Ultra Instinct Goku vs Super Sonic.

[AwkguyDB]

Because you are slow, that's why, your response qas still pathetic, and not using it at all would be IC, if there's a actual reason for that, which I checked Sonic doesn't have this problem, so you are probaly talking about your dumb as a door OC again, and moving goalposts, Sonic can go super and use Wisps, this is already accepted and don't try to say he has something like a mental block so he won't use a move he knows he can win, go back with the gun comparassion you forgot, this is ******* fight to the death between two people, not playing with a toy or a chess game, if your choice is to die or to use the move you don't even hate then you won't ******* just let yourself die for no reason, if you were face to face with a bear and you have a gun but you don't use it whenever you want you are not going to let the bear kill you because "it's not IC"
And dear readers, we went back to square zero, now we are going to have the classic stonewalling and circular debating, ignoring any votes against our characters until someone says it's toxic or 500 replys are reached, so as little gift I will let you have the final word, since you like it very much, enjoy it please, it's on the house for today

TL;DR


RRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

 

[Theuser789]

Heh, funny actualy, not a argument but I didn't do one as well much, so I can't say anything, I don't know why I am being so snarky these last few days

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

I'm going to do vote count:

Goku: 2 (Hst master, AwkguyDB)

Sonic: 7 (Modernmyrmidon, CalebTB12, Theuser789, Mister6ame6, WarriorofMite, Okorito1, Gilad Hyperstar)

Incon: 0

Unless I'm wrong about who voted, grace begins now

 

[HST_Master]

Both Goku and Sonic can adapt to their situation and figjt accordingly. While they won't start the matches with these abilities, they'll resort to something else when they see it doesn't work.

When Goku saw he can't affect him with just punches, he went for a different way and won. By your logic, Goku would just keep punching forever, even whem it doesn't work, or his opponent would finally get impatient and defeat him.

False Equivalency. I specifically said that this is because Goku would in character do something like this, due to actually showing he would, not something like say nuking the entire stage and fly up.

Also, when SSB Goku and Vegeta face SSJ Broly in the movie, they try to fight him, but when it doesn't work, Goku teleports them both away and flees instead of fighting even when his attacks do nothing.

There's no reason to assume that Sonic will never use the wisps, even though he did used them, and given tglhat this is his only way to defeat Goku. Once he sees everything else fails, he'll resort to using the wisps

Dude you bringing up what Goku's done is only proving my point. You can say Goku will do these things because he's actually done them. Sonic on the other has not, not even once used color powers in conjunction to his Super Transformation, especially not Classic Sonic.

@User

Or you simply jumped the gun with multiple rants but whatever. And since you can't seem to bring up a time when he's used a color power in conjunction with his Super Transformation, he very much does. This was never accepted and that argument of "accepted so don't say anything" did about as much as it did on literally any other thread, which is it didn't. And no matter how much you use this loaded question, it's not going to change what he does in character.

And are you done poisoning the well again?

 

[Theuser789]

The last word is yours on the house, so I am not replying, even if you want me too awser your question, so sorry dude, also you are kinda a hyprocrite you know tuat, using "Well I said so in another thread earlier" but then saying it's not valid, or repeating yourself and your statments as valid, you are one of the people that always amuse me in a thread, your repeatition and you always replying everyone, when you don't need to

 

[HST_Master]

I'm going to do vote count:

Goku: 2 (Hst master, AwkguyDB)

Sonic: 7 (Modernmyrmidon, CalebTB12, Theuser789, Mister6ame6, WarriorofMite, Okorito1, Gilad Hyperstar)

Incon: 0

Unless I'm wrong about who voted, grace begins now

So you're just gonna not back up your arguments and ignore that literally all the FRA have been debunked based on either "Invulnerablility GG"(Okorito, Mister6, and Warrior) or Color powers(You, Caleb, Modern, and User)?

 

[00potato]

Grace shouldn't start if debate is still happening. Wait for all the points to be made.

 

[Theuser789]

Forces you mean, it's not like what HST is arguing is already applied, what it is and he is saying it's not valid because people always do that when a ability is making your favorite character lose, me included

Look at that, the classic versus thread of "my character is losing? Well your power is not valid, and I am only saying this now because my character is losing and not because I actualy care about accuracy or else I would have said so beforehand?"

I love re-runs on the channel, good ol classic

 

[HST_Master]

@User

At this point I really don't care if you reply or not. Also that's not the same at all. I've actually responded to said arguments in the other threads. Not just saying "it's on the profiles".

 

[HST_Master]

And are you done poisoning the well again?

Also ironic you say I've only now said something against the argument of color powers when the argument only came around after the Invulnerablility GG fell through. Lack of context again.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Grace shouldn't start if debate is still happening. Wait for all the points to be made.

What's Goku's points? Something that two people say Sonic will never do despite Sonic using said ablitues before, is standard equipment and that it's just very logical to assume that if a character is left with only one option left after seeing everything else fails they would logically will use that one option? And it's not even like Sonic really dislike using the wisps or something, Sonic used the wisps many times in base and he should be able to ultilize the same wisps with his super form. And I didn't even addressed Goku's time limit with UI

 

[Theuser789]

You really do reply to everything huh, like, literaly everything, lol, even when you say Idc you still Care enough to waste all the time typing a post just to reply to me

Let's say you are totaly not saying things are invalid on a versus thread because your favorite character loses because of it, let's not talk about how you are the only one who uses this, let's give you complete honesty, because you wouldn't be calling out poisoning the well if I was right, if I was right you would adress what I say and defend, so what I say is wrong, things don't work that way, you do know that saying "character win con invalid" only makes this a stomp right, if the character as no win cons then is a stomp, you win nothing at all, so everything you post only leads to your loss, you right then it's stomp, thread closed, nothing happens, you wrong character you like lose, no wins for you then, kinda sad, all this effort for nothing, all this time for nothing

 

[HST_Master]

What's Goku's points? Something that two people say Sonic will never do despite Sonic using said ablitues before, is standard equipment and that it's just very logical to assume that if a character is left with only one option left after seeing everything else fails they would logically will use that one option? And it's not even like Sonic really dislike using the wisps or something, Sonic used the wisps many times in base and he should be able to ultilize the same wisps with his super form. And I didn't even addressed Goku's time limit with UI

So again prove this. Quite literally none of this backs up your claim when you can't even give a showing. Him not disliking the wisps and using them in base is not grounds for "He'll use them no matter what in any form." Sasuke isn't against using Genjustsu and isn't an idiot in combat yet in character doesn't touch Genjustsu until his fight with Deidara. Also Goku will attempt to end the fight as fast as he can while in UI, as that's what he's done with Kefla and Jiren in his 1st 2 UI usages.

 

[Theuser789]

Also ironic you say I've only now said something against the argument of color powers when the argument only came around after the Invulnerablility GG fell through. Lack of context again.

I mentioned color powers Mr. Edit? Not in general, because that's what I written there on my post, you saying a win condition is not valid because my character loses, read it, slowly

 

[HST_Master]

You really do reply to everything huh, like, literaly everything, lol, even when you say Idc you still Care enough to waste all the time typing a post just to reply to me

Let's say you are totaly not saying things are inválido on a versus thread because your favorite character loses because of it, let's not talk about how you are the only one who uses this, let's give you complete honesty, because you wouldn't be calling out poisoning the well if I was right, if I was right you would adress what I say and defend, so what I say is wrong, things don't work that way, you do know that saying "character win con invalid" only makes this a stomp right, if the character as no win cons then is a stomp, you win nothing at all, so everything you post only leads to your loss, you right then it's stomp, thread closed, nothing happens, you wrong character you like lose, no wins for you then, kinda sad, all this effort for nothing, all this time for nothing

Like I said, no skin off my back whether you reply or not, and I've pretty sure I've already said this to you in another thread but I'm not gonna force you to keep replying. And I have addressed what you've said, you simply don't like the answer

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Sonic still have invulnerability. Also, what does Sasuke has anything to do with this match? Also, I would argue that if Sasuke would be put against an enemy that isn't affected by his usual tactics and realize Genjutsu is his only option left, he will use it instead of dying.

Same goes to Sonic. They aren't idiots who only do whatever they started woth and never once changing tactics and adapting to battle (even Goku adapts to battles this way). Once Sonic realizes nothing else works, he'll logically use the wisps and win. Either that or in worst case scenario they just fight until Goku de-powers, and Sonic finishes him

 

[HST_Master]

Also ironic you say I've only now said something against the argument of color powers when the argument only came around after the Invulnerablility GG fell through. Lack of context again.

I mentioned color powers Mr. Edit? Not in general, because that's what I written there on my post, you saying a win condition is not valid because my character loses, read it, slowly

Never said you mentioned color powers. Also Mr Edit? How Ironic.

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

Forgot I didn't vote on this, Sonic FRA

 

[HST_Master]

Sonic still have invulnerability. Also, what does Sasuke has anything to do with this match? Also, I would argue that if Sasuke would be put against an enemy that isn't affected by his usual tactics and realize Genjutsu is his only option left, he will use it instead of dying.

Same goes to Sonic. They aren't idiots who only do whatever they started woth and never once changing tactics and adapting to battle (even Goku adapts to battles this way). Once Sonic realizes nothing else works, he'll logically use the wisps and win. Either that or in worst case scenario they just fight until Goku de-powers, and Sonic finishes him

And like said in the Invulnerablility CRT, was never trying to completely remove it, only clarify it's limits.

It's an example of a character who has an ability in another state and still doesn't use it outside of when he was shown.

You missed the entire point. Goku will actually try and end the fight quickly because he's shown he'll do something like that. I even gave 2 references. It's not just throwing out what he'd do with no backing like SuperxColor Powers. Like I've beem asking for at least one showing of Sonic using his color powers while in his Super Transformation and I haven't gotten a single showing because there is none.

 

[Theuser789]

Keep replying to everything I say, how far cab you keeo going, how much free time you have? Do you have something outside versus debating, I mean, I do but you probaly don't, you reply to everything, no matter how related it is, you keep going, and going

You are the most amusing, you say blatant lies, like I don't like the awsers, maybe you are just crap, but sure, lie to yourself if you feel better, and bring something more original, you say linda just shit banter, it's boring, if you are going to waste your time that you don't care be more original

"I've only now said something against the argument of color powers" Hmmmm, this feels like mentioning color powers, as if I wasn't talking in general, hmmmmm

Goodnight, since you will reply anyways

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Sonic not using color powers in Super despite using in base is like saying DBZ Goku can't use kaioken in SSJ forms (he can, as shown when he used it in SSJB, he just never uses it in forms that aren't SSJB)

 

[HST_Master]

It's almost like I have a mobile device that I can go on the internet no matter where I am. As for the rest...

 

[HST_Master]

Sonic not using color powers in Super despite using in base is like saying DBZ Goku can't use kaioken in SSJ forms (he can, as shown when he used it in SSJB, he just never uses it in forms that aren't SSJB)

I never said he can't, I said he won't. Big difference. Also Goku can't use Kaioken in anything not Blue or base or he dies (Unless it's Toei)

 

[Theuser789]

Thanks for the reply!

 

[AwkguyDB]

I'm going to do vote count:
Goku: 2 (Hst master, AwkguyDB)

Sonic: 7 (Modernmyrmidon, CalebTB12, Theuser789, Mister6ame6, WarriorofMite, Okorito1, Gilad Hyperstar)

Incon: 0

Unless I'm wrong about who voted, grace begins now

I didn't vote for Goku I wanted to see where Sonic's Invulnerability CRT went

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Ok. I'll remove your name from Goku's votes

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Goku: 1 (Hst master)

Sonic: 8 (Modernmyrmidon, CalebTB12, Theuser789, Mister6ame6, WarriorofMite, Okorito1, Gilad Hyperstar, GlaceonGamez471)

Incon: 0

 

[Theuser789]

Welp, grace ended, so unless something happens in the invulnerability thread this should be added, and stonewalling stubborn user is not going to stop it

 

[Darkfire890]

Does Goku have a win con? Sense the Invulnerability is still in play?

 

[Akreious]

I don't think it's been addressed, what are the limits of Sonic's Invulnerability? Saying blanket "Goku can't harm him because Invulnerability" with no further explanations is pretty much the definition of the NLF the Invulnerability page warns about.

 

[Theuser789]

You should read better, there was a big discussion earlier, I even adressed that if the invulnerability thread doesn't change something we should still add it

 

[Darkfire890]

Does Goku have a win con? Sense the Invulnerability is still in play?

.

 

[Theuser789]

BFR and Mafuba I think

 

[Darkfire890]

Mafuba usually needs prep in less stated otherwise. And Goku can't BFR in less he had a Ki signal to lock on so he can teleport to that location

 

[Greenshifter]

I knew that my standards on battlefields would come in handy one day.

The fight should take place in a composite universe where both characters can use the full extent of their abilities and this means that Goku can BFR to King Kai's planet.

 

[Darkfire890]

That would make it more fair. If the OP allows it

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Doesn't King Kai's planet still on Universe 7?

Also: A) The match is already concluded, and B) Goku isn't very likely to BFR his enemies to other planets (he did transported Cell to King Kai's planet, but Goku didn't teleported back in that instance)

 

[Greenshifter]

Yes but if I've correctly understood Promestein then we always assume a composite universe (where friends/locations of both characters exist) as the base situation for vs matches.

 

[Theuser789]

This is just to give Goku wincons so it's not a stomp

 

[Greenshifter]

Hey I didn't give Goku BFR on his page + I've brought this up before: https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3965378