibly far higher for Vasavi Shakti.
 
I don't actually remember Enuma Elish being used to finish Tiamat off.

From what I remember, archer gil shows up for the final fight, you do the actual gameplay fight, and then the next cutscene is Roman yelling to get the hell out of there because Tiamat's about to blow up, then you run off and Tiamat blows up.

I don't remember Ea actually being used.
 
I always understood it that way, though I could be wrong.

He appears and says: "If you can't fight this battle for too long, then it shall be decided in one blow. Or are you concerned that you lack the firepower to do so? Then, if that's the case, then there is no other choice. Allow I, the king, to offer you a hand!"

Anyways, don't want to derail the thread.
 
Ea being EX Anti-World NP may be an evidence to scale it to Mara's NP, which is 3-A/Low 2-C. I suggest we can scale Enuma Elish to this.
 
Anti world NPs just refer to things that mess with the way the world is meant to be, not necessarily always outright destroying it.
 
Huh. But it can still kill Kiara and BB so I think it'll still be scaled.

So the ones we agreed upon currently: Kiara, BB, CCC servants, Saver, Tiamat, Goetia, Vasavi Shakti, Solomon, Sefar, Alter Egos, Enkidu.

Is this correct?
 
I'm fine with scaling those characters but I also think Archerype Earth, the types and EA should scale.

I remember Gilgamesh using enuma elish on tiamat but I can't seem to find a video of it.
 
Enkidu's literally just held her in place though, didn't damage her at all. And then she broke it 30 seconds later.
 
Holding her back is enough I think. It means that Enkidu's EE had enough power to stop Tiamat from advancing.
 
Also something to remember is that even if it was a few seconds or minutes from the perspective of Gudako, it is stated that from Tiamat's perspective of time, it held her for an eternity (I do not remember the exact word they used, I'll have to double check it)
 
Arc should also scale because as an ultimate one she should scale to saver and kiara which would also scale to types.
 
So, the problem is that Types haven't demonstrated anything close to this level nor were implied to possess this kind of power. Their main scaling argument is that they should be the strongest things in Nasuverse, something along those lines, which made them 4-B in the first place. Arcueid (and thus AE) has one statement about her being the only thing capable of matching Amaterasu. If we upgrade Arcueid, then we would probably have to upgrade Types because ORT should be stronger than her. But, I think that statement is a bit of a wild claim and I don't think it's supported by anything else.

Therefore, I am against scaling them (Types, AE, Zelretch), unless someone provides some new insight.
 
In order to even be the type for your planet you have to he the strongest being on it.

If Kiara, Saver and Amatarasu were above her, Arcueid couldn't be Archetype Earth
 
That's also one of problems I have with the Types. They only have statements, same as Arcued in Extra material.
 
Plenty of characters in the wiki are scaled off of statements

If the statements don't have a bunch of anti feats they are fine to use for scaling
 
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