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This thread is intended to clean up some abilities that are not true to the nature of the characters or add justification for missing reasoning for profiles that have an ability listed without any further explanation or scans to support it. The BDE section is really a response to Ultima thread:
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For example, Destiny of the Endless realm is disconnected from time and space entirely. Where all things take their “genesis” there. (The Sandman Vol.2 #21) Not to mention Dream’s first incarnation exists in space beyond space in space beneath space. (The Sandman: Overture Vol.1 #2) This especially applies to Dream since he's the reason why reality is defined, to which nothing real nor unreal would exist without him, that even the nothingness is given definition because of him. Hence why a piece of him, a ship, can sail through nothing and nowhere where time and space are null concepts. So both their aspects and keys can get BDE(type 2) and this is their justification.
Plus, Destiny can rent the bonds of time and space. (The Sandman: Overture Vol.1 #5) So, it is safe to say not only are the Endless older than time, space, and dimensions they also can manipulate it given that Destiny and Dream reaches every part of Creation and the Jin En Moks makes it clear Creation is made of time, space, and causality, the real part of reality at least since the Dreaming is timeless which Desire realm exists in a senselessness without time or place. (Vertigo: Winter Edge’s Vol.1 #3) Plus, Dream was sailing out in the Night beyond the worlds and outside time and space. (The Sandman: Oveture Vol.1 #6)
Night and Time is pretty obvious. They both transcend their children and sired every version of them and every version of Creation. Night exists in unspace and untime. Time is not the abstraction concept of “Time” for anyone wondering. He is the single moment of every possible moment in every possibility, existing outside causality and far above his children seeing them all as one single continuum, detached completely from Creation. Their profile already lists these reasons and can be used as justification.
Now, for Yahweh’s family which is abit easier than the Endless.
Lucifer will shape time and space. This is obvious considering he and Michael made Creation which bounds even beings like the Jin En Mok to time, space, and causality. (Lucifer Vol.1 #7) Lucifer literally stated he could make time, space, and infinity out of any material given. (Lucifer Vol.1 #20)
Not to mention Yahweh is the absolute point of Creation where time, space, and distance amount to 0 to him. (Lucifer Vol.1 #31) This would apply to Elaine Belloc and Lucifer, given their both creators of their Creation and the Universe express their will. (Lucifer Vol.1 #27) Elaine compares herself to Lucifer, even after Godhood explaining that he is her peer and not a lesser. Also, Lucifer literally bent time and space using the Gate holding Yahweh’s name which was infinite. (Lucifer Vol.1 #20) Plus, he literally created time in his Creation(which the Basanos used time itself against him to which he created) and taught Elaine to push the absence of space to make “space” for her Creation. (Lucifer Vol.1 #57) Elaine sees the Universe as just a small Ant with her mind comparing it as the sun, thinking to hard would break it like what Lucifer did to the Mansions of Silence which contained infinite failed Creations. (Lucifer Vol.1 #73) Angels also existed in time before the time which Lucifer and Michael are the oldest of the angels predating both the Silver City and the Host of Heaven(both existing before the dawn of time, this would apply to space as well).
Yahweh, Elaine, Lucifer, and Michael all predate, produced, and transcend the concept of time and space rather easily. Their BDE is justified. Also, a Void profile is put:
vsbattles.fandom.com
Pralaya and the Divine Presence are rather obvious. Pralaya is the sea of eternity, God’s unconscious, sea of nothingness that exists before and beyond time, space, sanity, and form. While the Divine Presence easily transcends all that as well. (Spectre Vol.4 #10)
Non-Duality(Type 3):
Ascaulity(Type 5):
As for Pralaya:
She should get type 2 for her avatar as a projection of the Sea of Brahma, she still occupies every dual system while also being outside it all. She's a voidless being but a finite aspect of her truer self.
She should get type 3 for her true form being the infinite unmanifest nothingness. So the Sea of Brahma transcends all forms of duality, lacks any form of duality, isn't in any duality, and is outside all dual systems. (Doctor Fate Vol.2 #6 & Justice League Dark Vol.1 #39)
Also, the Sea of Brahma is an infinite ocean of nothingness which is beginningless and endless thus time, causes-and-effect, nor words have any meaning when you're in literal non-existence. (Doctor Fate Vol.2 #3 & #6) (Justice League Dark Vol.1 #37 & #38)
Ultima Reality/sandbox
vsbattles.fandom.com
Beyond Dimensional-Existence & Time and Space Manipulation:
The Endless members need a proper fix because despite the fact that they have BDE(type 2), it needs actual justification.For example, Destiny of the Endless realm is disconnected from time and space entirely. Where all things take their “genesis” there. (The Sandman Vol.2 #21) Not to mention Dream’s first incarnation exists in space beyond space in space beneath space. (The Sandman: Overture Vol.1 #2) This especially applies to Dream since he's the reason why reality is defined, to which nothing real nor unreal would exist without him, that even the nothingness is given definition because of him. Hence why a piece of him, a ship, can sail through nothing and nowhere where time and space are null concepts. So both their aspects and keys can get BDE(type 2) and this is their justification.
Plus, Destiny can rent the bonds of time and space. (The Sandman: Overture Vol.1 #5) So, it is safe to say not only are the Endless older than time, space, and dimensions they also can manipulate it given that Destiny and Dream reaches every part of Creation and the Jin En Moks makes it clear Creation is made of time, space, and causality, the real part of reality at least since the Dreaming is timeless which Desire realm exists in a senselessness without time or place. (Vertigo: Winter Edge’s Vol.1 #3) Plus, Dream was sailing out in the Night beyond the worlds and outside time and space. (The Sandman: Oveture Vol.1 #6)
Night and Time is pretty obvious. They both transcend their children and sired every version of them and every version of Creation. Night exists in unspace and untime. Time is not the abstraction concept of “Time” for anyone wondering. He is the single moment of every possible moment in every possibility, existing outside causality and far above his children seeing them all as one single continuum, detached completely from Creation. Their profile already lists these reasons and can be used as justification.
Now, for Yahweh’s family which is abit easier than the Endless.
Lucifer will shape time and space. This is obvious considering he and Michael made Creation which bounds even beings like the Jin En Mok to time, space, and causality. (Lucifer Vol.1 #7) Lucifer literally stated he could make time, space, and infinity out of any material given. (Lucifer Vol.1 #20)
Not to mention Yahweh is the absolute point of Creation where time, space, and distance amount to 0 to him. (Lucifer Vol.1 #31) This would apply to Elaine Belloc and Lucifer, given their both creators of their Creation and the Universe express their will. (Lucifer Vol.1 #27) Elaine compares herself to Lucifer, even after Godhood explaining that he is her peer and not a lesser. Also, Lucifer literally bent time and space using the Gate holding Yahweh’s name which was infinite. (Lucifer Vol.1 #20) Plus, he literally created time in his Creation(which the Basanos used time itself against him to which he created) and taught Elaine to push the absence of space to make “space” for her Creation. (Lucifer Vol.1 #57) Elaine sees the Universe as just a small Ant with her mind comparing it as the sun, thinking to hard would break it like what Lucifer did to the Mansions of Silence which contained infinite failed Creations. (Lucifer Vol.1 #73) Angels also existed in time before the time which Lucifer and Michael are the oldest of the angels predating both the Silver City and the Host of Heaven(both existing before the dawn of time, this would apply to space as well).
Yahweh, Elaine, Lucifer, and Michael all predate, produced, and transcend the concept of time and space rather easily. Their BDE is justified. Also, a Void profile is put:
VeryGoofyToddler2/Sandbox
vsbattles.fandom.com
Pralaya and the Divine Presence are rather obvious. Pralaya is the sea of eternity, God’s unconscious, sea of nothingness that exists before and beyond time, space, sanity, and form. While the Divine Presence easily transcends all that as well. (Spectre Vol.4 #10)
Non-Duality(Type 3) & Acasuality(Type 5):
The Divine Presence and Pralaya should have this.Non-Duality(Type 3):
God is neither A(neither dual), nor not A (not dual), nor both A and not A(not both opposite and not opposite), nor neither A(neither not opposite) nor not A(neither both not opposite). It is 0 so that's obvious. Beyond all dualities, division, and change. So no amount of combination of systems of dual(any or all) applies to it.
Ascaulity(Type 5):
I could explain but the Divine Presence is 0 since 0 automatically gets this as stated above.
As for Pralaya:
She should get type 2 for her avatar as a projection of the Sea of Brahma, she still occupies every dual system while also being outside it all. She's a voidless being but a finite aspect of her truer self.
She should get type 3 for her true form being the infinite unmanifest nothingness. So the Sea of Brahma transcends all forms of duality, lacks any form of duality, isn't in any duality, and is outside all dual systems. (Doctor Fate Vol.2 #6 & Justice League Dark Vol.1 #39)
Also, the Sea of Brahma is an infinite ocean of nothingness which is beginningless and endless thus time, causes-and-effect, nor words have any meaning when you're in literal non-existence. (Doctor Fate Vol.2 #3 & #6) (Justice League Dark Vol.1 #37 & #38)
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