Zeus is up against another Godslayer... | Hearts (SDBH) Vs. Zeus (GOW)

[omegabronic]

This is one of his starting moves when Zeus is physically present he can definitely be interacted with. Hearts can crush him in 0D and just win then

aka destroying his body to such a level, making him die......thus making him become Fear, also.....the profile says nothing on him making things get 0 dimensional, else he would have Dimensional Manipulation

it’s not a “attack” so Zeus isn’t gonna become a concept or whatever he’d be sealed.

Sealing isn't under that ability in the profile, also if Zeus body is destroyed to that level Fear will come out, which Hearts can't affect with anything he has

What you seem to not understand is that these aspects aren’t interchangeable that’s the point. His AE protects from type 1 conceptual abilities and anything that doesn’t attack any fundamental aspects he doesn’t resist. This is like saying he can resist his plot getting nuked because he’s a concept it’s a NLF especially for a aspect that doesn’t even exist in verse.

my dude, Hearts is not manipulating history, he is using EE on a scale that affects the opponent in all of time, which.......is useless unless he can erase the opponent in the first place

His body isn’t taking damage I’ve said this before he’d be sealed GG fight over.

again, it isn't sealing in the profile, stop making hax up

Also, yes, crushing with Gravity DOES damage what is being crushed, that js how gravity works

He starts with this dawg he’s never gonna become a concept.

Do.........not know how Gravity works? Goku and co didn't got crush via it because they have the LS to withstand it, Zeus is many times inferior in LS to them, thus he will be crushed

No it wouldn’t he’s shown to be able to even reduce the size of things without damaging it

Any reason for him to conveniently choose to do this here when he wants to Kill Zeus?

worse comes to worse he paralyzed Zeus

resisted

and calmly walks over and hits him with his history EE which he doesn’t resist

Just for zeus to use his electricity to hit Hearts to win with all the haxes it has

He’d be paralyzed before that happened

Resisted

plus he resist his

resists it what?

CM is only really a factor if he’s in his AE 1 state the rest.

No, he just needs to move his hand

And his death hax literature requires physical touch which is a non issue for his PASSIVE gravity manipulation

He just needs to hit the flame on Hearts, not punch him

Also the gravity would kill him, making him go into Fear, so

The point your ignoring is that his state of being won’t be a factor ignoring the fact that this is predicated on a very long string of unlikely events happening to allow Zeus to enter a state that will at best net him a incon.

it will make him win since Hearts can't interact with him at all

It’s the fact his history is still vulnerable that’s how the wiki standards work less we fall into the realm of nlf this exemplifies this point perfectly.

1 link doesn't work 2 you still need to be able to erase something to be able to erase it across all of time

As stated here he only becomes fear upon his physical bodies death of course this isn’t gonna account for history EE or sealing so this isn’t a important point.

ANd as said before, that is simply not true, if his physical body is erased then Fear is all that remains
......you really should have kept up with the thread dude

Nah we see he can reduce the size of things without damaging it.

You mean the Low 1-C durability seed? Yeah, no wonder gravity didn't crushed it

 

[Planck69]

And ain’t no way GoW fans have resorted to making things up. him “reducing” you to nothing is tied to his gravity manipulation not his EE.

I'm mildly curious what's been made up so far.

 

[Spicy78]

wait, changes just were made to the universe seed's page yesterday. now it has NEP aspect 2 (concept) EE. may i ask, if a character has NEP aspect 2 EE, can they erase "regular"/"existing" concepts?

 

[Vietthai96]

Many of these points is really not matter in this match but i need to clarify some informations

resisted

His paralysis is via gravity

Just for zeus to use his electricity to hit Hearts to win with all the haxes it has

Now i keep getting different informations on how his lighting work, seriously

You mean the Low 1-C durability seed? Yeah, no wonder gravity didn't crushed it

Because he didn't intent to crush it, he reduce its size so Kamioren can merge with it

wait, changes just were made to the universe seed's page yesterday. now it has NEP aspect 2 (concept) EE. may i ask, if a character has NEP aspect 2 EE, can they erase "regular"/"existing" concepts?

No, just mean they can erase a NEP guy who lack concept, not EE concept since there is no interaction with concept to begin with

 

[Pepsimanslover_69]

I have a question regarding Hearts's ability and how Zeus may interact with it.

For Hearts's gravity, couldn't Zeus escape by turning into pure energy? Or can he crush pure energy? What about Teleportation?

 

[Spicy78]

And ain’t no way GoW fans have resorted to making things up. him “reducing” you to nothing is tied to his gravity manipulation not his EE.

you're arguing that he can reduce beings to nothing by manipulating dimensionality itself and turning things into 0D via gravity/quantum manip (which is a possible subset ability to matter manip, but isn't automatically granted by default by having quantum manip), despite the only existing proof for your argument is a single scene that leaves the events pretty much up the viewer's interpretation and axial dimensionality NEVER being brought up nor mentioned

talk about NLF and making things up lol

i'm arguing that him reducing beings to nothing is simply just regular EE via matter manip (remember, he has this ability before he fused with the universe seed, which is what grants him his history-based EE) and that the ability is not being indexed correctly in the profile (the wording of hearts' matter manip and the wiki's definition of EE its VERY similar, the only difference is that heart's ability definiton adds "compress", which doesn't mean anything as his matter manip is gravity-based). my interpretation is literally the safest and most logical out of the two

 

[Huesito88]

I have a question regarding Hearts's ability and how Zeus may interact with it.

For Hearts's gravity, couldn't Zeus escape by turning into pure energy? Or can he crush pure energy? What about Teleportation?

Good question apparently Hearts can crush things to nothingness which is rated at a quantum level (for some reason, I mean it's weird, but for now it is what it is)
"

• Matter Manipulation (Quantum): His gravity power can compress[17] everything, down to nothing.[14] He can also compress something down to the size he want

"

For information Quantum level is

"The ability to manipulate 1D quantum strings and foam, allowing the user to manipulate the very fundamental space-time packets that form our universe. The potential applications of this level are nearly unlimited, such as the aforementioned manipulation of space-time, the manipulation of matter and energy fields, and some users can even manipulate higher dimensions with it." (and I'm aware Quantum level stuff will be revised really soon, however I'm pretty sure the fact that Quantum level stuff will still deal with very small sizes won't be)

So what does this mean? Well Quantum level stuff deals with stuff around the Planck scale which is above the Macro Quantum of God of War by orders of magnitude which is where they cap in terms of matter manipulation.

 

[Vietthai96]

That shit was somewhat old, but i don't think it is relevant in this match

 

[Pepsimanslover_69]

you're arguing that he can reduce beings to nothing by manipulating dimensionality itself and turning things into 0D via gravity/quantum manip (which is a possible subset ability to matter manip, but isn't automatically granted by default by having quantum manip), despite the only existing proof for your argument is a single scene that leaves the events pretty much up the viewer's interpretation and axial dimensionality NEVER being brought up nor mentioned

talk about NLF and making things up lol

i'm arguing that him reducing beings to nothing is simply just regular EE via matter manip (remember, he has this ability before he fused with the universe seed, which is what grants him his history-based EE) and that the ability is not being indexed correctly in the profile (the wording of hearts' matter manip and the wiki's definition of EE its VERY similar, the only difference is that heart's ability definiton adds "compress", which doesn't mean anything as his matter manip is gravity-based). my interpretation is literally the safest and most logical out of the two

To be fair, you are supposed to judge from the profile, so even if an ability is wrong, you would have to do a CRT.

 

[Spicy78]

Now i keep getting different informations on how his lighting work, seriously

his lightning is a normal/electrical. lightning imbued with powernull and paralysis inducement. if hearts makes contact with zeus' lightning/electricity, he gets powernulled and paralyzed (hearts only resists paralysis if it's gravity-based, as his resistence comes from resisting his abilities. he's never shown to resist electrical-based paralysis)

 

[Vietthai96]

Also what, why 0D, quantum is 1D, who said it is 0D??

 

[Pepsimanslover_69]

Also what, why 0D, quantum is 1D, who said it is 0D??

@ChoursDropoff

 

[Spicy78]

To be fair, you are supposed to judge from the profile, so even if an ability is wrong, you would have to do a CRT.

the thing is, it's never stated in hearts' profile that he can turn beings into 0D. it is a possible applitation of matter/quantum manip, but it isn't granted automatically to the user, there has to be proof (the only thing resembling a proof is a scene of hearts reducing the size of an object until that object is no more, it's very vague). so this isn't an objective judgement based on the profile. it's my interpretation agaisnt theirs

Also what, why 0D, quantum is 1D, who said it is 0D??

@ChoursDropoff just because lol

 

[ChoursDropoff]

aka destroying his body to such a level, making him die......thus making him become Fear, also.....the profile says nothing on him making things get 0 dimensional, else he would have Dimensional Manipulation

1. The ability is listed under his gravity manipulation i the explanation. You denying this is not gonna change what’s written on the page. 2. Paralyzation is not the same as damage unless you’re saying Zeus will turn ethereal at the slighted touch.

Sealing isn't under that ability in the profile, also if Zeus body is destroyed to that level Fear will come out, which Hearts can't affect with anything he has

Dude why do you keep harping on this nothing point? He won’t be kill he’d be trapped forever it’s that simple.

my dude, Hearts is not manipulating history, he is using EE on a scale that affects the opponent in all of time, which.......is useless unless he can erase the opponent in the first place

Bro stop putting words into my mouth, you can go back through our discussion never did I say he’s manipulating history I said he’s erasing it. Which Zeus has no answer for.

again, it isn't sealing in the profile, stop making hax up

Gravity cage man did you look at his page at all? Or are you done being semantical?

• Paralysis Inducement: He can trap his opponents, or restrain their limbs with Gravity Cage.

Also, yes, crushing with Gravity DOES damage what is being crushed, that js how gravity works

I swear if showing on screen feats to the contrary won’t convince nothing will.

Do.........not know how Gravity works? Goku and co didn't got crush via it because they have the LS to withstand it, Zeus is many times inferior in LS to them, thus he will be crushed

I’ve shown literal demonstrations of his gravity manipulating things without damaging anything even planets which don’t have immeasurable lifting strength. On top of the fact how would the opposition prove Zeus AEbstate would literally grow multiple dimensional levels in size? His win conditions are all too speculatory.

On top of the fact you’re capping Zeus and Goku both have immeasurable lifting strength.

Any reason for him to conveniently choose to do this here when he wants to Kill Zeus?

It’s very in character it’s his starting move.

resisted

Not gravity hax

Just for zeus to use his electricity to hit Hearts to win with all the haxes it has

His gravity also gets affected they’re physical even if you wanted to argue they do CM type 1 damage I’m pretty sure they don’t anymore anymore here’s the ability’s of the lightning of Zeus none of which are conceptual

Resisted

Same as before

resists it what?

Typo Zeus can’t resist his EE.

No, he just needs to move his hand

the Olympians themselves which is lethal to all beings, including both God and mortal at the slightest touch,[13] which would include even resurrecting Undead Legionnaires,[16] and the Flame is even capable of killing Pandora

He just needs to hit the flame on Hearts, not punch him

Based off what headcanon?

Also the gravity would kill him, making him go into Fear, so

Let’s just give this argument all the benefit of the doubt why would it be able affect hearts if he’s lower dimensional? That’s like saying a 20D character with HDE would be affected by someone like Zeus with lacking range

it will make him win since Hearts can't interact with him at all


1 link doesn't work 2 you still need to be able to erase something to be able to erase it across all of time

What?! You still need to erase something to erase something?

ANd as said before, that is simply not true, if his physical body is erased then Fear is all that remains

No he’d be gone that’s how the wiki standards work he doesn’t have HGR history to even have this be a argument and he’d not getting beaten to death soo…

......you really should have kept up with the thread dude


You mean the Low 1-C durability seed? Yeah, no wonder gravity didn't crushed it

Both are low 1-C what are you getting at?

 

[Planck69]

wait, changes just were made to the universe seed's page yesterday. now it has NEP aspect 2 (concept) EE. may i ask, if a character has NEP aspect 2 EE, can they erase "regular"/"existing" concepts?

It would still come down to type of concept that they can erase.

the Olympians themselves which is lethal to all beings, including both God and mortal at the slightest touch,[13] which would include even resurrecting Undead Legionnaires,[16] and the Flame is even capable of killing Pandora

Why are you quoting this when Zeus's soul BFR is an entirely different feat?

 

[ChoursDropoff]

I'm mildly curious what's been made up so far.

It’s more in reference to mixing his Gravity hax with his EE hax.

Also what, why 0D, quantum is 1D, who said it is 0D??

That’s my bad I guess not that it changes much Zeus still has no answer even if it were 2D

 

[ChoursDropoff]

Why are you quoting this when Zeus's soul BFR is an entirely different feat?

This is in reference to his Death hax

 

[Spicy78]

@Planck69 what is zeus capable of without moving? like, what he can do by only using a thought?

 

[ChoursDropoff]

his lightning is a normal/electrical. lightning imbued with powernull and paralysis inducement. if hearts makes contact with zeus' lightning/electricity, he gets powernulled and paralyzed (hearts only resists paralysis if it's gravity-based, as his resistence comes from resisting his abilities. he's never shown to resist electrical-based paralysis)

If that’s the case then he passively warps the lightning

 

[Planck69]

@Planck69 what is zeus capable of without moving? like, what he can do by only using a thought?

Mind Manipulation, Telepathy, Biological Manipulation, Pain Manipulation and Dream Manipulation via psychic attacks, Telekinesis, Disease Manipulation, and BFR. Oh yeah, he can also just summon storms which shoot down his lightning, which has power nullification. That's off the top of my head.

 

[Spicy78]

If that’s the case then he passively warps the lightning

lightning is made out of protons and electrons, which gravity itself has very little effect on as they have very little mass and withstand coulomb forces 10^40 times stronger than gravity, so...

 

[ChoursDropoff]

lightning is made out of protons and electrons, which gravity itself has very little effect on as they have very little mass and withstand coulomb forces 10^40 times stronger than gravity, so...

It’s super gravity that can affect an infinite multiverse. I think it’ll have an affect this is a weird appeal to reality.

 

[Huesito88]

It’s more in reference to mixing his Gravity hax with his EE hax.

That’s my bad I guess not that it changes much Zeus still has no answer even if it were 2D

I think the quantum manipulation explanation is misleading in the wording 1-D at least in term of how us verse debaters define it, it's suppose to be stuff that is around the Planck scale in size and the 1-D part is more like how strings are defined

 

[Spicy78]

It’s super gravity that can affect an infinite multiverse. I think it’ll have an affect this is a weird appeal to reality.

do you mind sending some scans?

 

[Vietthai96]

Wait, how his lighting being natural and have power null at the same time, is this power null magic based??, i can understand paralysis though

 

[Spicy78]

Wait, how his lighting being natural and have power null at the same time, is this power null magic based??, i can understand paralysis though

natural in the sense that the lightning itself is made out of natural elements. lightning in on itself is natural, its effects are not

 

[Planck69]

I dunno why the lightning debate is even a thing. It's lightning with magical powers. That simple. It's not made of like, mana particles, it's just lightning that has supernatural effects cause a god wields it.

 

[ChoursDropoff]

do you mind sending some scans?

It can conpress the universe seed which has large size type 9

I think the quantum manipulation explanation is misleading in the wording 1-D at least in term of how us verse debaters define it, it's suppose to be stuff that is around the Planck scale in size and the 1-D part is more like how strings are defined

kinda but it’s defined that way soo… plus the strike through makes it hard to read your comment

 

[ChoursDropoff]

natural in the sense that the lightning itself is made out of natural elements. lightning in on itself is natural, its effects are not

It doesn’t have any super natural effects or aspect destroying attacks.

Universe Tree

Tier: Low 1-C | Low 1-C Key: Universe Seed | Universe Tree Name: Universe Seed | Universe Tree, Tree of the Universe Origin: Super Dragon Ball Heroes Age: Unknown Classification: None | Cosmic Tree, Legendary Tree, Giant Divine Tree Users: Seed: Hearts (Merged with it to transform into Ultimate...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Spicy78]

It can conpress the universe seed which has large size type 9

??? i don't see it in the profile

It doesn’t have any super natural effects or aspect destroying attacks.

bruh

powernull resistence in hearts' profile? nowhere to be seen

 

[omegabronic]

It’s super gravity that can affect an infinite multiverse. I think it’ll have an affect

Your point being? You thinking something doesn't equate to it being real

 

[Spicy78]

If that’s the case then he passively warps the lightning

nvm LOL hearts' gravity manip has quantum manip, he warp the lightning

 

[Planck69]

2 whole pages of pointlessness then, smh

Aite so what about the rest? The mind stuff and all? BFR isn't that great against Hearts cause its not that long range (unless he like, constantly does it) but the rest is pretty solid.

 

[ChoursDropoff]

??? i don't see it in the profile


bruh

powernull resistence in hearts' profile? nowhere to be seen

The lightning never touches him it’s not made of type 1 concepts or type 2 information that’s the point.

 

[Spicy78]

@ChoursDropoff what is your stance on the fight right now?

 

[ChoursDropoff]

@ChoursDropoff what is your stance on the fight right now?

Hearts wins handily

 

[Spicy78]

Hearts wins handily

despite zeus having many instant incap options that he's willing to use as a first move as he has prior knowledge about hearts?