Dragon Quest Revival Discussion Thread

[Winter]

9

also I have a new feat that needs calculated (see above) last one and I can finally submit the completed Morag profile for review to be added to the DQ verse page

I would wait before we add anything. Keep in mind the entire verse needs revamped, including the verse page, so I’d keep Morag on hold until we get there or find anything else for DQ9

 

[Winter]

Ok even more bad news for DQ9 is that try as I might it seems that the hero is unable to dodge certain attacks, I kept trying to get them to dodge master of Nu’un s lightning but it seems like it’s unable to miss/be dodged/be blocked so we can’t use that either same goes for Morag’s Witch’s Gaze and lost souls and other enemies SDing

the one thing that might be dodgeable/ blockable is magic as I remember vaguely being able to block and dodge magic but despite testing it with max evasion and block to see if it’s possible neither would proc

however We got old reliable point blank Arrow dodging and simultaneous counter attacking? That needs calced

do know that due to Coup de grace being rng I simulated how a dodge and counterattack would look like by using Back Atcha which uses the block/guard animation instead of the dodge animation so I fillmed another video of what the dodge animation looks like so for reference ignore the block animation and use the dodge animation

A lot of abilities can’t be avoided. Magic is also unavoidable. Of course, there’s plenty of exceptions, but the Bodkin feat might be the best you have for DQ9 reactions. Back atcha is a move that makes you able to guaranteed block and dodge attacks, so I wouldn’t really use that.

 

[Abysswalker2126]

A lot of abilities can’t be avoided. Magic is also unavoidable. Of course, there’s plenty of exceptions, but the Bodkin feat might be the best you have for DQ9 reactions. Back atcha is a move that makes you able to guaranteed block and dodge attacks, so I wouldn’t really use that.

The hero doesn’t need back atcha to actually dodge arrows or block them as he can do that naturally

I only used back atcha to simulate the hero being able to dodge and counterattack arrows since otherwise it’s an rng nightmare to get the Hero to get his Coup de grace against a weak enemy

 

[Winter]

The hero doesn’t need back atcha to actually dodge arrows or block them as he can do that naturally

I only used back atcha to simulate the hero being able to dodge and counterattack arrows since otherwise it’s an rng nightmare to get the Hero to get his Coup de grace against a weak enemy

I know, I was just questioning your use of Back Atcha

 

[Abysswalker2126]

I know, I was just questioning your use of Back Atcha

What is there to question? I explained why I used it as it saves time rather than letting the guy try and shoot my level 99 post game Hero with max hp until I get to critical health just to get the dodge and counter animation

 

[Winter]

What is there to question? I explained why I used it as it saves time rather than letting the guy try and shoot my level 99 post game Hero with max hp until I get to critical health just to get the dodge and counter animation

The keyword being “was” I said I was questioning your use of back atcha. I understood when you reexplained it. Though “I know” wasn't the best way to approach that I didn’t read the reasoning the first time.

 

[Winter]

I still need the Mortamor feat evaluated

 

[Winter]

Bump

 

[Winter]

Bump

 

[Winter]

Bump 2

 

[Winter]

Bumple

 

[Winter]

Kabump

 

[Winter]

Kabumple

 

[Winter]

Kinda forget about the ability lists. I’ll get back to those when I can. In the meantime, can anyone give input on the 2-B Mortamor feat I explained here. Kinda need it to determine literally the entirety of the end game characters’ tiers. There are a few points but depending on what’s agreed or disagreed, DQ could be either Low 2-C (If points made are entirely disagreed with) , 2-C (If the point about Mortamor stabilizing the Dream World and Real World is accepted but the other isn’t), or 2-B (If the point about Mortamor actively planning to absorb the cosmology with full intentions is accepted, with the assumption he’d be aware of his power and capable of such things).

Yea sure, I can just summarize the point. Also yea, tag a few people too, some staff input would be neat.

Epic Summary:

So the scan says something along the lines of “Mortamor absorbing all other worlds within his own.” The absorbing part isn’t necessarily what’s 2-B since you can’t quantify how many he absorbs at once, but what is 2-B with the feat is the capability to stabilize those worlds. At the absolute minimum, the stabilization is 2-C (since the Dream World and Real World were directly under threat to be absorbed into his world). Since his plan is to absorb all worlds, it’s very likely he’d be able to stabilize those too. Keep in mind, this is HIS plan, so Mortamor knowing his capabilities should very well be capable of stabilizing a realm that big after absorbing all of the other worlds. I see a likely, if not a full out 2-B rating. The cosmology is countless 2-B in size, so he would scale to this.

 

[Winter]

Kazing!

What is there to question? I explained why I used it as it saves time rather than letting the guy try and shoot my level 99 post game Hero with max hp until I get to critical health just to get the dodge and counter animation

5

Could you guys provide any input on the Mortamor thing? As for Armor, could you maybe invite a few more staff for evaluations and stuff?

 

[Armorchompy]

Personally I still don't really know if absorbing universes means sustaining them just because he sustains some others already, given that previously they don't really require any outside input to continue existing.

@Antvasima could i ask you to tag a few people for opinion? Thanks in advance

 

[Winter]

Personally I still don't really know if absorbing universes means sustaining them just because he sustains some others already, given that previously they don't really require any outside input to continue existing.

@Antvasima could i ask you to tag a few people for opinion? Thanks in advance

He doesn’t sustain others already. It’s a matter of Mortamor planning and directly threatening to absorb the Dream and Real Worlds. Him sustaining it means those universes being inside of his realm. Given there’s a statement of him planning to absorb all other universes, him being aware of his own power level, would very likely be capable of sustaining those too.

 

[Winter]

As I think about it more, I feel we could use the Golem’s punch in DQB2 as means to scale all monsters. While B2 is an alternate universe with some of its scaling being independent (mainly the end-game) from the mainline games, the monsters would make sense to stay the same. They are pretty universal in terms of scaling and don’t vary too much with appearances. Though, speaking of the end game scaling, Malroth in builders should probably have seperate scaling and a separate profile from the original. They vary way too differently and Builders isn’t in the same world as the mainline trilogy.


I plan on adding to the abilities and hax list later while we wait on others to comment on the Mortamor thing. Here’s said Golem feat:



23:28

This is a specifically much weaker Golem, while others (recruited and said Golem when he’s stronger) can destroy much harder material with much more stamina. The rock is Umber and I’m estimating each block is 1 meter on all sides given a medieval torch is around 1 meter long and said item in the game is also around the same size.

 

[Armorchompy]

That seems fair, yeah. I'd prefer to pixel scale the blocks, though, are all blocks in the game the same size?

 

[Winter]

That seems fair, yeah. I'd prefer to pixel scale the blocks, though, are all blocks in the game the same size?

For the most part, but you don’t need to worry about the other ones since the entire wall is made of the same block. The other ones are mostly just structures that aren’t blocks.

 

[Armorchompy]

Mostly asking that because to pixel scale them I'd need to use ones that are about as far from the POV as the characters I'd scale them off of, so it'd require using ones that don't get destroyed

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I think scaling common monsters interchangeably across different universes is fine.

 

[Armorchompy]

I'd also agree yeah. That said isn't the golem kinda late game in most DQs? I remember it was in my final team in DQV at least.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Golem is a mid game boss in the original Dragon Quest that's blocking a path to a town.

 

[Winter]

I'd also agree yeah. That said isn't the golem kinda late game in most DQs? I remember it was in my final team in DQV at least.

It ultimately depends on the game. Recruitable monsters are their own thing since they grow and level with the team. Golems are pretty consistently mid-game, with the ones in DQ5 kinda being around that point since it’s the first place you go in the era

 

[Winter]

Mostly asking that because to pixel scale them I'd need to use ones that are about as far from the POV as the characters I'd scale them off of, so it'd require using ones that don't get destroyed

I mean, that’s fine, I just need a calc for it

 

[Armorchompy]

I should probably be capable of providing that before the heat death of the universe

 

[Abysswalker2126]

It ultimately depends on the game. Recruitable monsters are their own thing since they grow and level with the team. Golems are pretty consistently mid-game, with the ones in DQ5 kinda being around that point since it’s the first place you go in the era

In DQ9 Golems can be only found in areas that you gain access to after you get a ship which is mid game but in that game trolls can also be encountered mid game after getting a ship and their entry says that Trolls are able to level mountains

It also doesn’t really mean much either considering how the paladin Vocation is also unlocked mid game along with Solar Flair which we have at tier 4 in AP

 

[Winter]

In DQ9 Golems can be only found in areas that you gain access to after you get a ship which is mid game but in that game trolls can also be encountered mid game after getting a ship and their entry says that Trolls are able to level mountains

It also doesn’t really mean much either considering how the paladin Vocation is also unlocked mid game along with Solar Flair which we have at tier 4 in AP

Keep in mind the monsters in scaling terms will be composited as a species, similar with Pokémon. If one showing is stronger than the other, it’d still make sense to prefer consistency over the strongest rating. I’d have to look into it more.

Monsters are the fodder enemies, they have no reason to scale to the heroes.

 

[Winter]

I should probably be capable of providing that before the heat death of the universe

How’s the calc coming along

 

[Armorchompy]

it uh

isn't


but the universe is doing alright too

i'll get to it rq

 

[Armorchompy]

Oh one more thing, do you know the specific material that the blocks destroyed are made of? Given the genre I feel like there might be a chance it's something more detailed than just "rock"

Also, known height/age of spiky black hair dude on the left?

 

[Armorchompy]

Well, here's the calc as is, if any of the above are known I'll just edit it

 

[Winter]

Oh one more thing, do you know the specific material that the blocks destroyed are made of? Given the genre I feel like there might be a chance it's something more detailed than just "rock"

I specified it was umber earlier

Also, known height/age of spiky black hair dude on the left?

Malroth is kinda hard to figure out since height is never specified and he isn’t really human to begin with. The builder on the other hand is very consistently portrayed as young and is pretty childish at times. Not sure what age to pinpoint, but I would guess around early teenage years if that helps. Might be wrong

 

[Winter]

Well, here's the calc as is, if any of the above are known I'll just edit it

I listed those, so if you can edit it, that be cool

 

[Armorchompy]

Uh I can't find any values for umber rock but I've redone it using 14 yo height

 

[Winter]

Uh I can't find any values for umber rock but I've redone it using 14 yo height

What values do you need? I can help look

 

[Armorchompy]

shear strength, compressive strength and tensile strength can all work, with the note that first and last will be a bit of a lowball

 

[Winter]

shear strength, compressive strength and tensile strength can all work, with the note that first and last will be a bit of a lowball

Sorry for answering back late, I was making a map for a game. I can try to look for these now

 

[Winter]

shear strength, compressive strength and tensile strength can all work, with the note that first and last will be a bit of a lowball

This might help https://www.sandatlas.org/umber/

Didn’t have time to read it through, but it’s a page about the actual rock. Saw a few things involving the things you asked for at a glance