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I can't be bothered going through the entire thread, so someone just tell me the arguments against William.
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Edelweiss coming for that spot baby.
- Thread starter Firephoenixearl
- Start date
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- #162
He get's passived by Edelweiss which will show him that he will die if he starts the fight against Edel, so he just refuses to fight a battle he know he'll die in.
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I'd just like to note, his profile is outdated. Shadow Magic is a type 2 concept, for starters, that grants a lot more hax.
"passived by [...]"
Ok? And which hax is this exactly? Fear Manipulation? I was told a lot of the debate revolved around this.
edit: Going to sleep, I'll reply to whatever tomorrow.
"passived by [...]"
Ok? And which hax is this exactly? Fear Manipulation? I was told a lot of the debate revolved around this.
edit: Going to sleep, I'll reply to whatever tomorrow.
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Edel has this Fate Manipulation where she causes the opponent to see their own Fated Death which she then makes happen. According to Earl, this causes the opponent to be unable to fight because they see the Fate of their death they envision, and according to Earl normal Fear Manipulation resistance won't work because it's natural fear and only strong willpower to act in the face of death (which is totally rare in fiction) will prevent said fear.
Also, Earl's trying to get a CRT where said Fate Manipulation can kill people they can't even normally kill, such as Regeneration and Non-Existent Physiology.
Also, Earl's trying to get a CRT where said Fate Manipulation can kill people they can't even normally kill, such as Regeneration and Non-Existent Physiology.
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It's just aftereffects of acausality. Since Edelweiss exists beyond causality and fate people can feel their own death:
- ― This self-direction regarding causality is a special characteristic that not only I or the《Desperado》own, but that everyone owns. You should have felt it when you confronted《Marionette King》, 《Haboob》 and the others, haven't you? It is on their backs, the fate called their death. As long as you feel their fate, you will not have the chance to escape. You will keep being attracted by the gravitational pull of the《Desperados》and their fate will lead you to the end of what you also have imagined. The beings that overcome this, and that transcended causality like me――are no other than 《Desperados》.
- ― There are no walls here. You just aren't moving voluntarily. ― It's me, you say? ― Your soul understands the meaning of moving even further, and it's being intimidated by it.
- In the past, a young samurai stood before her in the, blocking her way for his dearest little sister, he frenetically tried to control his body and heart that tried to ran away, trembling in fear while knowing that he would die if he opposed her.
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which again, wouldn't even affect William with the whole him being very corrupted thing
also, his passive power null would simply block said visions from appearing to him
also, his passive power null would simply block said visions from appearing to him
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- #167
First of all selling your soul doesn't mean corruption, and neither does the appearance change. Second of all, i still don't see how corruption has literally any relation to not being scared of death.
I already explained why he can't do that.
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because a ****** corrupted husk doens't fear death
You can nullify a power without nullifing the source, so he doesn't need to nullify her being beyod fate to block the visions
You can nullify a power without nullifing the source, so he doesn't need to nullify her being beyod fate to block the visions
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- #169
Again, he just sold his soul, doesn't mean he doesn't fear death. All these leaps with the husk and the corruption coming outta nowhere.
The visions are not a power anymore than the beyond fate is.
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"English Bill is no more, all that remains is the Duck of Death."
pretty explict corruption here
also, those visions are definitelly a power, just passive ones, just as much as is being beyond fate, which is a physiological power
pretty explict corruption here
also, those visions are definitelly a power, just passive ones, just as much as is being beyond fate, which is a physiological power
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Potato explained the first one.
It's not a power, it's a state of being. Acausality, higher dimensional existence, NEP, Abstract Existence etc, they aren't "powers", they're states of being. Because a dude doesn't have the power to be acausal, he is acausal. Which is why power null doesn't work as well with them (unless shown otherwise).
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states of being are also classified as powers, as they are simply powers of one's body
Either way, the desperado thing is a passive ability generated by their state of being, but William power simply negates the change in fate/the showing to him of the fate, so it'd be like firing a gun underwater, sure the pistol works but the shot ain't really
Either way, the desperado thing is a passive ability generated by their state of being, but William power simply negates the change in fate/the showing to him of the fate, so it'd be like firing a gun underwater, sure the pistol works but the shot ain't really
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- #174
You'd have to prove that is the case for your power null though.
It's a passive trait that has an effect. Being beyond fate means your "gravitational pull of fate" is bigger, and if your gravitational pull of fate is bigger your fate naturally leads people to their death. Again i would like proof of Ducky being able to nullify something like this. I would also like proof of his null being 2-A too, i hope it doesn't come from the fact that he got this power from Grandfather spider.
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You can't use that concept hax if it isn't even in the profile, so that's out.
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- #176
Bump
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So like, I personally think William wins, but a lot of the arguments against Edel are plain wrong, so can't vote until then.
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- #178
Bump
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- #180
First of all when, what thread?
Second of all edel can affect type 4 acausals either way.
Second of all edel can affect type 4 acausals either way.
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Also, wtf? How she affected a type 4 with fate hax?
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Because all desperados are type 4 and some desperados can affect other desperados. Ikki and Edel being 2 obvious examples.
Why do you think i always say "average resistance to fate hax ain't gonna cut it against desperados"
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The duck's acausality will be on a 5-D level if it's accepted, soooooo
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- #184
I don't think these kinds of things apply to acausality. Cus acausality is tied to the flow of time, so whether you are beyond 4D or 5D doesn't matter UNLESS 5D is a time dimension.
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Multiversal time Time/Causality >>>>> Universal Time/Causality
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also, if Edel's thing can work on Desperados it would mean they have a fate, which would contradict them being Type 4 Acausals at all
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I mean, fatehaxing Type 4 acausals is a thing, yknow. And a rather common one
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- #188
No, that would be contradicting if it were type 5 (i think). Type 4 is "outside of the regular laws of causality" or "transcending causality" (which gets lowballed to type 4). So you can still affect them, even though nothing that's working under the regular laws will.
Yeah, but it's in no way transcendent. It's like saying "Planetary AP >>>>>> Mountain AP" which is indeed true, but it is in no way transcendent. Multiverse is just a bunch of universes either way. So you're not affecting anything superior, you're just affecting more of the same thing.
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- #190
Yes. I should remember to make the NEP vs Fate thread later.....actually lemme do that rn.
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I mean for the NEP vs Fate probably yeah.
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THIS
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This.
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Earl my friend, if multiple people are arguing in the inverse, you’re gonna be outmatched.
The only way this would stay is if they were working on a different system of fate/causality as opposed to transcending it altogether. And I know as well as you do that it’s the former.
The only way this would stay is if they were working on a different system of fate/causality as opposed to transcending it altogether. And I know as well as you do that it’s the former.
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Acausality type 4 is outright immunity as opposed to resistance
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I mean multiple people are arguing for me though, what's your point?
Yes but "transcending the causality of the world" defaults to type 4. Cus you transcend the "causality of the world" doesn't mean that you transcend it as a concept. I guess think of it like the "transcends time and space" being like Low 2-C or Low 1-C, instead of 1-A.
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Type 4 isnt "immunity", that would be Type 5
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It is, you can't apply rules to someone that isn't inside the system where you apply rules.
