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I don’t see how just cause we got 1 5B calc that it has to be considered an outlier especially it’s from someone more powerful. We have characters in VSBW who be having just 1 calc yet still scale to it regardless

Anyways again where does Base Narutoans Sasuke (Last/New Era) scale?
 
So, remember when I gave this the green light in the dms? Well....
arnold-schwarzenegger-lied.gif
Dammit man, I was gonna make this joke!
 
That scan at the end is literally for the Moon colliding with the Earth. It's in the exact same sentence.
Either A) the narrator can still be referencing other events in the movie as “nothing can prevent it” checks out with how even when the moon is stopped the earth was still going to get destroyed or B) Toneri was gonna fracture earth beyond its GBE with the moon, ie total planetary annihilation.
 
Anyway, I agree with all of this. You did a phenomenal job putting all of this together, Arc.

I agree with the 5-B end for Toneri and BSM Naruto scaling, but I would be fine with the Low 5-B+ end if anyone can give good reasons for it.

My only “contention” would be that One-Rinnegan Juubidara should downscale to baseline 5-B as opposed to Low 5-B+ and Guy’s AP should scale to him all around (not just with Night Guy) since he was already overwhelming Madara with the first attack of Evening Elephant.
 
Either A) the narrator can still be referencing other events in the movie as “nothing can prevent it” checks out with how even when the moon is stopped the earth was still going to get destroyed or B) Toneri was gonna fracture earth beyond its GBE with the moon, ie total planetary annihilation.
I don't see how the narrator can be referencing other events. That whole first sentence is "one incident" as the narrator then goes on to mention that the two incidents are the Moon colliding with the Earth and Hanabi beeing kidnapped. There is no sign of any third incident being mentioned there.
 
I don't see how the narrator can be referencing other events.
The narrator is omniscient in terms of knowledge of the story. So, he can allude to events that the reader isn’t aware of at that exact point. Even if I grant you your position tho it doesn’t debunk LoJ direct statement of being able to destroy the world, Toneri’s statements scaling to Hamura, or point B I mentioned in my last post.
 
The narrator is omniscient in terms of knowledge of the story. So, he can allude to events that the reader isn’t aware of at that exact point. Even if I grant you your position tho it doesn’t debunk LoJ direct statement of being able to destroy the world, Toneri’s statements scaling to Hamura, or point B I mentioned in my last post.
Personally, I don't agree. It makes no sense for the narrator to talk about one thing then suddenly reference something else unmentioned that has nothing to do with the former thing. It's just speculation.
 
Kakashi
Allegedly Kakashi is comparable to Kashin Koji in the anime. If that's true and someone wants to slide with scans confirming or denying that, that'd be cool. Kakashi never shows up in the main story, so he doesn't create any contradictions and would be fine to scale to Koji given he's comparable.

Hokage Kakashi = 312.8 ZT (5-B)
I got the scans, it’s from Boruto Episode 211.

Kakashi swaps hands with Koji for a bit before Koji runs off.
 
Base Naruto in the Last isn’t a god tier.
Base Naruto could react to TCM Toneri's GWRE and is fast enough to punch Toneri and withstand the AP of his punch that made a huge crater on the moon surface. Base Naruto in the last can be scaled to God tier. Base Naruto is low-end relative to his BSM in the last.
 
Because aside from the Six Paths Chibaku Tensei itself, virtually none of these characters have feats on any level remotely close to this.
a casual small planet level feat isn't vastly close to planet level?

you realize there are objectively larger jumps in tiers in Naruto than this one, some of these upgrades you were a part of and had no issue in.
why is that it's only a problem when the number is 5 and not 6 or 7 or 8 or 9
I question the very nature of the Six Paths Chibaku Tensei scaling to their typical attack potency in the first case. It's just blindly accepting powerscaling to say "Oh, if Hagoromo and Hamura could move the Chibaku Tensei into orbit over this amount of time, then they can throw a punch that can destroy the planet too." Who says they can do this?
We do this based on our standards for how power scaling as a concept works and how fictional energy, especially ones that are widely homogenized in the way they are used to fight in the story.
We do, by pure conjecture. Then it spirals outward from there. "Oh, they can make their durability this level because they output that amount of chakra per seconds." "Oh, this characters scales to Planet level because they clashed weapons with this other character."
This comes off as Incoherent rambling, considering the things your criticizing has nothing do with naruto and everything to do with our standards of converting energy to something that scalable, by your own standards we can invalidate every single calc on this wiki, we can go even one step further and shred apart the very foundation of the wiki by debunking dimensional tiering in it's totally, an standard based on broad esoteric concepts that have very little to do with scaling and have even less connecting tissue outside fictional techno blabble deranged from science fiction stories and Pseudo science .Yet the issue only arises in the specifics.
Do these characters show any sign that they're that powerful without that one specific jutsu? No? Huh, how's that for consistency.
you can apply this for literally any feats, is inset character A that powerful without that one specific feat?.

Or how about is this character really that powerful outside of those 3 or 4 feats, or is it 10 feats, or a 100 at what point do we consider something consistent, is it based on numerical evidence?, in which case you should make a thread to downgrade 99% of the characters on the wiki as most fictional series have statistically more tier 8 and 9 feats than not.

My biggest issue is that there is no damn consistency in this.
This is just being disingenuous, Arc has laid calcs, why they scale as well as the explanations, as well as logical scaling based on how power scaling as rule of thumb works.
. I think a healthy degree of skepticism is warrnated when upgrades are this vast and all-inclusive.
they not vast that's the issue this isn't a case of characters that get killed by common wooden spoons jumping to planet busters, these are characters jumping from lower to higher end within the same tier based on the fact that the lower tier was done casually.

It"s fine to be skeptical of things when warranted, but being skeptical for the sake being skeptical is no better than blindly agreeing to something.
 
Personally, I don't agree. It makes no sense for the narrator to talk about one thing then suddenly reference something else unmentioned that has nothing to do with the former thing. It's just speculation.
Not really it’s far from an illogical conclusion. The narrator mentions “nothing can prevent it” which alludes to how stopping the moon wouldn’t inherently stop Toneri from destroying the world, as he has the LoJ in his back pocket. But we can agree to disagree, as this point doesn’t impact my Toneri scaling greatly.
 
you realize there are objectively larger jumps in tiers in Naruto than this one, some of these upgrades you were a part of and had no issue in.
why is that it's only a problem when the number is 5 and not 6 or 7 or 8 or 9

Please don't think I have zero issues with the rest of the verse. They're just not a part of this thread.

Or how about is this character really that powerful outside of those 3 or 4 feats, or is it 10 feats, or a 100 at what point do we consider something consistent, is it based on numerical evidence?, in which case you should make a thread to downgrade 99% of the characters on the wiki as most fictional series have statistically more tier 8 and 9 feats than not.

I'd say "At least more than once" is at least more consistent than just "once."


I already know I'm going to be outvoted on this, and I don't have enough time or energy to argue on this thread. I don't have enough time or energy for my own threads. Don't drag this out if nobody else disagrees with it. I already know it's going to get applied sooner or later so might as well make it sooner.
 
Not really it’s far from an illogical conclusion. The narrator mentions “nothing can prevent it” which alludes to how stopping the moon wouldn’t inherently stop Toneri from destroying the world, as he has the LoJ in his back pocket. But we can agree to disagree, as this point doesn’t impact my Toneri scaling greatly.
It is entirely an illogical conclusion. The Light of Justice is not an incident that is occuring at the time that the narrator is talking. He is talking about two incidents that have occured; not a far-off future unrelated incident.
 
I don't have enough time or energy to argue on this thread.
This thread doesn’t need to be concluded in a day, don’t feel rushed to get out all the deliberation immediately. I like to keep my threads open long enough for anyone who wants to discuss to discuss. I value your discourse in thread, so please don’t feel the need to quit the thread immediately.
 
It is entirely an illogical conclusion. The Light of Justice is not an incident that is occuring at the time that the narrator is talking. He is talking about two incidents that have occured; not a far-off future unrelated incident.
The moon has yet to collide with earth so he’s inherently referencing the future.
 
This thread doesn’t need to be concluded in a day, don’t feel rushed to get out all the deliberation immediately. I like to keep my threads open long enough for anyone who wants to discuss to discuss. I value your discourse in thread, so please don’t feel the need to quit the thread immediately.
I will not be majroly arguing further in this thread as I can already see that the other knowledgeable Naruto members are in favor of it so I'm outvoted already. I don't see any value in wasting my time or energy when I can already see what the conclusion will be.
 
Please don't think I have zero issues with the rest of the verse. They're just not a part of this thread.
I bring it up because you never bring up those issues when you partake in those threads but only do so if the numerical number is high

But thats fine you dont have to argue constantly if you disagree with something vehemently (nobody has to, it's really not that serious,), Im only clarifying why your reply confuses me.
 
I will not be majroly arguing further in this thread as I can already see that the other knowledgeable Naruto members are in favor of it so I'm outvoted already. I don't see any value in wasting my time or energy when I can already see what the conclusion will be.
I can’t force you to participate but I’d still appreciate your participation.


The Narrator is talking about the Moon being on course of collide with the Earth which is something that is happening.
and “nothing can prevent it” as a statement is a clear indication of the future
 
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