Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,251
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I spend my entire power scaling life until this day and still have no idea who the hell is Seth, and literally don't care about him, until this drama came out
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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100
- Thread starter Warren_Valion
- Start date
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OUTLIER OUTLIER OUTLIER.
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I tend to stay out of this topic, but I'll give my take on it real quick.
The fact of the matter is that MAX Power/Buff Roshi has no anti-feats that contradict this. In fact his only other feat in OG DB is destroying Mount Fry Pan. And no other characters concretely scale to his buff form before King Piccolo, who also has no anti-feats against this. While it isn't a consistent feat, it also isn't as inconsistent as people say, at least in terms of contradictive evidence, there isn't much against it.
But I do personally think it makes more sense for it to be an outlier, as the general implication given by the series and guidebooks is that Goku and Piccolo had reached that level around the 23rd Budokai and into the start of Z where they didn't grow by that much, which feels more appropriate with the Saiyan Saga top tier's then being planet level. And then you have that Buff Roshi destroying Mount Fry Pan and being tired afterwards is fairly consistent with King Piccolo's stronger but not inconceivably stronger city busting feats and statements. And of course, in addition to all of this there is the simple fact that Buff Roshi never performs a feat comprehensibly close to this anywhere else, the only exception being his scaling in DBS, but he explicitly says he trained so it's not like that's relevant. The only thing actually in favor of the feat is that it never gets retconned, it stays and is actually mentioned again both in-universe and by Toriyama in a Q/A. Even if it's somewhat inconsistent, the fact that it remains a plot point years later still gives it credibility. It isn't some random feat that happened in a fight, it was an entire plot point in the story.
Tbh, I think Roshi being moon level is silly, but that's a subjective take. From an objective powerscaling standpoint I truly can't see a definitive debunking argument against it. The only argument is that it isn't very consistent, but that isn't good enough to say it's an outlier.
The fact of the matter is that MAX Power/Buff Roshi has no anti-feats that contradict this. In fact his only other feat in OG DB is destroying Mount Fry Pan. And no other characters concretely scale to his buff form before King Piccolo, who also has no anti-feats against this. While it isn't a consistent feat, it also isn't as inconsistent as people say, at least in terms of contradictive evidence, there isn't much against it.
But I do personally think it makes more sense for it to be an outlier, as the general implication given by the series and guidebooks is that Goku and Piccolo had reached that level around the 23rd Budokai and into the start of Z where they didn't grow by that much, which feels more appropriate with the Saiyan Saga top tier's then being planet level. And then you have that Buff Roshi destroying Mount Fry Pan and being tired afterwards is fairly consistent with King Piccolo's stronger but not inconceivably stronger city busting feats and statements. And of course, in addition to all of this there is the simple fact that Buff Roshi never performs a feat comprehensibly close to this anywhere else, the only exception being his scaling in DBS, but he explicitly says he trained so it's not like that's relevant. The only thing actually in favor of the feat is that it never gets retconned, it stays and is actually mentioned again both in-universe and by Toriyama in a Q/A. Even if it's somewhat inconsistent, the fact that it remains a plot point years later still gives it credibility. It isn't some random feat that happened in a fight, it was an entire plot point in the story.
Tbh, I think Roshi being moon level is silly, but that's a subjective take. From an objective powerscaling standpoint I truly can't see a definitive debunking argument against it. The only argument is that it isn't very consistent, but that isn't good enough to say it's an outlier.
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TBF while Piccolo's feat no longer has a calc and is just Moon level. It does have it's speed calculated being at 0.54341588539896 Sol. In contrast Master Roshi Moon feat is calculated at 0.0986 Sol. Piccolo also preformed said feat with one arm instead of him using two arms (Demon explosive wave) and Dbz does have the speed in relation to power of course I'm not going say to use it to multiple how much stronger Piccolo is to Roshi, but rhe implication his feat > Roshi feat is there.
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I'm screaming 
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why isn’t there a calc for the manga version? I always wondered why toeiverse calc is large planetary but piccolo had no calc for his manga version
- 12,830
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There was when I was around the site 3 years ago, but something happened and no one seems to want to calculate it anymore. I'm guessing there is a good reason. (Considering how popular DBZ is)
Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,251
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Tbh here Roshi feat is extremely blatant, and Akira himself stated already, larger the ki mean stronger the power and faster the speed, if Roshi can dish out a Ki blast that destroyed the Moon, no reason to assume it is outlier
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OUTLIER!!!!
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,822
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To be fair, at the time of the Mount Fry Pan fire, Roshi was in a disgusting state. Tagged by Chi-Chi, taken out by motion sickness, skin and bones beyond reason, and wearing pain relief patches on his back. As Jackie Chun, Roshi presented a considerably better physique, befitting of a master of martial arts, and a clear indication that he was in a combat-suitable state.
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I see that makes me wonder why the calc isnt for the manga version as well
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I think he also suggested if not outright stated that he trained a bit before the tournament so that he wouldn't lose to Goku, because Roshi wanted to make sure Goku tasted defeat so he wouldn't think he was already the strongest and slack off on his own training. I can definitely get behind this.
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Seth's next video finna be "Can a powerscaler escape prison?".
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There was a good reason why we don't use the anime timeframe for the manga, I forgot though lol =P (though I know it was a good reason)
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The timeframes different in the manga? I see I didn’t know that
Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,251
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Not really, because Z anime belong to different continuity on the wiki (Toeiverse) and manga have no timeframe due to only having static images, while anime scene is animated thus we can calc timeframe
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He folds Seth in 2 seconds.
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Even MoistCritikal is tackling this situation. Also his subscriber count has gone down by like 30k in the past couple days. The grave for Seth's career is being digged as we speak.
Edit: Should someone make a thread about this topic? Cause using the DBS discussion thread for it doesn't seem appropriate. But at the same time I think it's relevant enough given Seth's popularity in the powerscaling community and the fact that probably almost every user of this website knows him.
Edit: Should someone make a thread about this topic? Cause using the DBS discussion thread for it doesn't seem appropriate. But at the same time I think it's relevant enough given Seth's popularity in the powerscaling community and the fact that probably almost every user of this website knows him.
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Does the timeframe affect ap since the toeiverse is calced at 5-A
Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,251
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Yes, the reason for 5-A due to how fast the fragments of the moon flying when it explode, it mean the force that was produced by the ki blast is extremely strong to make the fragments fly that fast
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,822
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The TV anime's calculation applies the kinetic energy formula to the mass of the Moon, because the fragments were scattered across space.
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Still don't know why we don't calc the pulverization or vaporization of the moon though, is it just not worth it?
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It's the same or barely a difference actually
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Then shouldn't we use that over just putting moon level?
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No because it's redundant to put a Moon busting calc that'll still be baseline Moon level
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That's good, I guess. He always came across as a bit mean-sprited back in the day and it only seemed like he quieted down a bit once he got his videos sponsored. Shame it turns out he apparently really was just a gigantic prick
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It be like that
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Yeah. I was sure he had retained every bit of his toxicity, and apparently he did. But he was smart enough to know that putting a lid on it would make him more money.
STP445
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I see thanks
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want to refute even Master Roshi of being Lua? bro, the guy destroyed a moon, how is that not a moon??? 
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,822
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CAN WE CAN THE CRTS FOR ONE DAY?
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Outlierwant to refute even Master Roshi of being Lua? bro, the guy destroyed a moon, how is that not a moon???
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saw what? Now they will say outlier for everything ?
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you're my brother and you can't do that
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Reminds me of Jin Kazama when he sat on his throne
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