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Broly vs. Vegito Blue.
- Thread starter Omegas03
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Vegito Blue. In order for base Broly to be able to beat Vegito Blue, Vegito Blue would have to be weaker than base Gogeta. Potara is far superior to fusion dance, and SSB is obviously way way way better than base. It would take a very, very long time for Goku and Vegeta to improve so much that the base form of their fusion dance fusion can be stronger than an earlier version of their Potara fusion at full power. It hasn't even been two years since the Zamasu incident in-universe. I see no indication that their base forms are stronger now than their Blue forms were during the Zamasu arc.
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That was stated back in the Buu arc.
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It was never stated in what aspect it was superior and currently its only superior in time limit, even back then there were statements that said Gogeta and Vegetto are equal and both could win against eachother.
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- Thread starter
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I think there's not much to be said now, match is already over.
Anyways, I expected Broly to win, but I thought this was going less decisive lol and more on par. Can't f**** believe how strong are Goku and Vegeta by this point of DBS.
Anyways Imagine if Goku's Base form in the next arc surpasses Gogeta Blue lol.
Anyways, I expected Broly to win, but I thought this was going less decisive lol and more on par. Can't f**** believe how strong are Goku and Vegeta by this point of DBS.
Anyways Imagine if Goku's Base form in the next arc surpasses Gogeta Blue lol.
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Fusion also got undone before the time limit for Gotenks because "too much power", but Gogeta didn't have the problem.JackJoyce said:
It's best not to use those instance as a guide.
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I actually really like that image, but the OP one would go along with the other drawn pics better.
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Jesus Christ I'm never going to understand the absurd scaling most of you guys use here.
This should be a One-sided stomp in favor of Vegetto but since this site is weird apparently Base Broly (1st appearance)>SSB Vegetto, Fused Zamasu, SSJ Kefla, Anilaza, SSJ Rose Goku Black, Base Toppo, Android 17, True Golden Freeza, Ultimate Gohan, SSJ Rage Trunks (even with Sword of Hope), Future Zamasu, and Berserker Kale. All of this despite the fact Broly had no experience fighting or much training and wasn't regarded as much until he accessed his Ikari rage state. But obviously, Goku got millions of times more powerful between the Future Trunks Arc and Broly movie so that his current Base/Super Saiyan>Blue Vegetto. Obviously.
Vote for Vegetto, not like it matters.
This should be a One-sided stomp in favor of Vegetto but since this site is weird apparently Base Broly (1st appearance)>SSB Vegetto, Fused Zamasu, SSJ Kefla, Anilaza, SSJ Rose Goku Black, Base Toppo, Android 17, True Golden Freeza, Ultimate Gohan, SSJ Rage Trunks (even with Sword of Hope), Future Zamasu, and Berserker Kale. All of this despite the fact Broly had no experience fighting or much training and wasn't regarded as much until he accessed his Ikari rage state. But obviously, Goku got millions of times more powerful between the Future Trunks Arc and Broly movie so that his current Base/Super Saiyan>Blue Vegetto. Obviously.
Vote for Vegetto, not like it matters.
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Do you know what a Zenkai is?
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@SuperDragoon978
First of all this thread is long since over, you can't vote, secondly Vegetto being relevant outside just one episode is laughable to begin with since Trunks with the Spirit Sword is stronger. Third Broly scales to a ToP Goku who fought Jiren who while heavily supressed is stated stronger than Merged Zamasu who is comparable or stronger than Vegetto.
First of all this thread is long since over, you can't vote, secondly Vegetto being relevant outside just one episode is laughable to begin with since Trunks with the Spirit Sword is stronger. Third Broly scales to a ToP Goku who fought Jiren who while heavily supressed is stated stronger than Merged Zamasu who is comparable or stronger than Vegetto.
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The fact that Base Broly could take on Post-ToP SS1 Vegeta is enough to say he's one of the strongest 3-As in Dragon Ball.
Also we never said Post-ToP Base/SS1 > Future Trunks Saga Vegito. We just said they seem to be roughly even in AP due to multipliers and a rather large scaling chain. The reason Broly won was due to his zenkai boosts.
Also the match is already over and added.
Also we never said Post-ToP Base/SS1 > Future Trunks Saga Vegito. We just said they seem to be roughly even in AP due to multipliers and a rather large scaling chain. The reason Broly won was due to his zenkai boosts.
Also the match is already over and added.
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I agree with you 200%. These people have no clue what they're talking about.SuperDragoon978 said:
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Instead of antagonizing, can you ask for a explanation on why we use said scaling ?
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>Vegetto should be stomping Broly because i said so
>Said Vegetto lost to Merged Zamasu who lost to Future Trunks with Spirit Sword who is fodder to heavily supressed Jiren
Keep the meme up boys
>Said Vegetto lost to Merged Zamasu who lost to Future Trunks with Spirit Sword who is fodder to heavily supressed Jiren
Keep the meme up boys
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Even if what you said was true, base Broly is below Merged Zamasu, Future Trunks w/sword and supressed Jiren.LightinAnt said:
Hell, let's put it like this. How much stronger has Vegeta gotten since Vegito's appearance? He got a zenkai boost from after the Future Trunks arc, another one in the time chamber before ToP and another one after ToP, how much stronger he's gotten is unknown if at all considering what he said before the U6 tournament.
"Three years? You'd really stay that long? What's the point in that? As far as I can tell we're near the limit of our strength, doesn't matter how long we train, we'll still only gain a little."
You're telling me that those 3 boosts made SSJ Vegeta comparable to SSB Vegito? SSB Vegito is at least ten thousand times stronger than SSJ Vegeta of the same arc . Three boosts are not enough, not even close for him to be comparable in SSJ. Vegito SSB is roughly equal SSBE Vegeta post ToP, probably weaker.
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His Base was able to eventually able to force Vegeta to turn SSG n the span of a few minutes [ about 10 ] of fighting , which is only minimally weaker than SSB Vegeta who scales above Suppressed Jiren [ Durong his fight with UIO 1st Goku] by a crapton. He was not that much weaker and tanked a Fully Powered Blast from Vegeta. So he would be able to eventually edge it out that way ... And Vegito's cocky nature during the Trunks Arc would allow him ample time to do so.
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I skimmed through but maybe i missed stuff
has anyone mentioned the fact Broly was fighting golden freeza for AN HOUR in the movie before Gogeta finally arrived? and when he did Freeza didnt even look particularly tired
Broly is basically a berserker, meaning he's always fighting at absolute maximum potential trying his best to kill the opponent at all points. he was unable to do anything relevant to Freeza in an hour of doing that...thats an eternity for characters that move billions of times above lightspeed. its also more time than the entire Tournament of power...
after seeing the movie, Broly didnt look particularly all that strong to me.he also tried to attack Whis at one point right before Gogeta arrived and Whis was just joking around. he never considered Broly even remotely threatening like he did with Jiren.( i've also seem ppl elsewhere suggesting Broly might be above Jiren which makes no sense.)
is Vegitto Blue from Zamasu arc not all that much stronger than current golden Freeza?
has anyone mentioned the fact Broly was fighting golden freeza for AN HOUR in the movie before Gogeta finally arrived? and when he did Freeza didnt even look particularly tired
Broly is basically a berserker, meaning he's always fighting at absolute maximum potential trying his best to kill the opponent at all points. he was unable to do anything relevant to Freeza in an hour of doing that...thats an eternity for characters that move billions of times above lightspeed. its also more time than the entire Tournament of power...
after seeing the movie, Broly didnt look particularly all that strong to me.he also tried to attack Whis at one point right before Gogeta arrived and Whis was just joking around. he never considered Broly even remotely threatening like he did with Jiren.( i've also seem ppl elsewhere suggesting Broly might be above Jiren which makes no sense.)
is Vegitto Blue from Zamasu arc not all that much stronger than current golden Freeza?
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Broly fighting Frieza for whole hour is just plot device to make funny fusions moments. Goku and Vegeta couldn't last for even 5 min against Broly and they had to run.
Lol Whiss would school Jiren as well what is your point? Jiren was fighting his students while Broly was attacking Whiss himself.
Lol Whiss would school Jiren as well what is your point? Jiren was fighting his students while Broly was attacking Whiss himself.
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did they really "have" to run? or was that just Goku choosing the least risky option to take out an opponent with a dangerous perk or seemingly getting stronger as he fights? Goku never even tried Kaioken, Vegeta never used his royal blue or whatever that's called form.
aaand if you think Goku acting that way would be out of character, you could just as easily say the plot device was in the other direction. "freeza lasted an hour, Goku and vegeta running was just a plot device to get them to fuse because Gogeta is a fan favorite"
theres no definitive way to prove it in either direction
aaand if you think Goku acting that way would be out of character, you could just as easily say the plot device was in the other direction. "freeza lasted an hour, Goku and vegeta running was just a plot device to get them to fuse because Gogeta is a fan favorite"
theres no definitive way to prove it in either direction
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Actually Goku will very much dip if he figures they have no way to win. He even mentions that nothing that they try will work except Fusion. And that said Frieza was getting the crap kicked outta him for that hour. By the time Gogeta shows up he's stuck in a wall.
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It's like you didn't even watch dragon ball at all.Saitamax said:
Goku is the type who ALWAYS try to enjoy the fight and push himself to the limit even when he's outclassed by his opponents. Even Piccolo said in the movie if Goku, of all people, want to escape then that means the situation is REALLY serious.
Goku isn't an idiot he knows when he has no shot of victory, in fact, an argument can be made that Broly is stronger than Jiren because Jiren didn't make Goku consdier fusion "I am not this is the case, just taking example of how stupid this logic"
Kaio-ken and SSBE are not in this movie because they are Toei original forms and this movie is written by Toriyama.
No, You are the one who is assuming things that go directly against the narrative of the show. Goku tells you nothing will work on Broly aside from fusion, why are twisting the narrative here just to downplay Broly?
>theres no definitive way to prove it in either directio
No. The narrative is pretty clear here, Broly was out of Goku/Vegeta without fusion.
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Bump . While Jiren has the better feats... The fact Broly made Goku flee immediately when Jiren didn't is notable. Plus a couple statements stating superiority to Jiren ontop of this. And the fact Goku was thinking that nothing else sans fusion would work... So that's the reason they didn't use any higher forms of Goku waiting it out until Ultra Instinct showed up. The intent was obvious to make Broly far above Jiren.
Sorry... Rambling Broly should win this comfortably via Vegito's character (if he's weaker by a substantial margin), and Vegito not noticing Broly's a credible threat until it's too late.
Sorry... Rambling Broly should win this comfortably via Vegito's character (if he's weaker by a substantial margin), and Vegito not noticing Broly's a credible threat until it's too late.
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ok i watched the movie again , some important details
1) Goku's initial plan was not fusion, he never even considered fusion until Piccolo told him he had no senzu. at that point he stopped for a few seconds, thought to himself, and was "oh yeah, fusion!". this means Goku believed they could have won just eating senzu and coming back
2) at the very end of the movie, Goku states this about Broly "He's a saiyan like me but probably stronger than Beerus". this might sound great, but this is actually a pretty bad statement for Broly. Goku only ever fought or even saw Beerus in combat while Beerus was using like what, 5% of his power? to this day Goku still doesn't know that Beerus was holding back that much in their fight. the Beerus he's comparing Broly to is an ultra nerfed version. if hes not even sure (he says "probably") that Broly is stronger than that Beerus, you can see how thats not great for Broly
3) Broly never flat out stomped SSB Goku and vegeta (like Jiren did in some instances, for example). they fought for a quick while, Broly got the upper hand then Goku retreated for senzu beams. that quick exchange doesn't work to say Broly was a million times stronger than Goku/Vegeta. especially since Goku planned on coming back. so the fact is, Broly being clearly way stronger, but still unable to kill Golden Freeza in that one hour, doesn't necessarily contradict anything. it might be verging on it though.
lastly, to answer the post above, i dont think there was any intent to make Broly seem stronger than Jiren. again, just look at Whis (and Beerus, at the end of the movie we see he had been following the fight as well) reactions to Broly. they never cared about Broly. Jiren's power made them look worried at points, Beerus straight up looked desperate in some instances. for Broly he remained relaxed taking care of Bra the whole time and just said "looks like they did it" in the end, and went back to taking his nap.
that sort of thing doesn't prove anything of course, thats not what i'm saying. its just that, if were arguing "intent", the intent certainly seems to be to make it look like Whis/Beerus didnt give a rat's ass about Broly while being bewildered by Jiren
1) Goku's initial plan was not fusion, he never even considered fusion until Piccolo told him he had no senzu. at that point he stopped for a few seconds, thought to himself, and was "oh yeah, fusion!". this means Goku believed they could have won just eating senzu and coming back
2) at the very end of the movie, Goku states this about Broly "He's a saiyan like me but probably stronger than Beerus". this might sound great, but this is actually a pretty bad statement for Broly. Goku only ever fought or even saw Beerus in combat while Beerus was using like what, 5% of his power? to this day Goku still doesn't know that Beerus was holding back that much in their fight. the Beerus he's comparing Broly to is an ultra nerfed version. if hes not even sure (he says "probably") that Broly is stronger than that Beerus, you can see how thats not great for Broly
3) Broly never flat out stomped SSB Goku and vegeta (like Jiren did in some instances, for example). they fought for a quick while, Broly got the upper hand then Goku retreated for senzu beams. that quick exchange doesn't work to say Broly was a million times stronger than Goku/Vegeta. especially since Goku planned on coming back. so the fact is, Broly being clearly way stronger, but still unable to kill Golden Freeza in that one hour, doesn't necessarily contradict anything. it might be verging on it though.
lastly, to answer the post above, i dont think there was any intent to make Broly seem stronger than Jiren. again, just look at Whis (and Beerus, at the end of the movie we see he had been following the fight as well) reactions to Broly. they never cared about Broly. Jiren's power made them look worried at points, Beerus straight up looked desperate in some instances. for Broly he remained relaxed taking care of Bra the whole time and just said "looks like they did it" in the end, and went back to taking his nap.
that sort of thing doesn't prove anything of course, thats not what i'm saying. its just that, if were arguing "intent", the intent certainly seems to be to make it look like Whis/Beerus didnt give a rat's ass about Broly while being bewildered by Jiren
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I don't agree with most of your points.
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Bump. Neither do I honestly .
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points 1 and 2 arent really opinions, its just what happened in the movie. Goku teleported to get senzu, not to fuse. and he did make that exact statement comparing Broly to Beerus in the end of the movie.
unless Goku is really bad at gauging powers that means Broly is nowhere near Jiren who was said by whis to be possibly above god of destruction level in his base form. (and Whis knows Beerus's full potential unlike Goku)
i'm not gonna argue for Vegito anyways, DBS does have pretty insane power jumps from arc to arc so Broly probably beats him now that i've thought about it some more.
unless Goku is really bad at gauging powers that means Broly is nowhere near Jiren who was said by whis to be possibly above god of destruction level in his base form. (and Whis knows Beerus's full potential unlike Goku)
i'm not gonna argue for Vegito anyways, DBS does have pretty insane power jumps from arc to arc so Broly probably beats him now that i've thought about it some more.
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I'm still wondering if we can even take that statement seriously about Goku's comparison to Beerus ?
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That's naive. Do you expect Goku to flee when his entire universe was threatened? Also they escaped multiple times from Black. That doesn't means Black is stronger than Jiren.The 2nd Existential Seed said:
Ultra Instinct is an unreliable technique as mentioned in the manga. Which is the reason why Goku thought about fusion alongside the purpose of the plot per se
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Yeah, there is no way that they could have increased that much in such a shot amount of time.
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