- 11,385
- 19,972
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Ben 10 - Low 1-C Time Stream Proposal
- Thread starter Reiner04
- Start date
-
- Tags
- ben 10 ben 10 cosmology
- Status
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #124
Possibly may or may not, a discussion thread will be made on it after this.
- 7,635
- 7,799
@Everything12
The OP has been updated to reflect the recent posts.
Have your prior concerns been addressed by the new OP?
The OP has been updated to reflect the recent posts.
Have your prior concerns been addressed by the new OP?
- 7,142
- 4,658
Opinion unchanged.
- 18,393
- 14,323
Someone ping DT as we need someone to confirm that visual interpretation can be accepted or not.
- 7,142
- 4,658
Maou Gakuin has statements that a structure containing an infinite number of timelines is but a microcosm of the bubble world. It also has a flat out statement that the Silver Sea which contaisn the bubble worlds is infinite in size. You have an infinite number of timelines but the rest is just you interpreting visuals a certain way.
Exiting a universe into the space beyond being visualised as light in a large black space is not definitive evidence that the Universe is a microcosm or the the black space is infinite in comparison to the structures it contains (holding an infinite number of those structures is not the same as being infinitely larger than the structures; not every structure thatt contains a 2-A or 2-A × 2 number of universes is Low 1-C)
Exiting a universe into the space beyond being visualised as light in a large black space is not definitive evidence that the Universe is a microcosm or the the black space is infinite in comparison to the structures it contains (holding an infinite number of those structures is not the same as being infinitely larger than the structures; not every structure thatt contains a 2-A or 2-A × 2 number of universes is Low 1-C)
- 18,393
- 14,323
This is why I wanted someone to ping @DontTalkDT to tell us standards about “visual interpretation” can be valid or not.
Also, why is MG always being mentioned? Literally two staff members mentioning it for some reasons? Wait, OP included it.
@Reiner what is this whataboutism argument in your thread? Remove MG stuff as it has absolutely 0 involvement and relevance.
- 11,385
- 19,972
You guys like to mention MG everywhere but don't like others using it as example? Lmao..
- 7,142
- 4,658
None of that.You guys like to mention MG everywhere but don't like others using it as example? Lmao..
- 11,385
- 19,972
My message was addressed to dread.
- 18,393
- 14,323
I just saw the OP changed his contents of the thread right now. I found it strange everything12 mentioning it, but I just saw half of OP is literally MG.You guys like to mention MG everywhere but don't like others using it as example? Lmao..
Also, no. I get annoyed when someone uses MG to push their own cosmology and knowing well that only ours got accepted because we have a flat out statement of size comparison.
Last edited:
- 7,142
- 4,658
Don't care, I'm a Thread Moderator and we don't need any inter-verse drama or whatever in this thread.
- 5,802
- 7,431
If I'm understanding, a qualitative superiority would require such structures contained within the supposed Tier 1 space to be near or infinitesimal in scale compared to the structure?
- 4,524
- 2,242
I can't pretend to be all that knowledgeable on Ben 10, but if I understand the OP (and please correct me if I've missed something), this structure called "The Space Beyond" is a sort of structure that is outside the universe and so much larger that individual universes (which I'm assuming are more or less multiverses) are like the faint glow of a star.
While I could certainly see the argument for Low 1C from this, there's also the flip side where you could just argue that they're so far away from the multiverse, that it appears to be nothing more than a faint glow, especially from a place outside the multiverse. As well as that, I'm not entirely sure you can reach tier 1 without viewing stuff from tier 2 as infinitesimal, to which this would probably just remain at 2A.
So I'll remain neutral for now, but it could change over time depending on arguments
While I could certainly see the argument for Low 1C from this, there's also the flip side where you could just argue that they're so far away from the multiverse, that it appears to be nothing more than a faint glow, especially from a place outside the multiverse. As well as that, I'm not entirely sure you can reach tier 1 without viewing stuff from tier 2 as infinitesimal, to which this would probably just remain at 2A.
So I'll remain neutral for now, but it could change over time depending on arguments
- 18,393
- 14,323
OP's thread need only one thing to pass this, and if visual interpretation vsbattle considered to be valid or not. So I am still suggesting DT to enter to this chat as he is the only one who have this answer.
Even Ultima is still baffled if it can be considered valid or not.
Even Ultima is still baffled if it can be considered valid or not.
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #139
I don't really understand your concern? Are you saying 2×2A structure > 2A? No, you are going against FAQ at this point, infinite×2A is of same size of single 2A there is nothing big or small btww them but all are same size so logically if you are bigger than 2A you are bigger than infinite times 2A, unless you contradict the FAQ itself and I remembered what ultima said? Ultima reasoning in MGK or any other thread was that the bigger structure dwarfs the 2A nothing here and there. If you don't have any reason to disagree feel free to disagree for no reason Rather than spreading misinformation here.
And we talked to ultima that if what visuals are depicting is right and 2A structure has been dwarf to star extent then it's low 1C?
Last edited:
- 18,393
- 14,323
Ultima himself does not know, hence he said ask DT for this.
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #141
What ultima said in MGK or even when we asked that being bigger than 2A to a extent that we dwarfs it to such a small scale as in visual then it's fine
- 18,393
- 14,323
Also, if you don't mind, remove MG stuff there. If you wish to upgrade a cosmology verse, don't use whataboutism argument.
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #143
I am not using MGK, I am saying what ultima said regarding low 1C, even on discord he clarified, you and me both were there and he said
"Saying that space beyond is 2A is like kinda arguing that it's of same size as of universe"
Tell me if I am quoting it wrong?
He is not baffled or confused, he left this to all of us after clarifying what qualifies for low 1C
"Saying that space beyond is 2A is like kinda arguing that it's of same size as of universe"
Tell me if I am quoting it wrong?
He is not baffled or confused, he left this to all of us after clarifying what qualifies for low 1C
- 663
- 551
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #145
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #146
And I left it to everyone above? If they think visuals+ statements are enough then okay if not then whatever. There is no rule saying that visuals are incorrect when it is supported by statements dread.
- 18,393
- 14,323
Half of OP is filled up with MG. Remove it.
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #148
Okay
- 18,393
- 14,323
I don't know what you are saying here, but are you against DT's involvement in this thread or not? Invite him here.
- 7,635
- 7,799
To clarify, The Space Beyond is infinitesimal in comparison to The Time Continuum.
- 18,393
- 14,323
He is confused if visual interpretations in the vs battle can be considered as valid or not, therefore he told us to ask @DontTalkDT. Do the job and invite him here.
- 9,982
- 10,821
- Thread starter
- #153
And I am saying that visuals supported by statements is fine, we don't have to hang up on ultima or DT for each small thing as this, if he has already answered that what qualifies for low 1C then we should have our own thing regarding it. If DT wants he will comment if not then he'll not, we cannot force rather ultima nor DT.
- 5,802
- 7,431
The second part is fundamentally what I thought and why I changed from neutral to agree in the first place. Though I figure more staff input is needed on the visual aspect.
Does it answers your question?
- 18,393
- 14,323
You are not getting anywhere here right now Reiner, but it is your game, I am helping you out to move on this thread. Sounds you are rejecting the idea, so now don't reply to me anymore and kindly remove MG stuff and use your own arguments.
- 18,393
- 14,323
Also, don't say “I am forcing them to be here”, because I never suggest this. I said, “invite them here to clarify the standards”. Don't twist my words.
- 7,635
- 7,799
Let's all settle down and not start anything pointless. We need to stay on topic and focus.
- 18,393
- 14,323
Simplistically saying, it is not about if it is infinitesimal or not, it is about if we take visual interpretation here in vs battle as valid or not which right now there are 0 rules to suggest otherwise.
- 7,635
- 7,799
Doesn't the below apply?
Tiering System FAQ
A: Whether higher-dimensional entities qualify for such high tiers or not depends on several different factors, which may take root both in and out-of-verse. To explain this situation, we must first clarify what exactly being higher-dimensional entails. In a way, yes, though not how most would...
vsbattles.fandom.com
"A cosmology where the four-dimensional spacetime continuum is just the infinitesimal surface of a 5-dimensional object, and etc."
Q: How do I determine if something is "transcendent"?
They can qualify, however, if said "higher plane" is defined as having a relationship of qualitative superiority over lower realms in one way or another, such as by perceiving them as literal fiction/unreality (or being comparatively more "real" in nature), encompassing them in an infinitesimal portion of itself, residing in a higher state of being altogether, and etc.
- Status
