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Bill Cipher vs. Rick Sanchez REMATCH

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Bill snapping away clones is still Bill being bothered by clones. Rock could potentially make 100s. More than enough time to press a button to stop time.

Bill never uses precognition and only has in very selective moments. Never in combat. He didn't forsee certain events including his own defeat. It definitely isn't passive and "nearly passive" has no meaning.

As I said Bill doesn't resist time stop. His own imposed ability just doesn't affect him which is a common troupe in fiction. No one gave Dip resistance to time stop because he can move in his own stopped time.

Weirdmaggedon would hardly interfere with a push of a button. Having your aim thrown off isn't the same. Rick can prepare for it too by building protections against the waves.
 
Also an in character Bill wouldn't just one shot all the clones. It's way more likely he plays around with them. Either way Rick still has time to press a button which Bill can do nothing against. The phoenix project makes sure Rick will continue to revive should he ever fail and come back more prepared.
 
EmperorRorepme said:
Also an in character Bill wouldn't just one shot all the clones. It's way more likely he plays around with them. Either way Rick still has time to press a button which Bill can do nothing against. The phoenix project makes sure Rick will continue to revive should he ever fail and come back more prepared.
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You don't understand, Bill's snap would get rid of Rick alongside his clones, it wouldn't spar the real Rick just because he cloned himself, also cloning isn't instantanous unless they're already here when the battle starts, which is outside help, which is forbidden. Bill can start the fight with only one Rick and only one Rick can make the prep. If he summons them mid-battle that's another thing.

Weiedmaggedon can interfere with Rick's plans and since it's literally a weirdness/chaos wave, Rick can't expect what would happen when the wave hit him so he can't prepare a proper counter for it. Not to mention that the wave can also transmutate like Bill himself.

And no, Bill in character won't play around against an unknown enemy. He only played around and was arrogant against enemies such as the pines family. In other cases, such as when Wendy, Soos and the rest of the zodiac people tried to attack Bill or when Bill attacked the shacktron, he didn't played around and went straight for the kill (and would've killed everyone in the shacktron if it wasn't for the anti Bill shield).
 
Rick's best chances would be time stop and bfr, which Bill can escape from due to his 2-A range (being able to potentially acccess all of the nightmare realm with dimensional travel would give him this range), and Rick can't bypass his Low Godly regen.

And when Bill does come back, he'll just snap his fingers, since now he'll take Rick seriously and turn him and his machines to golden statues
 
No it wouldn't if Rick isn't among his clones for the sole reason of the clones distracting Bill so he can act. Rick has prior knowledge and preparation so he can clone and keep them there before the battle. It isn't outside help at all because it's Rick himself.

Rick knows about the weird wave and protect himself from the wave itself. Also the wave rarely transmutes that's hardly even a possibility. As soon as Bill enters with the wave he stops time anyway. Rick can make robots that predict randomness either way. So he can use that to know all of Bills plans whether random or not.

Sealing is still a thing because Bill is 3D not 4D. It just sucks Bill within a box and it would be too fast for Bill to do anything it isn't instantaneous though.

He could probably kill Bill with anti-matter. He could freeze Bill. Erase his mind. Maybe even prepare a bomb which goes off if he dies.
 
EmperorRorepme said:
No it wouldn't if Rick isn't among his clones for the sole reason of the clones distracting Bill so he can act. Rick has prior knowledge and preparation so he can clone and keep them there before the battle. It isn't outside help at all because it's Rick himself.
Rick knows about the weird wave and protect himself from the wave itself. Also the wave rarely transmutes that's hardly even a possibility. As soon as Bill enters with the wave he stops time anyway. Rick can make robots that predict randomness either way. So he can use that to know all of Bills plans whether random or not.

Sealing is still a thing because Bill is 3D not 4D. It just sucks Bill within a box and it would be too fast for Bill to do anything it isn't instantaneous though.
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Bill is 4D. He doesn't have have 4 spatial dimensions, sure, but he has 4D powers and can affect 4D structures. Also Bill is uncountably infinitely stronger than anything 3D soley by being Low 2-C. Unless the sealing can trap things on a 4D scale, Bill would have no problem breaking free.

The wave has no plan, it changes things randomally, so Rick wouldn't know what happens even with prep. Also, Rick has to be on the battlefield when he starts the match, so that point is moot.

Also, Anti matter gun will do nothing since Bill has Low Godly regen, and the gun can't destroy his 2D soul. Bomb will also not bypass his regen. And Bill won't kill Rick but rather incap him.

As for the Rick clones not being outside help, while they are Rick, they're still versions of him from different universes, and those different universes are not allowed to interact with the main one during the battle
 
Oblivion Of The Endless said:
If the clones are himself or an ability of him, then its allowed
We have plenty of characters that fights like that. Lavos is the best example
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Fine. But can he clone himself before the battle? Since the thread didn't said "Rick and his clones vs Bill". Also Bill can clone himself as well. And his snap would affect all at once. And he fought multiple enemies before (see in weirdmaggedon part 3). And the cloning is not passive. And bill starts with a snap which either puts Rick and his clones asleep all at once or incaps them with transmutation.
 
Also, to make it more fair, maybe change up a bit the description about the battle, and put "Bill knows the basics about Rick", which is that he's a supergenius scientist, and a interdimensional traveler and such.

Seems pretty unfair that you make Rick know literally everything about Bill while Bill knows absolutely nothing. Though probably when Bill sees the machines, he'll realize that Rick is no joke and will treat him seriously
 
Gilad Hyperstar said:
That's not just me saying, this is how Bill matches were for a long time (Bill starts with transmutation), and if he doesn't have a starting move, then we also can't make battles with Bill since there are so much possibilities for him to do a first move. In those situations, the community here assumed he'll use first his most used move, which was transmutation. If you have a problem with Bill's starting move, then make a CRT for it and discuss about it, since I didn't made it up arbitrarily.

Bill wouldn't try to go to Rick's dreams since he needs the handshake to get in his mind. Though if Bill does get in, he can also reality warp Rick's mind as well. Him being a supergenius doesn't make him less human.

Also hologram =/= 2D soul. And if Rick would try to turn his soul corpereal, Bill would just snap before Rick could do anythig about it, since I don't think he can do it passively, especially when it was made by accident.

Again, unless Rick can incap or kill Bill in his first move, all Bill needs is to snap his fingers. Also Bill has precognition, which means he could see what Rick will try to do before he'll do it
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You don't see any problem with that first paragraph? Because it's pretty cringy to me. I don't care what others think nor do I think that they are ok with Bill using a move "the moment the match starts", that has nothing to do with this thread. Most characters don't have a starting move, all you need is having common sense to make battles with them. I don't need to make a CRT because that's not what his profile states. All of that was basic, please evaluate what you wrote there.

I never said that Bill would try to go for Rick's dreams, that's just a massive lack of creativity. Rick could create someone and force Bill to go into its dreams, Rick's risks would pretty much be just making contact with Bill to do that, which he can do by surprise.

It doesn't matter that hologram =/= 2D soul as it's still NPI that works on non-corporeal beings, which the hologram that could move anywhere said he was. Also do not overestimate Bill, he can make mistakes, not use his powers effectively and has been taken by surprise, to say that he "would just snap before Rick could do anythig" and that Rick needs to do stuff passively is just exaggerated, and that's being generous.

The first sentence is redundant. The second is misleading AF, Bill ca use precog as one of the many powers he has.
 
Gilad Hyperstar said:
Bill's precognition is nearly passive, so he would know what he needs almost instantly, like when he was about to tell Soos the exact time of his death just by looking at him once. And looking few minutes forwards is much easier than years forwards.

Also Bill would resist time stop with his own time manipulation

Something else that I didn't mentioned, is that since this is weirdmaggedon Bill, the effects of weirdmaggedon (such as the weirdness wave) would come into effect when Bill entered gravity falls. No matter what Rick planned, they aren't fail proof and the effects of weirdmaggedon can foil his plans in an unexpected way (such as when Ford intended to blast Bill with his gun, when Bill wasn't looking and was distracted, but the wave cause a thing to interrupt Ford and prevent him from shooting accurately)
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I don't think people should take you seriously here, you are clearly extremely bias towards Bill.

Bill's precog is not "nearly passive", he needs to manually activate it. You can tell if you use common sense that looking someone once didn't activate the precog, but Bill himself.

That's not how resistances works, it's hypocrite how you wanted to make me do a CRT for Bill's starting move yet you are ok with a resistance he doesn't have.

Bill needs to activate that, it was rejected for that very same reason when it was brought in a CRT. Also Rick's plans are literally hundreds of times above what Ford did there, this is yet another example of your bias towards Bill.
 
Ciruno Fortes said:
If his precog was always active he wouldn't be done in by that "Ol Switcheroo"
Anyway following for now
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This is a combination of his extreme arrogance and PIS. Also I never said it was always active, just that he can use it very fast
 
Dude. Bill can have 4D powers but that doesn't grant him resistance to sealing when his body is 3D.

The wave doesn't need a strategized "plan" per say the robots can still predict randomness. So it still works on Bill.

I don't really know how Anti-Matter works but isn't it destroying matter? Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure it worked on a non-corporeal being.

Clones are not outside help. Clones=|=Alternate Versions.
 
I think it's clear Rick with prior knowledge and prep has a plethora of ways to win this. Even on the off chance Bill just kills him conventionally phoenix project kicks in and Rick comes back way more prepared. So I vote Rick FRA.
 
EmperorRorepme said:
Dude. Bill can have 4D powers but that doesn't grant him resistance to sealing when his body is 3D.
The wave doesn't need a strategized "plan" per say the robots can still predict randomness. So it still works on Bill.

I don't really know how Anti-Matter works but isn't it destroying matter? Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure it worked on a non-corporeal being.

Clones are not outside help. Clones=|=Alternate Versions.
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Anti-matter does destroy matter, but since Bill has Low Godly regen, he'll just regenerate from that. Your other points are good though.

Bill would also not necessarily kill him, as he can also by chance incap Rick, and since he didn't technically killed him, there'll be no pheonix project to revive him.

Also, The new Rick still need to come in a week after the old one was killed, or else Bill wins.

I'm not voting btw, since it seems both sides can defeat each other, but maybe Rick can take him with his new powers
 
Rick FRA. Also, I don't remember Bill using Petrification in fights. He was using energy beam vs time baby and he was using fist vs Shacktron. BFR from Rick on himself wouldn't work, since he needs only a portal gun, to travel back into fight. In the actual episode it was, as I remember, less than 24 hours.
 
MrKerf said:
Rick FRA. Also, I don't remember Bill using Petrification in fights. He was using energy beam vs time baby and he was using fist vs Shacktron. BFR from Rick on himself wouldn't work, since he needs only a portal gun, to travel back into fight. In the actual episode it was, as I remember, less than 24 hours.
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Bill used transmutation, not petrification (aka, turned people to tspsteries and Ford into a golden statue)
 
@Gilad

Fair on PIS, but I feel like when a character's personality really screws im over in a fight, I feel like that's less PIS-esque and more of a grown weakness. Or at least when he's dealing with humans.

But yeah Rick FRA
 
For what is worth, Rick's sealing would not do anything here. Sealing is just "you put something inside of something", if that has power null then it needs to be specified, which wasn't the case and thus Bill would just use his reality manip or just AP to get out.
 
For me Bill, cause: Rick can't stop time cause the time Is already stopped by the weirdmageddon and can't create robot that predict randomness cause of the definition of randomness; Randotron was following the story written by Morty. The Phoenix project doesn't work because Bill can trap him and his soul, moreover Bill have ever used his Power ti know everything about his victim, like Gideon, or Stanford, so he would be prepared. In the ending because Bill isn't anything he Is he would be very difficult create a weapon useful against him, and it would take some time and he couldn't create a defense for everyone of the infinite Power of Bill.
 
TotalDramaFollower12 said:
For me Bill, cause:
Rick can't stop time cause the time Is already stopped by the weirdmageddon and can't create robot that predict randomness cause of the definition of randomness; Randotron was following the story written by Morty. The Phoenix project doesn't work because Bill can trap him and his soul, moreover Bill have ever used his Power ti know everything about his victim, like Gideon, or Stanford, so he would be prepared. In the ending because Bill isn't anything he Is he would be very difficult create a weapon useful against him, and it would take some time and he couldn't create a defense for everyone of the infinite Power of Bill.
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Bill doesn't have knowledge of Rick here, and Rick has: 1) Full knowledge of Bill (Knows about him as much as we know him) and 2) A month of prep time for the match.

Also, apperantly, Rick has Type 4 with the pheonix project, which would transfer his soul and memories to a clone of him in a different universe, and that Rick would just use a portal to return.

Bill can win by snapping, but the argument was that since Rick knows he'll do that and that he has no resistance to it, He'll Time Stop and Seal/BFR him iirc
 
You're clearly haven't read my writing i said: -that Bill has used his power ti know about everyone who were going to meet, he would do the same with Stanford -he can't stop the time because in the weirdmageddon the time is stopped by himself, moreover he has lost the cristal of time and Is implied he find difficult steal them. -i add that he can't use magic because he lost the cannon and he can't use magic without
 
Your arguments are pretty bad. Bill doesn't have the first power you say he has, he reads minds a lot in-character and has a few time used precognition, which doesn't do a lot for him here. Using weirdmageddon is one of the many things he can do, which is already bad but it would also take some time for time to stop there and not all of time would stop anyway, legit if Bill uses that it would be a scenario where Rick wins. It doesn't matter at all if something Rick needs to get is difficult to steal, ignoring how he gets better with the stuff he can do as the seasons go. The magic stuff is a straw man.

I'm gonna recommend to everyone to just dismiss you.
 
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