General DC Comics Discussion Thread

[Deagonx]

You said that earlier, but this doesn't affect the entire verse or even 99.9% of it, just the cosmology page. I am not sure why you're being melodramatic about it. Upgrades can still be pursued, they just need to be coordinated with staff.

 

[Firestorm808]

@Elizio33 @IdiosyncraticLawyer @Firestorm808 what do you think of the discussion rule wording above?

Seems okay.

 

[Ramasugita11]

https://imgur.com/gallery/qnSSBgX

Yeah, Main Dc upgrade H1B-1A.
The Orrery of worlds contains infinite higher dimension, bleed likely L1A.
True form darkseid likely 1A, Daniel Hall main dc likely 1A
Perpetua, Mr mxy, Darkest Knight, Overvoid is 1A

 

[Deagonx]

That says "infinite higher dimensional region." That doesn't mean it's infinite dimensions, it means it's higher dimensional and is infinite in size.

 

[Ramasugita11]

That says "infinite higher dimensional region." That doesn't mean it's infinite dimensions, it means it's higher dimensional and is infinite in size.

That is hyperspace. https://imgur.com/gallery/VTs6dcU
Microverse contains higher dimension

 

[AcidSilver]

Not to interrupt this extremely long cosmology debate but it looks like while Superman has a noted lack of special defense against magic, Bizarro actually resists magic.

The comic later reiterates this via Lois and Jimmy.

He even absorbed all of the magic that got blasted at him on Sorcerer's World.

Even casts a backwards spell like Zatanna to make himself speak normal.
All scans are from Action Comics (2016) #1061.

 

[Antvasima]

I beg you people.

You are literally going to add a rule making mfs unable to upgrade this verse and **** it over more then it already is.

But it is fine to upgrade it if you, for example, first present your evidence to Elizio33 and Emirp sumitpo. We simply cannot deal with the sheer current amount of relentless spammy upgrade threads.

 

[Ramasugita11]

But it is fine to upgrade it if you, for example, first present your evidence to Elizio33 and Emirp sumitpo. We simply cannot deal with the sheer current amount of relentless spammy upgrade threads.

Oh, I see? I agree that if I had to close my thread, I would ask Elazio about my thoughts

 

[Ramasugita11]

"Btw, for the cosmology in this thread, it's best to make the morrison/scoot cosmology at the outerverse level with infinite higher-dimensional, what don't you think?

Moreover, there is an explanation of 11 higher dimensions based on M-Theory in the New 52 comic

H1B, Orrery of worlds
Likely L1A bleed
L1A speed force
1A sphere of the gods
1A limbo
1A 2x abovebaseline Monitor Sphere
1A 3x Abovebaseline 5th Dimension
1A 4x Abovebaseline 6th Dimension
Likely 1A 5x abovebaseline The overvoid/the great darkness"

What do you think about this?

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

Well, my response to Deagon was deleted thanks to the abrupt closing of the thread without warning. I’ll just leave it from here and see when we apply the changes.

 

[Ramasugita11]

Very good

What do you think about DC 1A? Maybe in my thread yesterday, you dissagree with the rest but you agree with 1A the Great Darkness

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

"Btw, for the cosmology in this thread, it's best to make the morrison/scoot cosmology at the outerverse level with infinite higher-dimensional, what don't you think?

Moreover, there is an explanation of 11 higher dimensions based on M-Theory in the New 52 comic

H1B, Orrery of worlds
Likely L1A bleed
L1A speed force
1A sphere of the gods
1A limbo
1A 2x abovebaseline Monitor Sphere
1A 3x Abovebaseline 5th Dimension
1A 4x Abovebaseline 6th Dimension
Likely 1A 5x abovebaseline The overvoid/the great darkness"

What do you think about this?

The scan does mention of the Super String Theory notion of dimensionality with the M-Theory idea of 10D + 1. While he does mention that our Universe is made of those eleven and there are others out there. There’s some problem.

1. The authors who written Captain Adam, I don’t know if they count.
2. It’s doesn’t mention infinite-higher dimensions.

 

[Elizio33]

What do you think about DC 1A? Maybe in my thread yesterday, you dissagree with the rest but you agree with 1A the Great Darkness

I said I would agree with a 1-A Great Darkness (Crisis Cosmology) only if there was concrete evidence to support such a tier.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

I said I would agree with a 1-A Great Darkness (Crisis Cosmology) only if there was concrete evidence to support such a tier.

He suggest we take M-Theory.

 

[Elizio33]

He suggest we take M-Theory.

I don't know... Grant, while using certain elements of M-Theory for his cosmology, did not follow it to the letter. It was just a source of inspiration, nothing more, nothing less.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

I don't know... Grant, while using certain elements of M-Theory for his cosmology, did not follow it to the letter. It was just a source of inspiration, nothing more, nothing less.

There were brief mentions during Final Crisis. However, he does use String Theory and M-Theory follows that logic. So he does indirectly notion such existence.

 

[Elizio33]

There were brief mentions during Final Crisis. However, he does use String Theory and M-Theory follows that logic. So he does indirectly notion such existence.

Yes, but is his interpretation of M-theory, string theory, and brane cosmology in his stories necessarily 100% accurate? We cannot be sure.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

Yes, but is his interpretation of M-Theory in his stories necessarily 100% accurate? We cannot be sure.

He uses a lot of “hyper” which is in coordination with String Theory(6D Hyperspace + 4D) and M-Theory(7D Hyperspace + 4D).

Superman was telling Brainiac-5 that he was dragged through a place with hyper-worlds. One random person mentioned of M-Theory, the higher dimensional bulk and branes.

I don't know if that's enough but I don't think M-Theory was just an inspiration. If not he shouldn't be using the String Theory vibration then since it heavily eludes of String Theory and possibly of M-Theory supergravity.

 

[Ramasugita11]

I said I would agree with a 1-A Great Darkness (Crisis Cosmology) only if there was concrete evidence to support such a tier.

I will show the proof below
•Mtheory with 11 dimensional space [New 52 comic]
•Hyperspace in comic microverse
•Infinite higher-dimension in databook
•N-Dimensional in flash 2023

 

[Brahmatman]

Can you already accept at least an infinite dimension for the universe?

 

[ProfectusInfinity]

Can you already accept at least an infinite dimension for the universe?

Source?

 

[Brahmatman]

Source?

Authority sourcebook

 

[Ramasugita11]

Add
•The Microverse
•6-Dimensional space
•9-Dimensional space
+5th dimension, there are 2 types of the fifth dimension : trans-geometric and mathematical dimension

 

[Deagonx]

Can you already accept at least an infinite dimension for the universe?

This isn't indicative of spatial dimensions, as this is clearly referring to realms.

•The Microverse

This isn't indicative of anything.

•6-Dimensional space

The fact that the JL can fight them indicates that there's no qualitative superiority.

•9-Dimensional space

This isn't 9-Dimensional space, it just says "the ninth dimension" and it looks like normal space, so it's almost certainly a realm.

 

[Ramasugita11]

The fact that the JL can fight them indicates that there's no qualitative superiority

They had to make the caethix shape into 3 dimensions, so it could be attacked, this is clearly a higher dimension + like this they see the lower dimension [6-D], as the 5th dimension sees it [5-D].
•The 5th spatial dimension is a mathematical dimension[5-D].

This isn't indicative of anything.

Yes, very helpful, very supportive of the existence of a higher realities

This isn't 9-Dimensional space, it just says "the ninth dimension" and it looks like normal space, so it's almost certainly a realm.

He was talking about higher dimensions, fractal mechanics, 9-D and different physical laws, he was just learning about those dimensions

•Higher Dimensional space
11-D + 2D

 

[PrinceStories]

He was talking about higher dimensions, fractal mechanics, 9-D and different physical laws, he was just learning about those dimensions

•Higher Dimensional space
11-D + 2D

The scan you provided only explains how the nature of the two dimension itself and to explore the dimension must adaptation to the level 10 reduction mass. I am very strange with you always bringing databooks without comic references, moreover you also never even provide the original source from scan provided.

 

[Ramasugita11]

The scan you provided only explains how the nature of the two dimension itself and to explore the dimension must adaptation to the level 10 reduction mass. I am very strange with you always bringing databooks without comic references, moreover you also never even provide the original source from scan provided.

•The guidebook only briefly explains dc cosmology
[Layers of Dimensional]

•Layers of infinite dimensions that existed in dc before. [All-star Squadron] [Wiki].
According to the guidebook, the Dimensions have layers. it's a world beyond a world, a world within a world.

•For the 11 dimensions, it is in chapter 1 of the authority comic [Eleven dimension] [Higher dimension] [Authority sourcebook].

•In league of justice vol 1 chapter #3, there are countless higher dimensions, we can see the statement in this comic, "a myriad of different vectors" + "any number of spatial dimensions".
This is the basic spatial dimension:

2-dimensional spatial vectors are height and width
3-dimensional spatial vectors are height, width and depth
4-dimensonal spatial vectors are height, width, depth and time.
And up to countless dimensional vectors[myriad]
[Countless higher dimension].

DC comics should be 1A or higher

 

[PrinceStories]

The guidebook only briefly explains dc cosmology
[Layers of Dimensional]

This only explains the number of omniverses and alternate multiverses.

•Layers of infinite dimensions that existed in dc before. [All-star Squadron] [Wiki].
According to the guidebook, the Dimensions have layers. it's a world beyond a world, a world within a world.

From what I remember, this scan was rejected a long time ago and you can't bring it up again. T̶̶h̶̶a̶̶t̶ ̶n̶̶o̶̶t̶̶h̶̶i̶̶n̶̶g̶ ̶t̶̶o̶ ̶d̶̶o̶ ̶w̶̶i̶̶t̶̶h̶ ̶a̶̶n̶̶y̶̶t̶̶h̶̶i̶̶n̶̶g̶ ̶c̶̶o̶̶s̶̶m̶̶o̶̶l̶̶o̶̶g̶̶y̶ ̶i̶̶d̶̶i̶̶o̶̶t̶.

For the 11 dimensions, it is in chapter 1 of the authority comic [Eleven dimension] [Higher dimension] [Authority sourcebook].

Wildstrom's current continuity has no cosmology of its own.

In league of justice vol 1 chapter #3, there are countless higher dimensions, we can see the statement in this comic, "a myriad of different vectors" + "any number of spatial dimensions".
This is the basic spatial dimension:

2-dimensional spatial vectors are height and width
3-dimensional spatial vectors are height, width and depth
4-dimensonal spatial vectors are height, width, depth and time.
And up to countless dimensional vectors[myriad]
[Countless higher dimension].

This scan has also been rejected by the staff here.

 

[Ramasugita11]

This only explains the number of omniverses and alternate multiverses.

The way you understand the conclusions in reading a guidebook explains how smart you are

"These universes nest in dimensional layers that are governed by often highly complex laws or exist in as-yet-unformed states."
There are layers that have not yet formed and will eventually form because the layers are infinite

This scan has also been rejected by the staff here.

In the past there was no evidence of higher dimension layers, but with guidebooks now it can be used. Because the infinite dimensional layer and the infinite higher dimensional explanation, the two are related

From what I remember, this scan was rejected a long time ago and you can't bring it up again. T̶̶h̶̶a̶̶t̶ ̶n̶̶o̶̶t̶̶h̶̶i̶̶n̶̶g̶ ̶t̶̶o̶ ̶d̶̶o̶ ̶w̶̶i̶̶t̶̶h̶ ̶a̶̶n̶̶y̶̶t̶̶h̶̶i̶̶n̶̶g̶ ̶c̶̶o̶̶s̶̶m̶̶o̶̶l̶̶o̶̶g̶̶y̶ ̶i̶̶d̶̶i̶̶o̶̶t̶.

That just explains a little more of what I'm saying

Moreover, the 6th dimension has 2 variant, namely spatial dimension and abstract plane

Here Yup, layers of dimensions

 

[Brahmatman]

This isn't indicative of spatial dimensions, as this is clearly referring to realms.

Maybe stop embarrassing yourself already? Attempts to lower the level of the universe look simply ridiculous

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

Maybe stop embarrassing yourself already? Attempts to lower the level of the universe look simply ridiculous

1. This attitude will get you in trouble if you keep it up.
2. The 196,833 dimensions refer to parallel universes folded in on each other.
3. Dimensions "folded so tightly that they are undetectable by any scientific instruments" are of insignificant size and are thus not tierable.

 

[ProfectusInfinity]

Maybe stop embarrassing yourself already? Attempts to lower the level of the universe look simply ridiculous

Ignoring how close you are to getting a direct warning from a thread mod

—The 200,000 dimensional snowflake from your first scan was confirmed to be in reference to parallel universes.

—String dimensions don’t scale anywhere on this site. Your second scan states that the dimensions in context are of such infinitesimal nature. The fact that higher dimensions are constructed from uncountably infinite “slices” of lower ones (e.g. a cube is like uncountably infinite 2-D planes) doesn’t mean higher dimensions are automatically considered higher levels of infinity without evidence of qualitative superiority.

Q: When are higher dimensions not viable to use as evidence for Tier 2 and above?
​

A: Whether higher-dimensional entities qualify for such high tiers or not depends on several different factors, which may take root both in and out-of-verse. To explain this situation, we must first clarify what exactly being higher-dimensional entails.

Are higher-dimensional beings infinitely larger than lower-dimensional equivalents?​

In a way, yes, though not how most would think when using this word. Basically, an arbitrary object of dimension n is essentially comprised by the total sum of uncountably infinite objects of one dimension less, which may be described as lower-dimensional "slices", each corresponding to one of the infinite points of a line. For instance, a square is made of infinitely many line segments (Lined up on the y-axis), a cube of infinitely many squares (Lined up on the z-axis), and so on.

One may think of it as a multiplication between sets: For instance, the unit square [0,1]² may be expressed as the product of two unit intervals [0,1] x [0,1], which itself can be visualized as taking "copies" of the first interval and lining them up along each point of the second interval, of which there are uncountably infinitely-many, thus forming a square out of infinite line segments.

Are higher-dimensional beings infinitely stronger than lower-dimensional equivalents?​

Unintuitive as that may be: Not necessarily, as a number of characteristics through which we quantify the strength or power of a character can remain unchanged when transitioning between higher and lower dimensions. For example: Mass is a quantity that is detached from the dimension of the object which it is inherent to, and unlike volume is not divided in units corresponding to each particular dimension (1-volume [length], 2-volume [area], 3-volume, 4-volume...). It is singular in nature and its units equally apply to alldimensions; whether it is distributed over an area or a volume only tells us about the span of space in which it is spread, not about the quantity itself.

As a consequence of that, much of the calculation methods which are used to measure strength apply equally to both higher and lower dimensions, as they do not care about the extra variables and often work with a single one of them. Examples of this are kinetic energy (Ek=0.5*M*V^2), force (F=M*A), work (W=F*d), and etc.

An intuitive example of that is found in the general definition of Work as defined in physics: In essence, as work itself denotes the energy applied to an object as it is displaced along a given path, the basic formula for calculating it only takes into account a single variable, and the path itself is treated as an one-dimensional object, regardless of the dimension of the space in which the action itself takes place.

Hence, a higher-dimensional entity can be both stronger or weaker than a lower-dimensional one, and thus, they are usually quantified based on their own feats, instead of dimensionality alone. If a character is merely stated to be higher-dimensional and simultaneously has no other feats to derive anything noteworthy from, then they are put at Unknown, and the same applies to lower dimensions as well.

Do note, however, that them not qualifying for Tier 2 and above doesn't mean they are "fake" higher-dimensional beings or anything of the sort. It is simply that being higher-dimensional does not inherently mean they have infinite power in the first place, as explained above.

Mass/Volume/Energy are scalar quantities, which means they have no dimensioned value, and can be applied and permeate through all spatial dimensional axes. Hell, you could argue that the whole point of string theory is that our 3 dimensions of length/width/height are technically the “higher dimensions” because of how insignificant the other extra dimensions are.

 

[NHTkenshin2]

I agree that most of these scans are clearly Tier 1, but yeah, you guys need to chill.

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

I agree that most of these scans are clearly Tier 1, but yeah, you guys need to chill.

All of them have been rejected. What's this evidence that they're "clearly Tier 1"?

 

[Ramasugita11]

I agree that most of these scans are clearly Tier 1, but yeah, you guys need to chill.

Yes, of course, there are infinite higher-dimensional in the guidebook and infinity of dimensions layered in the comic.
In comics there is a 5-dimensional mathematical structure and a 6-dimensional structure with more than a lower dimension.
In dc, dimensions have layers, databooks clarify everything with layers of dimensions in the universe/multiverse

Previously it was rejected, but now with new feats, the concept of infinite dimensional layers can be used in upgrading cosmology

So yes, H1B orrery of worlds

Comic authority explains about higher dimensions, referred to as 11 dimensions, beyond normal space and time [4 Dimensions]. not infinite dimensions
I have the link if anyone wants it

 

[Deagonx]

Maybe stop embarrassing yourself already?

This literally says Earth's universe is one of many "higher dimensions" demonstrating very clearly that the word is being used to refer to realms.

The second one doesn't scale to any cosmology and, as Lawyer says, don't qualify for higher tiers since the dimensions are described as being very small.

 

[Brahmatman]

The 196,833 dimensions refer to parallel universes folded in on each other.

Universes, realities and dimensions are referred to with the same meaning. And the guidebook states that dimensions are coordinate axes.

Dimensions "folded so tightly that they are undetectable by any scientific instruments" are of insignificant size and are thus not tierable.

How should this relate to size? If it cannot be detected, then this only speaks about its properties

 

[Brahmatman]

—The 200,000 dimensional snowflake from your first scan was confirmed to be in reference to parallel universes.

Universes were stated to be an infinite number

—String dimensions don’t scale anywhere on this site. Your second scan states that the dimensions in context are of such infinitesimal nature. The fact that higher dimensions are constructed from uncountably infinite “slices” of lower ones (e.g. a cube is like uncountably infinite 2-D planes) doesn’t mean higher dimensions are automatically considered higher levels of infinity without evidence of qualitative superiority.

Now show me where exactly it has an infinitesimal nature, being in a description with three spatial and one time dimensions. Or does three-dimensional reality also have no volume and does not exceed two-dimensional reality?

Mass/Volume/Energy are scalar quantities, which means they have no dimensioned value, and can be applied and permeate through all spatial dimensional axes. Hell, you could argue that the whole point of string theory is that our 3 dimensions of length/width/height are technically the “higher dimensions” because of how insignificant the other extra dimensions are.

Unfortunately, the comic itself revealed that the ship was drifting in higher dimensions, and took on a three-dimensional form for the crew.

 

[Brahmatman]

This literally says Earth's universe is one of many "higher dimensions" demonstrating very clearly that the word is being used to refer to realms.

The dimension in the example was indicated by axes outside of four

The second one doesn't scale to any cosmology and, as Lawyer says, don't qualify for higher tiers since the dimensions are described as being very small.

Suitable for any cosmology. I haven't seen any evidence that they are small.

 

[Bastolan27]

Universes, realities and dimensions are referred to with the same meaning. And the guidebook states that dimensions are coordinate axes.


How should this relate to size? If it cannot be detected, then this only speaks about its properties

PARALLEL WORLDS
From the highest sublimed realities to broken universes,
there are an infinite number of possibilities out there
to explore (or to be explored by!). There are 196,833
dimensions of reality in a fabulous snowflake shape - and
each movement of each part of the snowflake causes more
possibilities to blossom.

This quite literally implies that the dimensions being discussed in the scan are just different 4-D (3-D Space + 1-D time) timelines.