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Accelerator Revisions and minor Kakine revision
- Thread starter Scrlk666777
- Start date
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Tihy It's not fully true what u said, as don't talk is partially right as shown on accel manga with the coffins, but I don't remember accel getting a bigger brain or becoming as big as an house
To put it more simply esper have 3 way to "lvl up":increasing their calculations power or new more efficient formulas (example lvl upper), practical application or new way to use power (accel advanced vector control and kekinay organic DM) or gaining bigger body, brain or soul(coffins in accel manga , lvl 6 shift on misaka with aim connection)
Btw this if u don't cheat and mix magic with it
To put it more simply esper have 3 way to "lvl up":increasing their calculations power or new more efficient formulas (example lvl upper), practical application or new way to use power (accel advanced vector control and kekinay organic DM) or gaining bigger body, brain or soul(coffins in accel manga , lvl 6 shift on misaka with aim connection)
Btw this if u don't cheat and mix magic with it
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As true as that ia Accelerator has not once powered up his level. Even his wings are stated to be values he merely inputted into his reality.
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When did Kakine ever imply stamina? The point is, Accelerator hasn't level'd in the way DT is assuming. in fact the fact that he's apparently stronger with half calculations still makes no sense especially with what you posted. It's merely he learned new applications instead of relying on redirection. The variables themselves are not randomly powering up since he doesn't rely on some power that doesn't exist, he is reliant on the world existing. Hence point Pre should scale, especially due to what Maloxsaid with calc power. I'll say it again.
Vectors don't magically get stronger like it's DBZ.
Vectors don't magically get stronger like it's DBZ.
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- Thread starter
- #47
Kakine was only guessing, he doesn't actually know for sure and it wasn't stamnia he was referring to but rather how long the wings can be activated for. The black wings are based on Accel's emotions and at the time, Kakine only knew of the black wings.
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HE did knew about the white ones as he saw the ww3 reports
Quote: "Once that limit comes, you are done for. That may be the cue for the appearance of those wings that no theory can explain, but you can't use those for long periods of time or have complete control of them, can you? In fact, that unexplainable phenomenon must cause a huge amount of unexplainable consumption. Either way, you have no time left."
Quote: "Once that limit comes, you are done for. That may be the cue for the appearance of those wings that no theory can explain, but you can't use those for long periods of time or have complete control of them, can you? In fact, that unexplainable phenomenon must cause a huge amount of unexplainable consumption. Either way, you have no time left."
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- #49
Kakine only mentioned the black ones in NT 6 as he wanted to fight Accel with black wings. You must be confusing NT 6 for NT 7.
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- #51
tbh it doesn't really matter because either way he was still only referring to black wings.
And it also doesn't matter since Kakine was only guessing not statiing actual known facts. Kakine knows nothing about the wings.
And it also doesn't matter since Kakine was only guessing not statiing actual known facts. Kakine knows nothing about the wings.
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He saw the reports he knows, kekinay is arrogant not stupid, he always get info on his opponents he did it in ot 15 too
Quote:"I don't have enough data on them because they have appeared so infrequently, but it is always when his emotions are at an extreme high or low that they appear. It does not matter if the emotions are positive or negative. Plus the wings never stay for long. …In other words, I just need to hold him in check. That's all. I don't know what those wings consume, but just like with his other powers, they will disappear on their own if I buy enough time."
It's a guess but more than plausible as we know espers do run out of power and the wings would consume more(at least pre nt 22)
Quote:"I don't have enough data on them because they have appeared so infrequently, but it is always when his emotions are at an extreme high or low that they appear. It does not matter if the emotions are positive or negative. Plus the wings never stay for long. …In other words, I just need to hold him in check. That's all. I don't know what those wings consume, but just like with his other powers, they will disappear on their own if I buy enough time."
It's a guess but more than plausible as we know espers do run out of power and the wings would consume more(at least pre nt 22)
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- Thread starter
- #53
Getting reports doesn't mean that he knows the full details behind them. The White wings was only shown briefly in WW3 and was the only time they were seen before NT 7, very little were known about them at that point, even Rensa who knew a lot about black wings, didn't seem to know much about white wings, only that there were reports.
There is a huge difference between hearing reports and actually seeing something in the flesh. And Kakine was in general wrong as in the next volume he couldn't handle the wings. Beetle is still Kakine.
Also it doesn't matter if it's a plausible guess or not, it's still at the end of the day, a guess and nothing more.
There is a huge difference between hearing reports and actually seeing something in the flesh. And Kakine was in general wrong as in the next volume he couldn't handle the wings. Beetle is still Kakine.
Also it doesn't matter if it's a plausible guess or not, it's still at the end of the day, a guess and nothing more.
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Either way I think we've said what needs to be said about Eaper 'power ups' and how vector variables don't magically get stronger when Espers are reliant on calculations and quantum mechanics, unless he's changing the magnitude itself. Coupled with 4he argument that post has better control, it literally boils down to that he merely learned "oh I can do more than redirect?" The proof is quite literally in the pudding.
I suppose either way all we can do is wait for a response.
I suppose either way all we can do is wait for a response.
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- #55
Accelerate420
That's true and yeah probably should wait for a response, although most here seem to agree with the general view of Accel's power should scale back to Pre-post headshot. Accel has gotten stronger but that is more due to the fact that he understands things he didn't before and is more creative. To Accel knowledge is just as valuable to him as calculations.
That's true and yeah probably should wait for a response, although most here seem to agree with the general view of Accel's power should scale back to Pre-post headshot. Accel has gotten stronger but that is more due to the fact that he understands things he didn't before and is more creative. To Accel knowledge is just as valuable to him as calculations.
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Espers are literally reality warpers after all. Leveling up increases their scale and application, but they don't power up through DBZ battles, yeah. The sister experimen4 for Accel was set up to fail by Aleister to begin with for Touma and even if it succeeded it wouldnt be due to him fighting a lot but learning applications from the fight. The experiment was rigged from the start anyways for DRAGON and beyond since Amata pointed out there was occult fuxkery in it. Just wanted to point this out just in case anyone tries to point out the Experiment.
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- #58
Accelerate420
Yeah the experiment was shown to be flawed from the very beginning, espeically when Railgun's Sister arc was released. The whole idea was based on Tree Diagrams predictions that Accel can defeat Mikoto after 128 moves and reach level 6, but those calculations were way off as he could easily defeat her in one move if he so wished, a few at most if he didn't take it seriously, which knowing Accel back then would most likely be the case.
Yeah the experiment was shown to be flawed from the very beginning, espeically when Railgun's Sister arc was released. The whole idea was based on Tree Diagrams predictions that Accel can defeat Mikoto after 128 moves and reach level 6, but those calculations were way off as he could easily defeat her in one move if he so wished, a few at most if he didn't take it seriously, which knowing Accel back then would most likely be the case.
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I'm pretty sure in OT3 it's even stated that if he didnt reach it they'd just keep going anyways, yeah. Besides to reach Level 6 isnt about how much fights you have, but it's a method of understanding and calculation power, that's why kakine and Accel are candidates.
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- #60
Only Accel was a known candidate. It's unknown if kakine was one or not but according to Gensei only Accel would have been able to reach that level and remain stable, that said like Kakine does he may only have been guessing.
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Kakine is the Spare Plan so I always assumed he could tough it out with a DM body but he's too stubborn to really seek out knowledge like Accel. But it wouldnt surprise me.
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- #63
Yes I know he was the back up Malox but that doesn't mean that the plan was for Kakine to be apart of the same plan that Accel was apart of. It was said that Aleister had many reoccuring plans going on and had back up plans just in case.
Kakine was most likely apart of one of those back up plans. What he had planned with Kakine is unknown.
Kakine was most likely apart of one of those back up plans. What he had planned with Kakine is unknown.
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Ranking doesn't go by strength. Kakine's ranking is earned by his versatility and the applications of his Dark Matter. It's unwise to scale him to Mikoto just because he's ranked 2. Him scaling to Rensa should be taken on after we get these Accel revisions confirmed.
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- #68
Top59
Kakine doesn't scale to Mikoto and Mugino never encountered Misaka's lightning, if you're talking about her 7-C lightning that is. Kakine has never shown great AP his best feats come from his verstaility, durabillity and after he became Dark Matter, his near immorality.
Against Rensa, it was also very much a two on one fight which Kakine did struggle in espically after black wings were brought out,
Kakine doesn't scale to Mikoto and Mugino never encountered Misaka's lightning, if you're talking about her 7-C lightning that is. Kakine has never shown great AP his best feats come from his verstaility, durabillity and after he became Dark Matter, his near immorality.
Against Rensa, it was also very much a two on one fight which Kakine did struggle in espically after black wings were brought out,
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getting a tad off topic but Kakine pre revival would defeat Misaka easily, just saiyan. I can't see Misaka's lightning doing Jack to his darkmatter.
my opinion on the topic of pre injury accel is still the same also.
For those who are confused about what constitutes as Misakas "lightning", it's literally just about any electric attack she uses. it's not cloud to ground lightning.
"In that instant, an electric spear appeared from Mikoto's bangs. The largest voltage of the lightning created in nature was 1 billion volts. Mikoto could rival that. That sublime spear of purple electricity that contained 1 billion volts glowed a bluish- white. The electrical spear decomposed the oxygen turning it to ozone as it flew the 7 meters to Kamijou in an instant".
Which is why I think having her separate attacks and her signature railgun, her most powerful move, being thousands of times weaker than her regular zappy zap powers, dumb. Then again I don't particularly like most of the fodder esper ratings. that being, everyone but Accelerator or Kakine.
Sorry. went off on a minirant.
my opinion on the topic of pre injury accel is still the same also.
For those who are confused about what constitutes as Misakas "lightning", it's literally just about any electric attack she uses. it's not cloud to ground lightning.
"In that instant, an electric spear appeared from Mikoto's bangs. The largest voltage of the lightning created in nature was 1 billion volts. Mikoto could rival that. That sublime spear of purple electricity that contained 1 billion volts glowed a bluish- white. The electrical spear decomposed the oxygen turning it to ozone as it flew the 7 meters to Kamijou in an instant".
Which is why I think having her separate attacks and her signature railgun, her most powerful move, being thousands of times weaker than her regular zappy zap powers, dumb. Then again I don't particularly like most of the fodder esper ratings. that being, everyone but Accelerator or Kakine.
Sorry. went off on a minirant.
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Pretty sure even Gunha can body Misaka as well if he's given a reason to.
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- #72
Although Gunha did also admit that he would lose to Misaka.
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Mm Not quite. Gunha said he might lose if that kept up. That being him standing there tanking attacks from Misaka. Their contest they were having. He also said might lose. Misaka straight up said she would probably lose if he fought back like normal, which is backed up by his fight against L6S Misaka.
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Something I must ask is who else scales to Accel if Pre Headshot is 5B?
Rensa?
Rensa?
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Probably just Rensa honestly.
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I wouldnt scale them since Kazakiri didnt take a serious attack from Accel, he just redirected their vectors and Gab just danmaku magic'd them from range half of the time. Rensa should be the only one who scales.
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- #78
Schnee
Rensa is probably the only one.
TIHYDDWBE
Same difference to me and it wasn't really a fight against L6S Misaka, she mostly treated him like an annoyance more than anything and was more focused on destroying the Windowless building. It was also only her first shift. That being said it was still pretty impressive that he took on her lightning.
Back on topic though, how would one scale Kakine's AP?
Rensa is probably the only one.
TIHYDDWBE
Same difference to me and it wasn't really a fight against L6S Misaka, she mostly treated him like an annoyance more than anything and was more focused on destroying the Windowless building. It was also only her first shift. That being said it was still pretty impressive that he took on her lightning.
Back on topic though, how would one scale Kakine's AP?
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Part of me thinks Gabriel should scale given he fought Accelerator and Kazakiri
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