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Deltarune Chapter 2 discussion!

ZillertheBucko said:
More damage is equivalent to more AP
Doing 100 damage to an enemy means they lose 100 out of their 1000 hp
If the 1000 hp enemy is 9-C while the player is 8-C then-
Click to expand...
Then the 8-C AP player would not do 100 damage, but enough damage to one shot the 9-C durability enemy. Your argument is self-contradictory. If the player is doing 100 damage to a 9-C enemy with 1000 HP, the player themselves are 9-C, otherwise they'd one shot.
 
ShockingPsychic said:
I am going to attempt (and likely fail miserably at) calcing Kris jumping halfway across their bathroom at the end of Chapter 2. It's probably nothing more than slightly higher into 10-B, but a number is better than baseline lol

Any help on where to start would be appreciated.
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It is not. It might even be 10-C imo.
 
1. That is pain tolerance not stamina
2. Pain tolerance doesn't count as stamina anymore
3. You said stamina not injury tolerance, those are two different things
 
Also, injury tolerance IS NOT PAIN TOLERANCE. Which is why both have different sections in the stamina page.

Injury =/= Pain.

Injury causes pain.
 
That HP being stamina kinda doesn't make sense, can we just ignore this subject because of the vagity of it?
 
Oh also HP being stamina kinda doesn't work (lance getting tired at low HP while other characters can fine perfectly fine even at low HP)
 
GodlyCharmander said:
Then the 8-C AP player would not do 100 damage, but enough damage to one shot the 9-C durability enemy. Your argument is self-contradictory. If the player is doing 100 damage to a 9-C enemy with 1000 HP, the player themselves are 9-C, otherwise they'd one shot.
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I am not sure what you're trying to communicate anymore but
more damage is more AP, more AP you can take is more durability, so of course the character with 1000 hp would get one shot
 
ZillertheBucko said:
I am not sure what you're trying to communicate anymore but
more damage is more AP, more AP you can take is more durability, so of course the character with 1000 hp would get one shot
Click to expand...
Therefore HP is unrelated to Durability in any significant way, and this argument is moot.

Literally, what about this is too complicated for you to understand?
 
GodlyCharmander said:
Therefore HP is unrelated to Durability in any significant way, and this argument is moot.

Literally, what about this is too complicated for you to understand?
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I'm saying that yes, it would do more than enough damage to one shot the 9-C enemy
you're confusing yourself which is confusing me now
also it's worth noting that beating spamton neo through violence doesn't even drain his stamina, he continues with trying to launch another attack but the robot body just explodes
and Jevil doesn't get tired until after using his final chaos, while at very low hp he fakes being tired only to launch one of his strongest attacks
and although it's undertale, sans loses all of his stamina without losing any hp at all until you hit him. HP is not NEARLY as correlated to stamina as it is to durability. if you have more hp you can survive stronger attacks
 
ZillertheBucko said:
I'm saying that yes, it would do more than enough damage to one shot the 9-C enemy
you're confusing yourself which is confusing me now.
Click to expand...
No you didn't say that.
More damage is equivalent to more AP
Click to expand...
Doing 100 damage to an enemy means they lose 100 out of their 1000 hp
If the 1000 hp enemy is 9-C while the player is 8-C

Try again.
ZillertheBucko said:
also it's worth noting that beating spamton neo through violence doesn't even drain his stamina, he continues with trying to launch another attack but the robot body just explodes.
Click to expand...
Because it was damaged as you have depleted your HP. He is a robot, so obviously he can just ignore his own injuries and keep going.
Health points indicates one's state of health in a battle. The more health you have, means you can withstand damage for longer. That's stamina.
ZillertheBucko said:
and Jevil doesn't get tired until after using his final chaos, while at very low hp he fakes being tired only to launch one of his strongest attacks
and although it's undertale, sans loses all of his stamina without losing any hp at all until you hit him.
Click to expand...
He gets sleepy without losing any HP. And you do know Stamina can correlate to more than one attribute right?

Running for 10 hours straight is stamina.
But sustaining damage and injuries and keep going is also stamina. They do not have to correlate to each other.

Literally read the Stamina page, why do you keep arguing about Stamina when you DON'T KNOW WHAT THE PAGE SAYS

Jevil got tired by exerting himself. That's completely different from getting his health weakened. And yet, both are a showcase of stamina.
ZillertheBucko said:
HP is not NEARLY as correlated to stamina as it is to durability.
Click to expand...
It is correlated to stamina, you're just ignorant about what constitutes stamina in the first place.
ZillertheBucko said:
if you have more hp you can survive stronger attacks
Click to expand...
Oh wow Sherlock, did you figure out this on your own?
 
GodlyCharmander said:
Doing 100 damage to an enemy means they lose 100 out of their 1000 hp
If the 1000 hp enemy is 9-C while the player is 8-C
Click to expand...
yes, I'm using this to represent your OWN logic, in other words doing more damage means you have a higher AP, so an 8-C character would do way more to the 9-C enemy and one shot them, if hp WAS stamina then that would mean a lower tier character with higher hp could tank higher tiered attacks
the fact that damage and health go 1/1 means that if damage is AP, hp is Durability
GodlyCharmander said:
He gets sleepy without losing any HP. And you do know Stamina can correlate to more than one attribute right?

Running for 10 hours straight is stamina.
But sustaining damage and injuries and keep going is also stamina. They do not have to correlate to each other.

Literally read the Stamina page, why do you keep arguing about Stamina when you DON'T KNOW WHAT THE PAGE SAYS

Jevil got tired by exerting himself. That's completely different from getting his health weakened. And yet, both are a showcase of stamina.

It is correlated to stamina, you're just ignorant about what constitutes stamina in the first place.

Oh wow Sherlock, did you figure out this on your own?
Click to expand...
yes, it can correlate to more than one thing, but that would be reflected by hp. if stamina was hp then getting tired would lower your hp, as well as lowering your hp making you tired
if hp was stamina then spamton neo would have infinite hp due to being a robot
I know what stamina is, and it's not hp
GodlyCharmander said:
QuasiYuri, a Thread Moderator, confirms HP as Stamina.

A Retired Staff says HP's meaning is abroad, usually meaning physical punishment or stamina, but never durability.

DDM, an admin, confirms HP is stamina.

This was also in a thread approving stamina's ratings. So yeah, this argument is done.
Click to expand...
do you actually think I care? a mod saying bananas are yellow wouldn't make it true, an admin saying it wouldn't make it true, albert einstein saying it wouldn't make it true either. mods are not omniscience beings, this is just getting fallacious. Try backing up your argument without resorting to what mommy said is true, bucko
on top of that, hp's purpose can literally change depending on the verse. Stop.
 
anyways I think I've figured out what the knight is
since chara on a genocide route takes a player's soul, they theoretically would be able to use the vessel created by the player in deltarune which coincidentally needs an extra soul and is also saved after being fake discarded
I put this theory in a server and I think I may have predicted the knight properly this time, I'd put a few bucks on it tbh
 
ZillertheBucko said:
If hp WAS stamina then that would mean a lower tier character with higher hp could tank higher tiered attacks
Click to expand...
No because their durability would still hinder their capability of withstanding said attacks.
And a character which is low tier wouldn't have unreasonably bhigh HP in the first place because it would be unbalanced, ******* hell.
ZillertheBucko said:
the fact that damage and health go 1/1 means that if damage is AP, hp is Durability.
Click to expand...
They don't. Defense, Attack and Damage go 1/1.
Health just means you're enduring more attacks.
ZillertheBucko said:
yes, it can correlate to more than one thing, but that would be reflected by hp.
Click to expand...
"This non-combat correlation of stamina would be reflected by HP because I say it would."

Literally the sleepy effect.
ZillertheBucko said:
do you actually think I care? a mod saying bananas are yellow wouldn't make it true, an admin saying it wouldn't make it true, albert einstein saying it wouldn't make it true either. mods are not omniscience beings, this is just getting fallacious.
Click to expand...
That's how stamina is viewed on the wiki. Don't like it, GET OUT.
ZillertheBucko said:
Try backing up your argument without resorting to what mommy said is true, bucko
Click to expand...
Aight, now that you're at that level.

You're saying the capability of enduring hits for longer is not related to ******* endurance, that's absolutely ******* STUPID. Your argument is imbecile, and you're expecting a nuanced response for these ******* atrocious points? No. Bring up an actual ******* reasoning, you don't even know what the **** you're arguing for anymore. Regardless of the conclusion, Chapter 1 character will not scale to Chapter 2 character, what the **** do you plan here?
ZillertheBucko said:
on top of that, hp's purpose can literally change depending on the verse. Stop.
Click to expand...
I presented evidence and their arguments, also their words means that HP is viewed as stamina on the wiki. Make a CRT.
 
I don’t really care about changing the profiles honestly, controversial crts are something I am NEVER doing again, I just felt like expressing my views
 
anyways back to chara
We all remember that they say "It's time we erased this world and moved on to the next" But what could the next refer to? they were reluctant to bring the world back after erasing it, so it likely was not an undertale timeline. In other words, it was a deltarune timeline. the knight, it's gonna cause a roaring to destroy the world.
chara could just as easily be trying to destroy the deltarune world as well.
Also one of their last lines is related to the whole deltarune theme of control, and that means there’s a good chance they’re the one that interrupts the vessel creation, and likely uses the soul they obtained to use the vessel themselves.
So here’s my theory, Chara from the genocide timeline travels to the world of deltarune, uses a vessel with their own soul, and then tries to cause the roaring. Boom, the knight solved
 
ZillertheBucko said:
anyways back to chara
We all remember that they say "It's time we erased this world and moved on to the next" But what could the next refer to? they were reluctant to bring the world back after erasing it, so it likely was not an undertale timeline. In other words, it was a deltarune timeline. the knight, it's gonna cause a roaring to destroy the world.
chara could just as easily be trying to destroy the deltarune world as well.
Also one of their last lines is related to the whole deltarune theme of control, and that means there’s a good chance they’re the one that interrupts the vessel creation, and likely uses the soul they obtained to use the vessel themselves.
So here’s my theory, Chara from the genocide timeline travels to the world of deltarune, uses a vessel with their own soul, and then tries to cause the roaring. Boom, the knight solved
Click to expand...
hahha that is just chaos
 
Do you guys think Spamton will be mentioned in other chapters or do you think his story has ended and will never be brought up again?

Personally I think Spamton will at least be mentioned by someone in another chapter and will have neat pieces of dialogue or something like that when you try to equip Dealmaker (or puppet scarf) to someone similarly to how DEVILSKNIFE “smiles” when equipped to Noelle.

Also what do you guys think the significance of Shadow Crystal’s are?
 
The_Almighty_Wholesome said:
Do you guys think Spamton will be mentioned in other chapters or do you think his story has ended and will never be brought up again?

Personally I think Spamton will at least be mentioned by someone in another chapter and will have neat pieces of dialogue or something like that when you try to equip Dealmaker (or puppet scarf) to someone similarly to how DEVILSKNIFE “smiles” when equipped to Noelle.

Also what do you guys think the significance of Shadow Crystal’s are?
Click to expand...
Spamton will be in the same boat as Jevil, being talked about by other secret bosses and Seam only and very briefly
Shadow Crystals are too inconsistent for me to say what they’re for
 
If we ever get, hypothetically, lancer or another chapter 1 character beating up a chapter 2 or 3 enemy, would that be enough to get chapter 1 to 9-A?
 
ZillertheBucko said:
I mean the narrative makes me think that Jevil and King wouldn't get AP stomped by a pipis egg but
yknow
Click to expand...
The narrative doesn't really address that, so it's more based on interpretation. We will backscale if the evidence for backscaling comes up, if that's what you want to know.
 
i know believe that the player SOUL is a clump of varies people, three being determined enough to SAVE but one so strong that it can influence and call out people.
 
meh, he's ignoring the fact that susie could just be a weird monster, or that Toby really did forget and that's why he just made the blood sprite unused. I find it much more likely that sans is just a darkner, and possibly used a human soul to enter the light world, no different from spamton's plan to take Kris's soul, and that's why he bleeds
 
Sans being a Darkner doesn't make any sense, especially when we have a much more solid reason to believe the Sans we see in Undertale is a future version of the one in Deltarune. Sans turns into dust, he can't have a human SOUL, it would persist after death, and we would hear a "crack" after he was defeated
 
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