An incalculable universe wouldn't make sense otherwise. Kindly read the 2nd statement where their technology describes 3-D beings as lower dimensional which would align with the distinction made by them. Similar to "We are beings from 5th dimension" but the only difference is that the term "incalculableth" doesn't exist.
"An incalculable universe doesn't make sense" doesn't mean "Therefore it's referring to spatial dimensions." Neither phrasing actually makes sense, and the aliens being higher-dimensional also doesn't mean the reading being provided by this thread is the correct one either. That's a non-sequitur.
That's not what I meant. I have used 2nd statement as a means to contextualize my premise
I've given an example of that in the previous reply.
Yeah, and the attempt fails, simple as that.
Higher dimensions being unperceivable by lower dimensional beings is very consistent in verse as well.
So we can count your vote as a 'disagree' and close the CRT then.
That doesn't mean anything. Even if I generously grant that the second statement is talking about Ben and co. being lower-dimensional compared to the alien, the argument still doesn't succeed.
@Planck69 @DarkDragonMedeus @Firestorm808
You have to understand what dimensions and universes mean in Ben 10, as dimensions and universes are different in Ben 10
He does not need to say dimensionality in order for them to mean infinite dimensions, for example, Cosmic Mom said that Ben only perceives 3 dimension and did not say dimensionality, but it was clearly referring to spatiotemporal
and Omega Beings separated the word dimension from the universe in the context. Also dimension and universe not the same meaning in Ben 10.
It's late on my end, I can go over things tomorrow afternoon.
The recent agreement of staff was with Planck, Qaws, DarkDrago, and I.
Jokes apart, I feel like someone from this CRT wasn't pleased with the upgrade so he requested ultima to join despite the staff inputs reaching a common conclusion. I kinda know who that guy is but I'm not sure if this is the case so not naming anyone.Ultima woke up like this:
No, I just caught sight of Alien X's updated profile in a server I'm in and went to look at what happened. No one specifically asked me to come here
RealUltima woke up like this:
This was already addressed and resolved to not be that the Case in the CRT in a long lengthy disscussion with Q.
This is statment for 5D Contumilla
Now here's how ghost ship universe is described
Now there's a clear similarity here , the same stuff is stated for Ghost ship's incalculable dimensions and Contumilla's 5th dimension
“We are beings from the 5th dimension” is another way of saying “we are 5th-dimensional beings”. Same applies to incalculable dimension(s).
A incalculable universe. What is that even supposed to mean. The 'incalculable dimension' part is just a means to describe their Universe.
It could mean that you can’t calculate its location, it could simply be located beyond infinite timelines, or Space-Beyond, or Forge of Creation, or whatever. Hence why you can’t calculate it.
The context is different from this statement and his.
Just because “dimension” referred to spatiotemporal ones in one context does not necessarily mean it would in another. We have Gravity Falls where “dimension” was used for both spatiotemporal axises and simply universes, with sometimes even referring to universes with specific dimensionality, in different contexts.
It has already been established that The Space beyond/Omniverse is the highest plane of reality so this headcanon gets straight up dismissed
Prove that the context has anything to do with quantum physics.
it's not an assumption, the context has been provided within another statement
Nobody said that the term Dimension alone grants it a spatial context so this is a strawman fallacy. Otherwise we would have argued the "Infinite Dimensions" statement of Dr Holiday as High 1-B lol (The context was referring to parallel world in Infinite Dimensions statement of Dr Holiday btw).
This is not a headcanon, but a reasonable interpretation of a statement. By the same logic, infinite-dimensionality implication is a headcanon too. And I never argued about incalculable dimension being the highest plane of reality, I argued this incalculable dimension being outside of it. Just like, you know, you can have a box outside of galaxy without this box being bigger than galaxy?
I just used it as an example of position being incalculable. Do not strawman my statements.
If you’re referring to “incomprehensible”, then it doesn’t even mean anything. It could be incomprehensible for many other reasons.
They were saying that since 26D statement meant dimensions in mathematical sense, then it should be here too.
I am not derailing it though. Quite the opposite.Honestly just leave the discussion to Firestorm and Ultima. Kindly don't come up with "Ultima meant this", "Ultima meant that", etc.
Better leave it to the staffs to avoid unnecessary derailment
Feedback absorbed the Annhilarrgh which created all the timelines and alternate dimensions when it went off. Which is why a endless empty white void was left in the place where all of them were.
I've just explained how the context of them being transdimensional and being beyond human perception is consistent inverse with spatial dimensions in the past. Gravity Falls has nothing to do with this. The Nalgians being beyond hum
You're going against what's been established. Kindly provide evidence from your side or else your claim gets dismissed via Hitchens razor.
Then contextualize it from the comic instead of saying "this is possible", "that is possible", etc without supporting evidence
Uh not really? Their tech calls 3-D beings as lower life forms who cannot comprehend their higher form which alludes to their higher dimensional nature.
In the end, our opinion won't matter. It is the staffs whose opinion matters so leaving it to them would be a better option.
The Space Beyond/Omniverse is the force that extends through all of reality. So it holds everything.
How is the example relevant?
Like? We've already discussed being abstract and BDE with Q.
Because they are both unperceivable by lower beings. They got the same qualities that made the 26D spatial.
I can wait for your side of the debate.
Okay, but I don’t really see how it refutes my point at all.
Both of those do not necessarily imply infinite-dimensionality, as it is established in Ben 10 that humans can’t perceive more than 3 dimensions.
Where exactly? The argument was relied on dimension and universe meaning the same thing, while given the context it is not at all, which is something Ultima agreed with tok.
I’m using an interpretation same as you. You were relying on “incalculable” statement, while this does not necessarily refer to dimensionality, and since the argument was “the statement does not make sense otherwise”, I gave an example to what it could refer instead. It is now your burden of proof to show that the statement explicitly refers to spatiotemporal dimensions.
Yes, and this could all be while they exist outside of other structures and being higher-dimensional, but not necessarily infinitely-dimensional, such as 5-dimensional, or 26-dimensional, or any other number more than 3.
While this is essentially true, I’m just contributing to the discussion. They might see it and change their opinions based off it, or they might not. This is why staff discussion is different from content thread revisions.
Which is why I said it could be not only beyond Space-Beyond, but just beyond infinite timelines. Hence why I said “or whatever”. Unless you have a proof that all of Space-Beyond was “calculated”.
Calculation may refer to position.ll
Unperceivable is not necessarily infinitely dimensional, a simple HDE/BDE is enough.
You're claiming that the Universe of these aliens comes from somewhere beyond the Forge of creation and space beyond with zero evidence.
I've already explained my point above
The burden is on you to prove how this refers to something else especially after we discussed everything with Qawsedf.
So you conceded them being higher-dimensional, good.
Firestorm has already said that he will continue the discussion tomorrow afternoon so I don't see any point in discussion between people who's opinion holds no value to be considered as a vote to implement a CRT.
"Incalculable dimension" would mean universe even when dimension means spatial axis though.
It proves that this is this isn't an alternate timeline or dimensions in Ben's Universe as Feedback can absorb that Universe's level energy and laws but not this Univers's level of energy and laws. He could absorb higherD energy of Ben's entire Universe (6D-25D) but struggles to do it here. Indicating it not to be another timeline or alternate dimension.
I didn't say it implied infinite dimensionality. I said it supported Higher Dimensionality as their Universe in unperceivable by lower beings.
Exactly Universe and dimension don't mean the same thing as you formally stated.
Transdimensional-Relating to a dimension other than those of the normal three-dimensional world
So you agree that their higher dimensional then?
Than it exactly where we said it is. A Universe inside the Space Beyond like Ben's but ultimately separate separate from it. Paradox mapped out all of space time and knew location of FoC and Ben's Universe in the SB.
Appeal to possibility. As I said Paradox fully mapped out all of space time including SB with it's higher time and causality.
Exactly. It is HDE as Paradox has BDE and his form is perceivable by Ben and Co.
Not necessarily. I said “beyond infinite timelines, or Space Beyond, or Forge of Creation, or whatever” to not claim something specific but just give a general idea. And the first one would pretty much suffice.
Vice versa. There is no good context to prove it is talking about mathematic dimensionality to begin with.
Never denied that tbh.
You are just assuming that the case is the same as if it was “6th dimension”, while it isn’t necessarily like that. It could refer to its position, simple.
Given that we probably won’t reach conclusion I agree that it’s better to leave it to Ultima, Firestorm and other staff to get on the topic
The point is that incalculable could simply mean that it is a universe the position (or location) of which cannot be calculated.
