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I mean, his points were addressed and most made no sense in this context, so I don't see why we would downgrade anything based on that.
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2-A Nasuverse revision
- Thread starter Iapitus_The_Impaler
- Start date
- 888
- 53
Wait, need to remind this. Even if there can be an infinite amount of parallel universes/worlds, in Nasuverse itself, there can't be a literal infinite amount of universes in Nasuverse, but at most only "virtually infinite" because of the Quantum Time Lock phenomenon in Nasuverse. Even if Moon Cell can record all of the timelines that are preserved and pruned. It still can't be an uncountable infinite, but still countable infinite. Taking this into account, chars from Nasuverse can as much be Tier 2-A at most which can damage countable infinite timelines (eg. the Human Order or the Time Tree). So, in the end.... Welp, It still counts as 2-A tiers for the high end tiers (basing on Goetia burning the Human Order, which includes all of the parallel worlds like FSN, SF, Kara no Kyoukai, Tsukihime, etc that count as the "the main timelines", which is shown in FGO-KnK collab that Goetia burned up KnK verse too, and he did it with little sweats. Mind that this is not even remotely the end purpose as his purpose is to used up all the energy accumulated from all the timelines he burned into Ars Almadel Salomonis to fuel time travel back into the Genesis. Kama/Mara was shown that she can do the same thing too, as if she became complete Beast, she would not just burn up the timeline she is in, but the whole Human Order too will collapse into her "Lapse". Characters on the same level should be able to do it too or the same level of thing)
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Dunno how to quote multiple people, so I'll just bold the quotations.
Also, the don't apply to the Mooncell. So, why are we debating this?
Either the Moon Cell also operates under the laws of the Foundation of Humanity, or it also posesses its own Tree of Time as a macrocosm based on that. Its primary objective is to observe and record every possibility on Earth as a database of humanity, these possibilities are the parallel and adjacent worlds you believe makes the Moon Cell Multiversal+
Quoting this again:
'And so, there is a set time frame in which these branches are trimmed, extra possibilities are removed, and future histories, once fluid, turn to stone. The mages of the old world called this time frame 'the Foundation of Humanity. Such laws apply to the Moon Cell as well. The Moon Cell is a self-upgrading observatory, which continues to record every incident and possibility on Earth. ' - Fate Extella Altera route prologue (Localization).
UBW and Ionian Hetairoi being universal isn't accepted by mostnormal people. But the "Layers" that people talk about when referring to things like the reverse side and human world of observation do indeed contain universes considering the human world is the entire universe
They aren't but something around the level of Ars Paulina is. Microcosms and Macrocosms.
The Human world is just one layer of the many that covers the planet and it's no bigger than the solar system. Adding the entirety of the history of it also known as the Greater History of Man or the Tree of Time using my arguments is how you get to 3A or 2C or you won't even get that.
Ok so the argument for downgrading has changed from "the entire multiverse that contains multiple timelines is actually just a single universe" to "it's just a reality marble" is this correct?
No. The Tree of Time has never been declared to be multiversal. You guys just assumed it did thinking a parallel world is an entire universe unto itself, while ignoring the concept of a world is defined in the Nasuverse. Or do you honestly think that The World prunes entire universes for the survival of one species on a planet which occupies 0.00000000000000042% of their space?
I said SE.RA.PH is a compilation of RMs no larger than a planet in reply to a scan which was used to say it scales to multiversal, even though it only said the ideas and designs were based on more than just the real world. A layer like the World of Man is Reality so calling it a Reality Marble is weird, but it helps people conceptualize I suppose.
After reading all of this, it is quite weird. I mean as if the whole thing in Nasuverse was only planetary even though some things do suggest at universal, recently they went back to total universal again with Kama/Mara that clearly she is an entirely universal threat
Servants are not planetary based both on their lack of feats on such level and an active statement saying they couldn't. It doesn't apply to Beasts, Grands, the old Prime ones (Gods in the flesh not Divine Spirits), True Demons, Bodhisatvas, etc. that are currently the top tiers of the Nasuverse. Goetia just seems planetary when you don't pay close attention to what he actually did.
If you're curious about the cosmology of fate, I suggest you read this summary.
And this for a compilation of the information on Quantum Timelock.
Also, the don't apply to the Mooncell. So, why are we debating this?
Either the Moon Cell also operates under the laws of the Foundation of Humanity, or it also posesses its own Tree of Time as a macrocosm based on that. Its primary objective is to observe and record every possibility on Earth as a database of humanity, these possibilities are the parallel and adjacent worlds you believe makes the Moon Cell Multiversal+
Quoting this again:
'And so, there is a set time frame in which these branches are trimmed, extra possibilities are removed, and future histories, once fluid, turn to stone. The mages of the old world called this time frame 'the Foundation of Humanity. Such laws apply to the Moon Cell as well. The Moon Cell is a self-upgrading observatory, which continues to record every incident and possibility on Earth. ' - Fate Extella Altera route prologue (Localization).
UBW and Ionian Hetairoi being universal isn't accepted by most
They aren't but something around the level of Ars Paulina is. Microcosms and Macrocosms.
The Human world is just one layer of the many that covers the planet and it's no bigger than the solar system. Adding the entirety of the history of it also known as the Greater History of Man or the Tree of Time using my arguments is how you get to 3A or 2C or you won't even get that.
Ok so the argument for downgrading has changed from "the entire multiverse that contains multiple timelines is actually just a single universe" to "it's just a reality marble" is this correct?
No. The Tree of Time has never been declared to be multiversal. You guys just assumed it did thinking a parallel world is an entire universe unto itself, while ignoring the concept of a world is defined in the Nasuverse. Or do you honestly think that The World prunes entire universes for the survival of one species on a planet which occupies 0.00000000000000042% of their space?
I said SE.RA.PH is a compilation of RMs no larger than a planet in reply to a scan which was used to say it scales to multiversal, even though it only said the ideas and designs were based on more than just the real world. A layer like the World of Man is Reality so calling it a Reality Marble is weird, but it helps people conceptualize I suppose.
After reading all of this, it is quite weird. I mean as if the whole thing in Nasuverse was only planetary even though some things do suggest at universal, recently they went back to total universal again with Kama/Mara that clearly she is an entirely universal threat
Servants are not planetary based both on their lack of feats on such level and an active statement saying they couldn't. It doesn't apply to Beasts, Grands, the old Prime ones (Gods in the flesh not Divine Spirits), True Demons, Bodhisatvas, etc. that are currently the top tiers of the Nasuverse. Goetia just seems planetary when you don't pay close attention to what he actually did.
If you're curious about the cosmology of fate, I suggest you read this summary.
And this for a compilation of the information on Quantum Timelock.
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Either the Moon Cell also operates under the laws of the Foundation of Humanity, or it also posesses its own Tree of Time as a macrocosm based on that.
The thing is, there is no reason that the mooncell would possess the layers at all. The layers are specific to Gaia which, last I checked, is not the mooncell.
The Human world is just one layer of the many that covers the planet and it's no bigger than the solar system.
Except the human world which is also called the human universe, is specifically called the human world of observatio. It applies to all that they can observe which, as seen in the future Gilgamesh saw, includes deep space
No. The Tree of Time has never been declared to be multiversal. You guys just assumed it did thinking a parallel world is an entire universe unto itself
The thing is, it is directly shown to be multiversal. The parallel worlds are shown to be universes and entire timelines. I'm not sure what more you need to prove it's a multiverse. It's either a multiverse due to multiple timelines and universes existing at once or it's a single universe that somehow contains multiple timelines. Those are literally the only two things it can be and one of them is completely illogical.
while ignoring the concept of a world is defined in the Nasuverse.
You do know there are multiple definitions for World in Fate right? For instance World is used to refer to Alayashiki, Gaia etc and world is also used to refer to a particular location. Much like in our world this definition is not limited to the planet, any location can be refered to world.
When they say Kaleidoscope is based on the operation of Infinite Parallel Worlds you honestly can not possibly tell me that it is saying that Worlds there doesn't mean universe/timeline or else the events of Fate/Stay night literally don't make sense and the events of Extella also don't work
Or do you honestly think that The World prunes entire universes for the survival of one species on a planet which occupies 0.00000000000000042% of their space?
The thing is pruning universes isn't just for survival of humans so I don't see your point here
Servants are planetary both based on their lack of feats on such level and an active statement saying they couldn't.
Yeah imma have to stop you right there. The statement didn't say they lacked the power to, the statement said that the counter force would prevent them from doing so if they had the power. There is a big difference.
The thing is, there is no reason that the mooncell would possess the layers at all. The layers are specific to Gaia which, last I checked, is not the mooncell.
The Human world is just one layer of the many that covers the planet and it's no bigger than the solar system.
Except the human world which is also called the human universe, is specifically called the human world of observatio. It applies to all that they can observe which, as seen in the future Gilgamesh saw, includes deep space
No. The Tree of Time has never been declared to be multiversal. You guys just assumed it did thinking a parallel world is an entire universe unto itself
The thing is, it is directly shown to be multiversal. The parallel worlds are shown to be universes and entire timelines. I'm not sure what more you need to prove it's a multiverse. It's either a multiverse due to multiple timelines and universes existing at once or it's a single universe that somehow contains multiple timelines. Those are literally the only two things it can be and one of them is completely illogical.
while ignoring the concept of a world is defined in the Nasuverse.
You do know there are multiple definitions for World in Fate right? For instance World is used to refer to Alayashiki, Gaia etc and world is also used to refer to a particular location. Much like in our world this definition is not limited to the planet, any location can be refered to world.
When they say Kaleidoscope is based on the operation of Infinite Parallel Worlds you honestly can not possibly tell me that it is saying that Worlds there doesn't mean universe/timeline or else the events of Fate/Stay night literally don't make sense and the events of Extella also don't work
Or do you honestly think that The World prunes entire universes for the survival of one species on a planet which occupies 0.00000000000000042% of their space?
The thing is pruning universes isn't just for survival of humans so I don't see your point here
Servants are planetary both based on their lack of feats on such level and an active statement saying they couldn't.
Yeah imma have to stop you right there. The statement didn't say they lacked the power to, the statement said that the counter force would prevent them from doing so if they had the power. There is a big difference.
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Actually the statement has two parts iirc.
First is how Servants (Even top tiers) cannot bust the planet due to lacking the power to do so.
Then Da Vinci confirms that even if somehow they have enough energy output to release such an attack, the counter force alongside other defense mechanismes will simply thwart out said attack
Don't take my word for it though as i don't remember clearly if that was the case
First is how Servants (Even top tiers) cannot bust the planet due to lacking the power to do so.
Then Da Vinci confirms that even if somehow they have enough energy output to release such an attack, the counter force alongside other defense mechanismes will simply thwart out said attack
Don't take my word for it though as i don't remember clearly if that was the case
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The quote was actually all about the protection measures from the planet. She says that releasing the full power of an np can't destroy the planet and then specifies that even if an anti planet np existed it would be stopped
Da Vinci: To begin with, even if you release the full power of a Top Servant's Noble Phantasm, it still can't completely destroy the planet.
Da Vinci: Anti-Planetary (or Anti-Star in some translations) Noble Phantasm...even if such a thing existed...According to calculations it's still not possible to destroy this planet.
Da Vinci: To begin with, even if you release the full power of a Top Servant's Noble Phantasm, it still can't completely destroy the planet.
Da Vinci: Anti-Planetary (or Anti-Star in some translations) Noble Phantasm...even if such a thing existed...According to calculations it's still not possible to destroy this planet.
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No he said that the only ones with the power to destroy planets are Beasts, Grands, Bodhisattva etc. while no servants can reach planetary due to the statement which isn't true as the statement was referring to the counter force stopping them nota lack of ap
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Rereading the bits of that, Da Vinci only says that Servants cannot destroy the planet. Even an Anti-Planet NP wouldn't do much according to her studies on Servant simply because they have no such power. I think it's kinda evident when servant Altjuna NP has been nerfed to the same levels of his Archer version NP in both range and attack output.
Meanwhile Holmes also states that the planet has several defenses mechanismes to deal with planet busting attack
It's something that even Beast Lair members confirmed it
Meanwhile Holmes also states that the planet has several defenses mechanismes to deal with planet busting attack
It's something that even Beast Lair members confirmed it
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Again, it's not referring to power his calculations were referring to the deterrent force
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Do I have to put my example again or do I make it brief ?
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Tier 2 and above doesn't need the dimensions to be universe sized to be approved, Tier 2 is reliant on how many spatiotemporal dimension there are, not the size of that dimension is. Of course pocket dimensions and others like it are exceptions, but again, they are exceptions. Timelines are automatically tier 2 because of the definition of timeline, there are 4 dimensions, including time.
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@Paul and Makkurona: Read my comment again and the summary I linked.
This is the last time I'll repeat this point. The Moon Cell only has its parallel worlds because it observes the Earth and records every possibility in it, mainly pertaining to humanity. That is its most primary objective, and the history of the Layer is the History of Man. These two are inseperable no matter how hard someone tries to play it off with Moon Cell exceptionalism.
The Human World is called the universe because even that has definitions in the Nasuverse. We got those from Extra CCC:
Universe of Observatio (Þª│µ©¼Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kansoku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time (µÖéÚûôÒü«µªéÕ┐Á, Jikan no Gainen) is expressed as "Time Within Conscious Recognition" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Ninshiki-sareru Jikan); also referred to as "Universe of Awareness" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö, Ninshiki Uchuu). Per the circumstances of human consciousness, the events of the Past, Present, and Future cannot in this expression of time be distinguished as categorically discrete, as the Future continuously passes unto the Present, and the Present into the Past. In exchange for an incapacity to perceive that which lies beyond the Present, one whose awareness is attuned to the "Universe of Observation" obtains the capacity to alter the Present referred to as Tomorrow.
Universe of Record (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kiroku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time is expressed as "Time Submitted to Record" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓ÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Kiroku-sareru Jikan) -- such that the Past, Present, and Future can be distinguished as categorically discrete entities per a chronological record of proceedings. The timelines represented within the Adjacent World Simulator (õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòîÒéÀÒâƒÒâÑÒâ¼Òâ╝Òé┐Òâ╝, Heikou Sekai Shimyure-ta-) of the Moon Cell Automaton may be collectively considered a "Universe of Record."
It's not actually the physical universe, but something completely different. I don't know what you're trying to say observation does. They can't even see past their layer of reality. As Holmes said in Camelot, their common sense and laws of physics exist in their layer. In Extella mats, we found out that the Universe referred by Quantum Timelock is this Universe of Observation/Awareness:
µ£¼µØÑÒü¬Òéëõ©ìÕ«ëÕ«ÜÒü¬µêæÒÇàÒü«Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«ÖÒéÆþÅ¥Õ£¿Òâ╗ÚüÄÕÄ╗Òâ╗µ£¬µØÑÒü½ÒéÅÒüƒÒéèÕ«ëÕ«ÜÒüòÒüøÒüªÒüäÒéïÒü«Òü»ÒüôÒü«ÒÇîõ╝ɵÄíÒÇìÒü¿ÒÇîÞ¿ÿÚî▓Õ©»ÒÇìÒü½ÒéêÒéïÒééÒü«Òü¿ÒâáÒâ╝Òâ│Òé╗Òâ½Òü»þÁÉÞ½ûÒüÑÒüæÒüªÒüäÒéïÒÇé
The Mooncell has concluded that the means by which our (µêæÒÇà) Universe of Awareness (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö) -- fundamentally unstable by nature -- is stabilized across the Past, Present, and Future lie in the execution of "culling" (õ╝ɵÄí, basai) and the formation of "records" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ©», Kiroku-tai, lit. "Recording Bands").
That the Moon Cell is either a part of, or does its own thing with its own QTL on possibilities which is also just a complete copy of what we have on Earth. Again, these two are inseperable.
Repeating it again and again won't make them multiverses, the Tree of Time has never been shown to be multiversal and you're just assuming that based on your mental schema of what timelines are and what parallel worlds mean. I can only tell you that the Nasuverse is not obliged to make sense to your view. In Riyo's quest, Da Vinci makes Adjacent Universe (õ©ªÞíîÕ«çÕ«Ö, heikou uchuu)." distinct from "Adjacent Reality / World" (õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòî, heikou sekai). These timelines or the Tree of Time is just Human History across multiple parallel and adjacent worlds. Further, it's no bigger than the Solar System:
õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòîÒü¿ÒüäÒüåÒééÒü«Òü»Òü¬ÒüÅÒüªÒü»Òü¬ÒéëÒü¬ÒüäÒééÒü«ÒüáÒüîÒÇü
Adjacent Realities are a necessary existence,
ÒüéÒéèÒüÖÒüÄÒüªÒééÒüäÒüæÒü¬ÒüäÒééÒü«ÒüáÒÇé
but they cannot be let to freely multiply.
ÒüèÒüèÒüûÒüúÒü▒Òü¬þø«þ«ùÒüáÒüîÒÇü
It's a very rough estimation,
Õ£░þÉâÒü«µûçµÿÄÒâ¼ÒâÖÒâ½ÒüºÒüéÒéîÒü░þÖ¥Õ╣┤ÒééþÂÜÒüæÒü░ÒüôÒü«Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗Òü»þá┤ÞúéÒüÖÒéïÒüáÒéìÒüåÒÇé
but should the Earth persist at its present level of civilization for another century, it's likely that the Solar System will collapse.
EXT_ENG: "If parallel worlds continued to increase in this manner, their number would eventually exceed the capacity of this dimension. Parallel worlds must exist, but in a manageable quantity. By my own rough calculations, and judging by the civilization of Earth alone, this solar system would collapse within 100 years if parallel worlds expanded without limits."
ÒüáÒüîõ║ïÕ«ƒÒü¿ÒüùÒüªµêæÒÇàÒü»þöƒÕ¡ÿÒüùÒÇüþ╣üµ«ûÒüùÒüªÒüäÒéïÒÇé
However, the reality is that we live and multiply.
Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗Òü»µâàÕá▒ÚçÅÒü½ÒéêÒüúÒüªþÀ®ÕÆîÒüÖÒéïÒüôÒü¿Òü¬ÒüÅÒÇü
The Solar System hasn't yet dissolved (þÀ®ÕÆî, kanwa, lit. "loosen / relax / alleviate") before the sheer volume of data that we produce,
ÒéÇÒüôÒüåõ©ÇÕääÕ╣┤Òü»õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝ÅÒüºÕ¡ÿþÂÜÒüºÒüìÒéïÒÇé
and it's likely that the status quo (õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝Å, ima no houshiki, lit. "the present formulation / system") can be sustained for another hundred million years.
EXT_ENG: "Seeing as how we do, in fact, live and multiply, the solar system is clearly not oversaturated with possibilities at this time, I extrapolate that this dimension can sustain our existence for the next 100,000,000 years."
Dunno, why you're pointing that out. Are you suggesting that for every adjacent or parallel worlds there's a Gaia and Alaya? Heck no, the timeline culling is in fact done by Alaya, so it's for the survivability of humans. The human order is the body of Law imposed within the realm of humanity by the action of the Shared Unconscious.
As Dysmity pointed out to you, there are two different statements from Holmes and Da Vinci. One explicitly says NPs from servants don't have the power to do it, the other says the counter force stops you. But if you want to be obstinate about it, then there's no point.
This is the last time I'll repeat this point. The Moon Cell only has its parallel worlds because it observes the Earth and records every possibility in it, mainly pertaining to humanity. That is its most primary objective, and the history of the Layer is the History of Man. These two are inseperable no matter how hard someone tries to play it off with Moon Cell exceptionalism.
The Human World is called the universe because even that has definitions in the Nasuverse. We got those from Extra CCC:
Universe of Observatio (Þª│µ©¼Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kansoku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time (µÖéÚûôÒü«µªéÕ┐Á, Jikan no Gainen) is expressed as "Time Within Conscious Recognition" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Ninshiki-sareru Jikan); also referred to as "Universe of Awareness" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö, Ninshiki Uchuu). Per the circumstances of human consciousness, the events of the Past, Present, and Future cannot in this expression of time be distinguished as categorically discrete, as the Future continuously passes unto the Present, and the Present into the Past. In exchange for an incapacity to perceive that which lies beyond the Present, one whose awareness is attuned to the "Universe of Observation" obtains the capacity to alter the Present referred to as Tomorrow.
Universe of Record (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kiroku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time is expressed as "Time Submitted to Record" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓ÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Kiroku-sareru Jikan) -- such that the Past, Present, and Future can be distinguished as categorically discrete entities per a chronological record of proceedings. The timelines represented within the Adjacent World Simulator (õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòîÒéÀÒâƒÒâÑÒâ¼Òâ╝Òé┐Òâ╝, Heikou Sekai Shimyure-ta-) of the Moon Cell Automaton may be collectively considered a "Universe of Record."
It's not actually the physical universe, but something completely different. I don't know what you're trying to say observation does. They can't even see past their layer of reality. As Holmes said in Camelot, their common sense and laws of physics exist in their layer. In Extella mats, we found out that the Universe referred by Quantum Timelock is this Universe of Observation/Awareness:
µ£¼µØÑÒü¬Òéëõ©ìÕ«ëÕ«ÜÒü¬µêæÒÇàÒü«Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«ÖÒéÆþÅ¥Õ£¿Òâ╗ÚüÄÕÄ╗Òâ╗µ£¬µØÑÒü½ÒéÅÒüƒÒéèÕ«ëÕ«ÜÒüòÒüøÒüªÒüäÒéïÒü«Òü»ÒüôÒü«ÒÇîõ╝ɵÄíÒÇìÒü¿ÒÇîÞ¿ÿÚî▓Õ©»ÒÇìÒü½ÒéêÒéïÒééÒü«Òü¿ÒâáÒâ╝Òâ│Òé╗Òâ½Òü»þÁÉÞ½ûÒüÑÒüæÒüªÒüäÒéïÒÇé
The Mooncell has concluded that the means by which our (µêæÒÇà) Universe of Awareness (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö) -- fundamentally unstable by nature -- is stabilized across the Past, Present, and Future lie in the execution of "culling" (õ╝ɵÄí, basai) and the formation of "records" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ©», Kiroku-tai, lit. "Recording Bands").
That the Moon Cell is either a part of, or does its own thing with its own QTL on possibilities which is also just a complete copy of what we have on Earth. Again, these two are inseperable.
Repeating it again and again won't make them multiverses, the Tree of Time has never been shown to be multiversal and you're just assuming that based on your mental schema of what timelines are and what parallel worlds mean. I can only tell you that the Nasuverse is not obliged to make sense to your view. In Riyo's quest, Da Vinci makes Adjacent Universe (õ©ªÞíîÕ«çÕ«Ö, heikou uchuu)." distinct from "Adjacent Reality / World" (õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòî, heikou sekai). These timelines or the Tree of Time is just Human History across multiple parallel and adjacent worlds. Further, it's no bigger than the Solar System:
õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòîÒü¿ÒüäÒüåÒééÒü«Òü»Òü¬ÒüÅÒüªÒü»Òü¬ÒéëÒü¬ÒüäÒééÒü«ÒüáÒüîÒÇü
Adjacent Realities are a necessary existence,
ÒüéÒéèÒüÖÒüÄÒüªÒééÒüäÒüæÒü¬ÒüäÒééÒü«ÒüáÒÇé
but they cannot be let to freely multiply.
ÒüèÒüèÒüûÒüúÒü▒Òü¬þø«þ«ùÒüáÒüîÒÇü
It's a very rough estimation,
Õ£░þÉâÒü«µûçµÿÄÒâ¼ÒâÖÒâ½ÒüºÒüéÒéîÒü░þÖ¥Õ╣┤ÒééþÂÜÒüæÒü░ÒüôÒü«Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗Òü»þá┤ÞúéÒüÖÒéïÒüáÒéìÒüåÒÇé
but should the Earth persist at its present level of civilization for another century, it's likely that the Solar System will collapse.
EXT_ENG: "If parallel worlds continued to increase in this manner, their number would eventually exceed the capacity of this dimension. Parallel worlds must exist, but in a manageable quantity. By my own rough calculations, and judging by the civilization of Earth alone, this solar system would collapse within 100 years if parallel worlds expanded without limits."
ÒüáÒüîõ║ïÕ«ƒÒü¿ÒüùÒüªµêæÒÇàÒü»þöƒÕ¡ÿÒüùÒÇüþ╣üµ«ûÒüùÒüªÒüäÒéïÒÇé
However, the reality is that we live and multiply.
Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗Òü»µâàÕá▒ÚçÅÒü½ÒéêÒüúÒüªþÀ®ÕÆîÒüÖÒéïÒüôÒü¿Òü¬ÒüÅÒÇü
The Solar System hasn't yet dissolved (þÀ®ÕÆî, kanwa, lit. "loosen / relax / alleviate") before the sheer volume of data that we produce,
ÒéÇÒüôÒüåõ©ÇÕääÕ╣┤Òü»õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝ÅÒüºÕ¡ÿþÂÜÒüºÒüìÒéïÒÇé
and it's likely that the status quo (õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝Å, ima no houshiki, lit. "the present formulation / system") can be sustained for another hundred million years.
EXT_ENG: "Seeing as how we do, in fact, live and multiply, the solar system is clearly not oversaturated with possibilities at this time, I extrapolate that this dimension can sustain our existence for the next 100,000,000 years."
Dunno, why you're pointing that out. Are you suggesting that for every adjacent or parallel worlds there's a Gaia and Alaya? Heck no, the timeline culling is in fact done by Alaya, so it's for the survivability of humans. The human order is the body of Law imposed within the realm of humanity by the action of the Shared Unconscious.
As Dysmity pointed out to you, there are two different statements from Holmes and Da Vinci. One explicitly says NPs from servants don't have the power to do it, the other says the counter force stops you. But if you want to be obstinate about it, then there's no point.
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I think Hun makes the most sense. I also enjoy how people are arguing that since a admin agreed with the other side that makes them right. the same could be said for the other side as well since Matthew agrees with the downgrade. Reach a conclusion or a compromise instead of screaming "but we talked about this before" and address the counter arguments properly.
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To me it can go either...Is there anything on Extella Link or just Extella ?
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Fate/Extra True End the PSP game version only leads into Fate/Extra CCC with Fate/Extra CCC ALL endings lead into Extella which then leads into Extella link. I Posted scans from Extella, and CCC.Dangai Ichigo said:
https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3400381#153 Click this link, and then click link #21 to see all of my supporting evidence for tier 2-A.
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This ad nausem despite the evidence supporting a multiverse... which has been posted over 9999+ times over the span of 999+ threads at this point.. At least thats how it feels to me
I also already posted the evidence of why the layers/textures are contradictory from across all Nasuverse works. They simply don't make sense at all.
At this point, i don't even want to continue aruging/debating over something that has been debunked, and will continue to be debunked by not just me, but multiple other people. i've grown tired of it, and of course the only Admin that will Understand any of this terminology in the Nasuverse is . Monarch Laciel whom i must repeat made his stance on the 2-A upgrade very clear stating that he agrees with it, and Antvasima said "Okay. For the record, I trust Monarch Laciel's sense of judgement." [1]
Reposting this since i edited it.
I also already posted the evidence of why the layers/textures are contradictory from across all Nasuverse works. They simply don't make sense at all.
At this point, i don't even want to continue aruging/debating over something that has been debunked, and will continue to be debunked by not just me, but multiple other people. i've grown tired of it, and of course the only Admin that will Understand any of this terminology in the Nasuverse is . Monarch Laciel whom i must repeat made his stance on the 2-A upgrade very clear stating that he agrees with it, and Antvasima said "Okay. For the record, I trust Monarch Laciel's sense of judgement." [1]
Reposting this since i edited it.
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Yeah, about destroying the planet... It is definitely possible.
Wait! Wait! Wait! That's impossible!
Planet has a safety system, to slip all of it and destroy the planet is practically impossible.
Well, that's true. This planet, with its long history, has miraculously survived threat on destruction on multiple occasions. Excluding the threats from outside intervention of course, for us who were born in this planet to destroy, yes, it is close to impossibility. So to do it, you need first to violate that basic principle. ...This is what Lion King tried to do. And also Edison tried to do with Holy Grail.
Holmes straight up said that Da Vinci was wrong about her assumptions, planet destruction being unable to do shouldn't be a viable argument, especially when it's debunked in the game itself. It's because of the basic principle that prevents them from destroying the planet, not the AP itself.
Wait! Wait! Wait! That's impossible!
Planet has a safety system, to slip all of it and destroy the planet is practically impossible.
Well, that's true. This planet, with its long history, has miraculously survived threat on destruction on multiple occasions. Excluding the threats from outside intervention of course, for us who were born in this planet to destroy, yes, it is close to impossibility. So to do it, you need first to violate that basic principle. ...This is what Lion King tried to do. And also Edison tried to do with Holy Grail.
Holmes straight up said that Da Vinci was wrong about her assumptions, planet destruction being unable to do shouldn't be a viable argument, especially when it's debunked in the game itself. It's because of the basic principle that prevents them from destroying the planet, not the AP itself.
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So Da Vinci says we can't but Holmes says we can but we are simply not allowed to, basically my example
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This is the last time I'll repeat this point. The Moon Cell only has its parallel worlds because it observes the Earth and records every possibility in it, mainly pertaining to humanity.
Correct the mooncell observes the planet and scans it. It produces parallel worlds based on possibilities like with the actual World.
That is its most primary objective, and the history of the Layer is the History of Man.
So you're trying to say that since it watches the Earth it recreated the layers system? This is blatantly incorrect. A simple look at the far side of the mooncell shows this. The reverse side in on the Earth is under the top side, the reverse or far side of the mooncell isn't directly under the mooncell. This alone should instantly show you that there is no layer system.
In addition the mooncell has been recording since before the age of man
"These two are inseperable no matter how hard someone tries to play it off with Moon Cell exceptionalism.'
But they aren't inseparable because, despite what you think, not only would it not make sense for the mooncell to have layers but the layers are specifically Gaia's thing
The Human World is called the universe because even that has definitions in the Nasuverse. We got those from Extra CCC:
Universe of Observation (Þª│µ©¼Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kansoku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time (µÖéÚûôÒü«µªéÕ┐Á, Jikan no Gainen) is expressed as "Time Within Conscious Recognition" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Ninshiki-sareru Jikan); also referred to as "Universe of Awareness" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö, Ninshiki Uchuu). Per the circumstances of human consciousness, the events of the Past, Present, and Future cannot in this expression of time be distinguished as categorically discrete, as the Future continuously passes unto the Present, and the Present into the Past. In exchange for an incapacity to perceive that which lies beyond the Present, one whose awareness is attuned to the "Universe of Observation" obtains the capacity to alter the Present referred to as Tomorrow.
This is the actual physical universe in the verse, it functions funnily enough like our own universe and any other normal universe with linear time.
Universe of Record (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kiroku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time is expressed as "Time Submitted to Record" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓ÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Kiroku-sareru Jikan) -- such that the Past, Present, and Future can be distinguished as categorically discrete entities per a chronological record of proceedings. The timelines represented within the Adjacent World Simulator (õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòîÒéÀÒâƒÒâÑÒâ¼Òâ╝Òé┐Òâ╝, Heikou Sekai Shimyure-ta-) of the Moon Cell Automaton may be collectively considered a "Universe of Record."
This is a universe that has been completely recorded and indexed in simple terms, with the onlookers able to read the events of it.
It's not actually the physical universe, but something completely different.
But this is also completely incorrect, the human universe of observation and the universe of record existing separately doesn't somehow magically disprove the fact that it is actually a universe.
I don't know what you're trying to say observation does. They can't even see past their layer of reality. As Holmes said in Camelot, their common sense and laws of physics exist in their layer.
Common sense and the laws of physics exist literally anywhere outside of the reverse side
In Extella mats, we found out that the Universe referred by Quantum Timelock is this Universe of Observation/Awareness:
So the quantum timelock is talking about the universe of awareness, aka the actual universe, like we have said from the start
The Mooncell has concluded that the means by which our (µêæÒÇà) Universe of Awareness (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö) -- fundamentally unstable by nature -- is stabilized across the Past, Present, and Future lie in the execution of "culling" (õ╝ɵÄí, basai) and the formation of "records" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ©», Kiroku-tai, lit. "Recording Bands").
No one disagreed with this, the process of culling revolves around locking off timelines and then well, culling them.
That the Moon Cell is either a part of, or does its own thing with its own QTL on possibilities which is also just a complete copy of what we have on Earth. Again, these two are inseperable.
The timeline culling and qtls are a copy of the process the World uses. It is completely seperate from the concept of layers though
Repeating it again and again won't make them multiverses
Okay you don't be seeming to get it for some reason so let me explain it to you. The parallel worlds are stated to be timelines in fsn and fgo there are stated to be an infinite amount. So what you are saying by ignoring this is basically "the universe is a single universe but contains infinite timelines" which again is absolutely ludicrous
the Tree of Time has never been shown to be multiversal
Read what I said above, that clearly makes it multiversal there is no way around that. It has never been stated to be multiversal but if you well actually look at the facts of how the parallel worlds work you see that it is clearly a multiverse.
and you're just assuming that based on your mental schema of what timelines are and what parallel worlds mean.
No we are assuming that based on the in verse showings of what timelines are, which is, well a timeline like in any other verse or real life. Parallel worlds as shown in explanations of Kaleidoscope and Goetia's plan, and lostbelts, EoR etc. are clearly shown to be parallel universes because again these events literally don't work if we use your assumption of "its all one universe"
"If parallel worlds continued to increase in this manner, their number would eventually exceed the capacity of this dimension. Parallel worlds must exist, but in a manageable quantity. By my own rough calculations, and judging by the civilization of Earth alone, this solar system would collapse within 100 years if parallel worlds expanded without limits."
ÒüáÒüîõ║ïÕ«ƒÒü¿ÒüùÒüªµêæÒÇàÒü»þöƒÕ¡ÿÒüùÒÇüþ╣üµ«ûÒüùÒüªÒüäÒéïÒÇéHowever, the reality is that we live and multiply Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗Òü»µâàÕá▒ÚçÅÒü½ÒéêÒüúÒüªþÀ®ÕÆîÒüÖÒéïÒüôÒü¿Òü¬ÒüÅÒÇüThe Solar System hasn't yet dissolved (þÀ®ÕÆî, kanwa, lit. "loosen / relax / alleviate") before the sheer volume of data that we produce,ÒéÇÒüôÒüåõ©ÇÕääÕ╣┤Òü»õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝ÅÒüºÕ¡ÿþÂÜÒüºÒüìÒéïÒÇéand it's likely that the status quo (õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝Å, ima no houshiki, lit. "the present formulation / system") can be sustained for another hundred million years.
Seeing as how we do, in fact, live and multiply, the solar system is clearly not oversaturated with possibilities at this time, I extrapolate that this dimension can sustain our existence for the next 100,000,000 years.
This was addressed in all of the previous threads about this topic, look back to them if you want an explanation
Dunno, why you're pointing that out. Are you suggesting that for every adjacent or parallel worlds there's a Gaia and Alaya? Heck no, the timeline culling is in fact done by Alaya,
Quite interesting you bring this up, the fact that they are done by Alaya would indeed imply there is one single Alaya across the multiverse, I have no opinion on if there are multiple collective unconsciousnesses. However there is nothing saying there can't be more than one across the multiple universes.
so it's for the survivability of humans. The human order is the body of Law imposed within the realm of humanity by the action of the Shared Unconscious.
Quantum timelocks and culling aren't just for the survivability of humans but to maintain the existence of the universe. Fun fact the Quantum Time Locks are known as a Universal Event
As Dysmity pointed out to you, there are two different statements from Holmes and Da Vinci. One explicitly says NPs from servants don't have the power to do it, the other says the counter force stops you. But if you want to be obstinate about it, then there's no point.
Except if you actually look at the context it's flat out stated that its only because of the counter force
Correct the mooncell observes the planet and scans it. It produces parallel worlds based on possibilities like with the actual World.
That is its most primary objective, and the history of the Layer is the History of Man.
So you're trying to say that since it watches the Earth it recreated the layers system? This is blatantly incorrect. A simple look at the far side of the mooncell shows this. The reverse side in on the Earth is under the top side, the reverse or far side of the mooncell isn't directly under the mooncell. This alone should instantly show you that there is no layer system.
In addition the mooncell has been recording since before the age of man
"These two are inseperable no matter how hard someone tries to play it off with Moon Cell exceptionalism.'
But they aren't inseparable because, despite what you think, not only would it not make sense for the mooncell to have layers but the layers are specifically Gaia's thing
The Human World is called the universe because even that has definitions in the Nasuverse. We got those from Extra CCC:
Universe of Observation (Þª│µ©¼Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kansoku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time (µÖéÚûôÒü«µªéÕ┐Á, Jikan no Gainen) is expressed as "Time Within Conscious Recognition" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Ninshiki-sareru Jikan); also referred to as "Universe of Awareness" (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö, Ninshiki Uchuu). Per the circumstances of human consciousness, the events of the Past, Present, and Future cannot in this expression of time be distinguished as categorically discrete, as the Future continuously passes unto the Present, and the Present into the Past. In exchange for an incapacity to perceive that which lies beyond the Present, one whose awareness is attuned to the "Universe of Observation" obtains the capacity to alter the Present referred to as Tomorrow.
This is the actual physical universe in the verse, it functions funnily enough like our own universe and any other normal universe with linear time.
Universe of Record (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ«çÕ«Ö, Kiroku Uchuu) A domain of reality wherein the Concept of Time is expressed as "Time Submitted to Record" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓ÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûô, Kiroku-sareru Jikan) -- such that the Past, Present, and Future can be distinguished as categorically discrete entities per a chronological record of proceedings. The timelines represented within the Adjacent World Simulator (õ©ªÞíîõ©ûþòîÒéÀÒâƒÒâÑÒâ¼Òâ╝Òé┐Òâ╝, Heikou Sekai Shimyure-ta-) of the Moon Cell Automaton may be collectively considered a "Universe of Record."
This is a universe that has been completely recorded and indexed in simple terms, with the onlookers able to read the events of it.
It's not actually the physical universe, but something completely different.
But this is also completely incorrect, the human universe of observation and the universe of record existing separately doesn't somehow magically disprove the fact that it is actually a universe.
I don't know what you're trying to say observation does. They can't even see past their layer of reality. As Holmes said in Camelot, their common sense and laws of physics exist in their layer.
Common sense and the laws of physics exist literally anywhere outside of the reverse side
In Extella mats, we found out that the Universe referred by Quantum Timelock is this Universe of Observation/Awareness:
So the quantum timelock is talking about the universe of awareness, aka the actual universe, like we have said from the start
The Mooncell has concluded that the means by which our (µêæÒÇà) Universe of Awareness (Þ¬ìÞ¡ÿÕ«çÕ«Ö) -- fundamentally unstable by nature -- is stabilized across the Past, Present, and Future lie in the execution of "culling" (õ╝ɵÄí, basai) and the formation of "records" (Þ¿ÿÚî▓Õ©», Kiroku-tai, lit. "Recording Bands").
No one disagreed with this, the process of culling revolves around locking off timelines and then well, culling them.
That the Moon Cell is either a part of, or does its own thing with its own QTL on possibilities which is also just a complete copy of what we have on Earth. Again, these two are inseperable.
The timeline culling and qtls are a copy of the process the World uses. It is completely seperate from the concept of layers though
Repeating it again and again won't make them multiverses
Okay you don't be seeming to get it for some reason so let me explain it to you. The parallel worlds are stated to be timelines in fsn and fgo there are stated to be an infinite amount. So what you are saying by ignoring this is basically "the universe is a single universe but contains infinite timelines" which again is absolutely ludicrous
the Tree of Time has never been shown to be multiversal
Read what I said above, that clearly makes it multiversal there is no way around that. It has never been stated to be multiversal but if you well actually look at the facts of how the parallel worlds work you see that it is clearly a multiverse.
and you're just assuming that based on your mental schema of what timelines are and what parallel worlds mean.
No we are assuming that based on the in verse showings of what timelines are, which is, well a timeline like in any other verse or real life. Parallel worlds as shown in explanations of Kaleidoscope and Goetia's plan, and lostbelts, EoR etc. are clearly shown to be parallel universes because again these events literally don't work if we use your assumption of "its all one universe"
"If parallel worlds continued to increase in this manner, their number would eventually exceed the capacity of this dimension. Parallel worlds must exist, but in a manageable quantity. By my own rough calculations, and judging by the civilization of Earth alone, this solar system would collapse within 100 years if parallel worlds expanded without limits."
ÒüáÒüîõ║ïÕ«ƒÒü¿ÒüùÒüªµêæÒÇàÒü»þöƒÕ¡ÿÒüùÒÇüþ╣üµ«ûÒüùÒüªÒüäÒéïÒÇéHowever, the reality is that we live and multiply Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗Òü»µâàÕá▒ÚçÅÒü½ÒéêÒüúÒüªþÀ®ÕÆîÒüÖÒéïÒüôÒü¿Òü¬ÒüÅÒÇüThe Solar System hasn't yet dissolved (þÀ®ÕÆî, kanwa, lit. "loosen / relax / alleviate") before the sheer volume of data that we produce,ÒéÇÒüôÒüåõ©ÇÕääÕ╣┤Òü»õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝ÅÒüºÕ¡ÿþÂÜÒüºÒüìÒéïÒÇéand it's likely that the status quo (õ╗èÒü«µû╣Õ╝Å, ima no houshiki, lit. "the present formulation / system") can be sustained for another hundred million years.
Seeing as how we do, in fact, live and multiply, the solar system is clearly not oversaturated with possibilities at this time, I extrapolate that this dimension can sustain our existence for the next 100,000,000 years.
This was addressed in all of the previous threads about this topic, look back to them if you want an explanation
Dunno, why you're pointing that out. Are you suggesting that for every adjacent or parallel worlds there's a Gaia and Alaya? Heck no, the timeline culling is in fact done by Alaya,
Quite interesting you bring this up, the fact that they are done by Alaya would indeed imply there is one single Alaya across the multiverse, I have no opinion on if there are multiple collective unconsciousnesses. However there is nothing saying there can't be more than one across the multiple universes.
so it's for the survivability of humans. The human order is the body of Law imposed within the realm of humanity by the action of the Shared Unconscious.
Quantum timelocks and culling aren't just for the survivability of humans but to maintain the existence of the universe. Fun fact the Quantum Time Locks are known as a Universal Event
As Dysmity pointed out to you, there are two different statements from Holmes and Da Vinci. One explicitly says NPs from servants don't have the power to do it, the other says the counter force stops you. But if you want to be obstinate about it, then there's no point.
Except if you actually look at the context it's flat out stated that its only because of the counter force
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Having individual Counter Force in individual universes are entirely possible, there are timelines where Gaia is alive and timelines where Gaia is dead. Strange Fake timeline has Gaia while Angel Notes died.
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It's less about Alaya being different than the counterforce being weakened in pruned timelines that are abandoned by Alaya. There was presence of the counterforce in Shinjuku, for example but it was just weakened.
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I won't address everything, because copy/pasting on phone is a pain.
You seem to have misunderstood something. By the Human World, I meant the Human Order, the Universe of Awareness is the one referred in the material books to be housing the parallel and adjacent worlds. Also I meant that it doesn't necessarily refer to the domain of space defined by modern astronomy; the specific usage of "Universe" relevant to the discussion of timelines is the extratemporal domain that encompasses the set of worlds that comprise a given Tree.
I'm also confused that you accept everything about the Moon Cell observing and recording the possibilities on Earth, but just haggle on the layer? Do you think that these parallel worlds are going to become fun sized universes on the Moon Cell if you get rid of the layer? Moreover, a layer has never been said to be exclusive to Gaia. It is simply reality for its inhabitants and we are talking about Adjacent World/Realities. You could even consider SE.RA.PH, a fancy term for Serial Phantasm as a layer since it does represent a conceptual planet. And naturally the reverse side will be below because humans are the Prime ones now. Age of Gods is already done and over with.
I don't care about hyberpoles. Place it above plot elements if that's how you want to do it. It has never been stated or shown to be multiverses. Instead I already gave you an example of Adjacent Universes and Adjacent World being shown to be distinct, but it seems nothing short of the Kaleidoscope would convince you.
If you look at the context she says the planet can't be destroyed by a servant's Noble Phantasm and Holmes doesn't contradict her on that point.
You seem to have misunderstood something. By the Human World, I meant the Human Order, the Universe of Awareness is the one referred in the material books to be housing the parallel and adjacent worlds. Also I meant that it doesn't necessarily refer to the domain of space defined by modern astronomy; the specific usage of "Universe" relevant to the discussion of timelines is the extratemporal domain that encompasses the set of worlds that comprise a given Tree.
I'm also confused that you accept everything about the Moon Cell observing and recording the possibilities on Earth, but just haggle on the layer? Do you think that these parallel worlds are going to become fun sized universes on the Moon Cell if you get rid of the layer? Moreover, a layer has never been said to be exclusive to Gaia. It is simply reality for its inhabitants and we are talking about Adjacent World/Realities. You could even consider SE.RA.PH, a fancy term for Serial Phantasm as a layer since it does represent a conceptual planet. And naturally the reverse side will be below because humans are the Prime ones now. Age of Gods is already done and over with.
I don't care about hyberpoles. Place it above plot elements if that's how you want to do it. It has never been stated or shown to be multiverses. Instead I already gave you an example of Adjacent Universes and Adjacent World being shown to be distinct, but it seems nothing short of the Kaleidoscope would convince you.
If you look at the context she says the planet can't be destroyed by a servant's Noble Phantasm and Holmes doesn't contradict her on that point.
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I also agree with Hun
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This has become quite hard to read. This was a discussion about the Moon Cell, so I have no idea how it ended up being about "Noble phantasms can't destroy planet" again.
Also, Universe of Record is the domain within the Moon Cell that houses parallel worlds/timelines/possibilities. Whatever you want to call them.
Also, Universe of Record is the domain within the Moon Cell that houses parallel worlds/timelines/possibilities. Whatever you want to call them.
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How does it even link together anyway? SE.RA.PH. and World's layers...
And how does the staffs who admit they don't know Nasuverse, say Hun, who's talking Nasuverse cosmology, is making sense anyway? (Ignore this part, I'm just ranting)
And how does the staffs who admit they don't know Nasuverse, say Hun, who's talking Nasuverse cosmology, is making sense anyway? (Ignore this part, I'm just ranting)
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I would've thought that the quotes from Holmes would've put that to rest
especially considering how they blatantly state that they can destroy the planet, they just aren't allowed to
not entirely sure how this argument was able to continue with this in play
especially considering how they blatantly state that they can destroy the planet, they just aren't allowed to
not entirely sure how this argument was able to continue with this in play
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@hun
It is completely obvious that no matter what anyone says you are going to push forwards with your interpretation so this is all I'll say.
Your theory on how this works directly contradicts FSN, FGO, Extella, the CCC/Foxtail chart and numerous other parts of the series. For it to be just one universe literally doesn't work. Again saying it is one universe means that it is a single universe with multiple timelines at the same time which does not work.
It is completely obvious that no matter what anyone says you are going to push forwards with your interpretation so this is all I'll say.
Your theory on how this works directly contradicts FSN, FGO, Extella, the CCC/Foxtail chart and numerous other parts of the series. For it to be just one universe literally doesn't work. Again saying it is one universe means that it is a single universe with multiple timelines at the same time which does not work.
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The Layer is the world. SE.RA.PH is a digitally constructed world that is based on the real world, its inner environments is made up of Reality Marbles. The Moon Cell doesn't have to be an Onion, it just has to copy its worlds. Not sure what you think a layer is.Diinou HotHead said:
Well, it seems the staff opinion matters seeing how someone kept posting what they thought off this.
Re Holmes: He says it is possible to destroy the planet without the counter force (or a weakened version). It doesn't contradict Da Vinci's first quote about servants and NPs. Naturally if you are going to redirect an asteroid working with a demon god, it's gonna be different. Though I don't know about a meteor with a diameter of 500 when the one that dropped the dinosaurs is estimated to be around several kms.
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What does Seraph have to do with 2-A Nasuverse?
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It has to do with his question. You know discussions don't always sit in one place.
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Seems we are going with Hun.
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Why don't we see what knowledgeable people on the verse think about it rather than staff who don't actually know this part of the verse. It seems like more of the knowledgeable regulars agree with keeping it so we should ask the knowledgeable staff like Monarch their opinion as well.
A crt shouldn't be based on staff who don't know the verse coming in and saying I agree or I disagree, especially if there are knowledgeable members and knowledgeable staff that can be asked instead.
no matter what the outcome of this thread is though I win, if they aren't downgraded everyone knows they get stomped so I don't have to argue for them in threads, if they are downgraded they go back to being haxed low 2-Cs
A crt shouldn't be based on staff who don't know the verse coming in and saying I agree or I disagree, especially if there are knowledgeable members and knowledgeable staff that can be asked instead.
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Hun makes sense to me, series like this need blogs to explain this sort of thing since people seem to be on different pages. Wasn't one being made?
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There was supposed to be one but the group for it kinda diedSigurd Snake in The Eye said:
