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battle cats feat discussion thread

remember, due to translation issues we can only use jp descriptiom, which doesn't mention star energy
also all we have to go off of is that he travelled from the edge of the universe, which is pretty far far far far far beyond the fastest mftl can go
 
luminala did not create everything
also doktor heaven uses the crystals as a power source as well, further supporting this. Also momoco actually has the crystal inside the gun she uses to attack, and high lord babel has become one with a castle, which has coincidentally also become one with a ton of that 4d crystal matter
and while Gaia did create all things, it is stated everywhere that the crystals are "different dimensional", "higher dimensional", "4 dimensional" etc
Gaia could easily have created the 3d universe, or you could downplay and say she only created heaven and earth
either way it's undeniable that these legend rares are all using a high 3-A energy source
I never said that, I said she was the origin of everything, like how a pool of energy can be the origin of several phenomena based on how said energy is used
okay and, good, they scale to each other, also you wot, we have nothing stating or implying the crystals actually power him, the only thing we see is that they are embedded into the bottom of the castle, that doesn't mean it is powered by it ap wise, because nothing indicates that in any manner
Once again Gaia has nothing stated to be using the crystals, at all, hell the crystals would be a part of the world she created, also fun fact, universe creation can be 4D if the universe is proven to have time, which it has, so the point of Gaia only making the 3D part of reality doesn't work, and as such it creates circular scaling if we use the crystal's being the power source for everything
it is not, just because a model has them on it doesn't mean that the crystals act a a power source, especially when there is noting proving it as such for said character
 
Well I was kinda avoiding the time thing because the entire wiki standard that time is related to dimensions is completely stupid and wrong
but anyways

Look at the attack animation for high lord babel, the attack comes directly from the crystals Look at the attack animation for Gaia, it is shown that it is using the crystals for its attacks. Look at the animation for doom engine pandora itself, the crystal is quite literally shooting a laser. Yes, I am not just using weak evidence like a model, it is blatantly shown that the crystals are the power source for the legend rares that use them.
 
by the way, the argument that gaia created them falls flat since this isn't even considering that Gaia used the power of the crystals to create everything in the first place
 
Well I was kinda avoiding the time thing because the entire wiki standard that time is related to dimensions is completely stupid and wrong
but anyways

Look at the attack animation for high lord babel, the attack comes directly from the crystals Look at the attack animation for Gaia, it is shown that it is using the crystals for its attacks. Look at the animation for doom engine pandora itself, the crystal is quite literally shooting a laser. Yes, I am not just using weak evidence like a model, it is blatantly shown that the crystals are the power source for the legend rares that use them.
time is near always going to give a 3D universe low 2-C, unless it is stated to either be finite or to not be a continuum, neither of which are stated here

okay yeah i forgot abt babel, no it doesn't you wot, hell its contradicted by the description itself, where she attacks using divine creation of all things, just because it glows, doesn't mean it powers her attacks, but lets go through all of the legends rares to show that this idea doesn't work
Dynamites:MoMoCo does use them for her attacks so thats 1 for you
Nekolugas:It could be reasoned out that it does use them so yeah
Vajira's: The only thing we know it does it allow the swords to hover and keep thier shape
Galaxy Gals:She literally only uses them to make a portal, nothing else
Dragon emperors: Yeah Babel uses them
Ultra Souls:Not a chance that it uses them, we only see them used as decoration
Dark Heroes: She doesnt even use them, he only can be assumed to harvest them + as seen in her second form she isnt even harvesting the crystals
Almighties: Gaia has no indication at all as using them as a power source, the crystal shining is not proof
Iron Legion: Yeah this is kinda obvious
Pixes: Not a chance, we only see it be used to make the material, not be used as a power source
Dynasty Fest: No lol, he doesnt use it and it is especially confirmed in combination with Evil Emperor's description
4:7
& legends vs 4, prove that the crystal's are a shared power source, it just doesn't work, they are astetic bar the 4 that use them for power
 
time is near always going to give a 3D universe low 2-C, unless it is stated to either be finite or to not be a continuum, neither of which are stated here

okay yeah i forgot abt babel, no it doesn't you wot, hell its contradicted by the description itself, where she attacks using divine creation of all things, just because it glows, doesn't mean it powers her attacks, but lets go through all of the legends rares to show that this idea doesn't work
Dynamites:MoMoCo does use them for her attacks so thats 1 for you
Nekolugas:It could be reasoned out that it does use them so yeah
Vajira's: The only thing we know it does it allow the swords to hover and keep thier shape
Galaxy Gals:She literally only uses them to make a portal, nothing else
Dragon emperors: Yeah Babel uses them
Ultra Souls:Not a chance that it uses them, we only see them used as decoration
Dark Heroes: She doesnt even use them, he only can be assumed to harvest them + as seen in her second form she isnt even harvesting the crystals
Almighties: Gaia has no indication at all as using them as a power source, the crystal shining is not proof
Iron Legion: Yeah this is kinda obvious
Pixes: Not a chance, we only see it be used to make the material, not be used as a power source
Dynasty Fest: No lol, he doesnt use it and it is especially confirmed in combination with Evil Emperor's description
4:7
& legends vs 4, prove that the crystal's are a shared power source, it just doesn't work, they are astetic bar the 4 that use them for power
1st of all, every proof you provided to say that a legend doesn't use them is actually just saying "there's no confirmation that it's being used to power the attack" which doesn't actually prove that it isn't especially when there is a pattern of repition. Although it is likely that doktor heaven isn't using them, might kristal muu in general completely establishes that the crystals are a power source.

As for Gaia, saying that it's not proof means nothing. It shines the exact same color as the attack that she is using. This is a massive implication, but if you really wanna play this game then
1. You literally admit that luminalia uses the crystals to create the thing that she ATTACKS WITH, and you're denying it's a power source even though it is quite literally the attack itself? You've basically proved this one for me.
2. King Cat's attack itself literally has the same design as the crystals, there is absolutely no respectable argument that he is not using it for his attacks.
3. and half of this is just lightly implied by the game itself, to the point where you can't use it as an actual counterargument to prove that they don't use it, which is what you seem to be trying to do. Yes, Musashi doesn't blatantly attack with the crystals, but it is on his sword, and we know that the crystals are often used to power attacks. Yes, ushiwakamaru is the same situation (even tho a translation for the jp description is coming soon) but he has the crystals, which have been seen multiple times to power attacks.

In reality, all the ones we know don't use it as a power source for the attacks are Headmistress Jeanne and Doktor heaven, meanwhile we know for a FACT that tyrant, pandora, legeluga, luminalia, momoco, and babel use them, while everybody else is ambiguous (even Gaia shouldn't be ambiguous but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here)

6:2 is the best score I can give you
 
1st of all, every proof you provided to say that a legend doesn't use them is actually just saying "there's no confirmation that it's being used to power the attack" which doesn't actually prove that it isn't especially when there is a pattern of repition. Although it is likely that doktor heaven isn't using them, might kristal muu in general completely establishes that the crystals are a power source.

As for Gaia, saying that it's not proof means nothing. It shines the exact same color as the attack that she is using. This is a massive implication, but if you really wanna play this game then
1. You literally admit that luminalia uses the crystals to create the thing that she ATTACKS WITH, and you're denying it's a power source even though it is quite literally the attack itself? You've basically proved this one for me.
2. King Cat's attack itself literally has the same design as the crystals, there is absolutely no respectable argument that he is not using it for his attacks.
3. and half of this is just lightly implied by the game itself, to the point where you can't use it as an actual counterargument to prove that they don't use it, which is what you seem to be trying to do. Yes, Musashi doesn't blatantly attack with the crystals, but it is on his sword, and we know that the crystals are often used to power attacks. Yes, ushiwakamaru is the same situation (even tho a translation for the jp description is coming soon) but he has the crystals, which have been seen multiple times to power attacks.

In reality, all the ones we know don't use it as a power source for the attacks are Headmistress Jeanne and Doktor heaven, meanwhile we know for a FACT that tyrant, pandora, legeluga, luminalia, momoco, and babel use them, while everybody else is ambiguous (even Gaia shouldn't be ambiguous but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here)

6:2 is the best score I can give you
Yeah, for Muu, not anyone else, because if you want to say that it is something outside of aesthetic then you need to have proof, not just ooh these all have the same theme,
Ah yes shining is being used to prove that an attack is being powered by something else when that is directly contradicted by the fact that we are told Gaia uses mana to do stuff, while also using the weapon divine creation of all things to attack, the crystals arent anywhere magic, given what we have actually seen of them
Ah yes, trees are now 9-C, Iron is now 9-B, Hydrogen is tier 7, etc etc etc, material=/=power source or source of most of the damage
Directly contradicted by Evil Emporer's description who if not directly stated is practically confirmed to be King cat
The ruler of the land of Cats, who has been corrupted by the
ancient magical power in the deep forest and finally
lost his self. He unleashes an endless stream of Curses and
Intense Waves of destruction, bringing a whole rest* to the world as the King of Ruin.
*Whole rest, meaning no note in a bar in music, symbolized the end of the world
no it isn't, it is just aesthetic, and it is in no way described as a power source, we only see some people use it as a power source, while the rest don't even use it as power sources, they use them as either decoration or to do something out of the ordinary, we have no statements of them using it as a power source, the thing we actually have seen be used as a power source are curses and magic/mana, but even then just because someone has something doesn't mean they scale to the full capabilities of it, even if in theory someone has it, how do we know they are able to output said power to its full extent
 
Yeah, for Muu, not anyone else, because if you want to say that it is something outside of aesthetic then you need to have proof, not just ooh these all have the same theme,
Ah yes shining is being used to prove that an attack is being powered by something else when that is directly contradicted by the fact that we are told Gaia uses mana to do stuff, while also using the weapon divine creation of all things to attack, the crystals arent anywhere magic, given what we have actually seen of them
Ah yes, trees are now 9-C, Iron is now 9-B, Hydrogen is tier 7, etc etc etc, material=/=power source or source of most of the damage
Directly contradicted by Evil Emporer's description who if not directly stated is practically confirmed to be King cat

no it isn't, it is just aesthetic, and it is in no way described as a power source, we only see some people use it as a power source, while the rest don't even use it as power sources, they use them as either decoration or to do something out of the ordinary, we have no statements of them using it as a power source, the thing we actually have seen be used as a power source are curses and magic/mana, but even then just because someone has something doesn't mean they scale to the full capabilities of it, even if in theory someone has it, how do we know they are able to output said power to its full extent
At this point I can only assume you are trying to shoot this down for some personal reason
1. Have you tried to show me where you proved that the 4D crystals aren’t what is being referred to as mana? Or perhaps that the creation of all things isn’t the tree, the tree that is literally connected to Gaia herself and grows 4D crystals.
2. The Japanese desc says tyrant cat got power from another world, which is where the 4D crystals come from, and even if he was using relic power, his attack itself is shown that it uses 4th dimensional power no matter what mental gymnastics you use to dodge it.
3. I’ve already addressed literally everything else you’ve said already
 
the speed justification is the biggest thing worrying me, since obviously what's on the profile is wrong but I have no way of getting a better guess as of yet
does anybody have some input here?
 
its okay no one cares much about speed in vsthread except infinite and immeasurable or non speed equal fight. as long as we can index it. it is good enough. let the almighty Speed Equal work wonder
 
case by case base on attack animation+summary i guess. but tbh if we use gameplay everyone scales to each other which would be Arceus fights a normal pokemon tier outlier.
 
Not to mention the fact that no cat in-game ever reacts or dodges an attack, not via speed at least
the dodge mechanic itself creates cringe scaling as well
 
they added a description for doktor heaven though
時空科学者アビス博士 (Jikū Kagaku-sha Abisu-hakase, Spacetime Scientist Dr. Abyss)
超越科学者ヘヴン博士 (Chōetsu Kagaku-sha Hevun-hakase, Transcendental Scientist Dr. Heaven)
Uni481-1.pngJP Script
異次元エネルギーの強大な力に魅せられた高名な科学者
生命体を破壊し、クリスタルに昇華する残酷な技術を持つ
黒い敵とエイリアンに超打たれ強い(範囲攻撃)
EN Translation
A renowned scientist fascinated by the mighty power of interdimensional energy
Brutally skilled at destroying life forms and sublimating them into crystal
Extremely hard-hitting against Black and Alien enemies (Range Attacks)
Uni481-2.pngJP Script
クリスタルの圧倒的な力に取り憑かれた名高い科学者
自らも力への渇望と破壊の衝動を止めることは出来ない
黒い敵とエイリアンに極ダメージを与える(範囲攻撃)
EN Translation
A renowned scientist obsessed with the overwhelming power of the crystal
Unable to stop their own thirst for power and urge to destroy
Deals extreme damage to Black and Alien enemies (Range Attacks)
 
also I don't think I noticed this before but the description of musashi seemingly confirms that his swords use the power of the crystals
剣神・宮本武蔵 (Kenshin Miyamoto Musashi, Wargod・Musashi Miyamoto)
宮本武蔵 (Miyamoto Musashi, Musashi Miyamoto)
Cat Unit # 448Legend Rare Cat
Uni448 f00.pngJP Script
異次元の武具「にゃんこ日輪刀」の呪いによって
果て無き戦禍に身を投じた天下無双の剣豪
黒い敵に打たれ強く、極ダメージを与える
EN Translation
The curse of the "Nyanko Hinrin Katana" a weapon from another dimension
A master swordswoman who has thrown themselves into endless warfare
Strong against Black enemies and inflicts extreme damage
Uni448 c00.pngJP Script
異次元の武具「にゃんこ月輪刀」の呪いの力を使い
天下無双の戦いぶりで迫りくる敵を切り伏せる
黒い敵に打たれ強く、極ダメージを与える
EN Translation
Using the power of the curse of the "Nyanko Hinrin Katana" a weapon from another dimension
It can be used to cut down enemies with the power of the curse
Strong against Black enemies and inflicts extreme damage
 
well we might have an option for scaling the sizes of units, which is a big win
dogumaru is apparently half of a human attached to something else, so the top part of him would likely be the size of an average adult male's
this would give stuff like mighty kristal muu large size added to their profile which is a cool thing I guess
perhaps you could also scale the speeds of attacks from it?
 
bucko
doom engine pandora's profile still has some stats to be found so I think I'll get to work on making another blog that may be easier to do
still no speed feats for the verse
 
I was planning to make one for the cat god but conveniently there's no direct evidence that he's the strongest character in the verse
 
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