Ultra Instinct Goku vs Super Sonic.

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Well, Goku still doesn't really goes for a BFR in character (and for a guy who spams uses IT a lot in battles, it's saying something). But it do gives Goku a win condition over Sonic

 

[Darkfire890]

I mean I don't think we can add stomps. So either Goku would need a wincon or this is a stomp and should be closed.

 

[Theuser789]

Yeah, and he has wincons

 

[Greenshifter]

Also I still disagree with how Sonic's dura is treated for the moment since the next course of action after the invulnerability thread should be to determine the AP difference between Sonic and the Egg Salamander and work from there instead of assuming Sonic has a fixed 2-C durability or something.

 

[Darkfire890]

Well, Goku still doesn't really goes for a BFR in character (and for a guy who spams uses IT a lot in battles, it's saying something). But it do gives Goku a win condition over Sonic

He would go for it once he realize he can't hurt Sonic. He fought opponents he couldn't hurt before and removed them.

 

[Darkfire890]

And I just realized this is omen/sign not mui...

 

[Theuser789]

Also I still disagree with how Sonic's dura is treated for the moment since the next course of action after the invulnerability thread should be to determine the AP difference between Sonic and the Egg Salamander and work from there instead of assuming Sonic has a fixed 2-C durability or something.

You do know it's only one move that only takes 10 rings from a being irrelevant to the fight here

 

[Greenshifter]

Well we got the Phantom Ruby hurting Classic Sonic which is baseline so doubt that's much better and isn't the Egg Salamander the easiest one to judge? We're looking at the difference in AP and durability here, we already know Sonic's durability changes with his AP or else Solaris would oneshot him so the easiest way to judge this is see how much stronger someone who was able to hurt him is compared to Sonic. And due to it being only 10 rings, it's probably not a lot but hey that's game mechanics anyways, it should be less than x20 tho while UI Goku has more than a 20 times AP advantage so he should be able to hurt Sonic.

 

[Theuser789]

Bro, the Egg Salamender is irrelevant because he is a diferent Sonic, and the Time Eater can't harm Sonic and he is also baseline, also those numbers come from nowhere

 

[Greenshifter]

Goku blue should be baseline, kaioken x20 gives Goku a 20 times AP boost. UI Omen should be comparable to this. Still with invulnerability gone I don't think you can claim Sonic no-sells attacks 20 times stronger than him.

 

[Theuser789]

Read my earlier comment about it, the one when I say grace ended, and even with Invulnerability gone he is still going to have stonewall durability

 

[Greenshifter]

Yeah but not that stonewally and sure if you wanna wait for Wok to do it then fine I guess.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Invulnerability for Sonic is kind of shifted to him being a stonewall iirc

 

[Madotsuki24]

How is this battle allowed but Goku vs Superman isn't?!? Especially since they are both rivaled frequently by other people due to their similar transformations and the Sonic fanbase is normally worse than the DC fanbase, no offense because I'm a massive Sonic fan myself and Sonic is my favourite video game character of all time.

 

[Madotsuki24]

It's almost like I have a mobile device that I can go on the internet no matter where I am. As for the rest...

That is the cringiest meme I have ever seen. Sonic is infinitely better than JJBA and Sonic solos all of JJBA.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

The match is already concluded, and the reason for Goku VS Superman being banned is because of those infamous death battle videos.

Sonic on the other hand, fought against Mario, not Goku, so there wasn't much regarding this

 

[Madotsuki24]

So Mario vs Sonic is banned, surely, is it?

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Nah. It wasn't nearly as toxic as Goku VS Superman

 

[Madotsuki24]

The worse thing is that Naruto vs Ichigo isn't banned, which was also a controversial Death Battle episode. Double-standards are one of the worst logical fallacies you can ever make.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

You can try to ask why the matches are banned in Dragon Ball and DC threads here.

Doesn't really have much to do with this thread

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Why was the match removed? Even without color powers Sonic can still transmutate Goku with time ring, or wait until Goku depowers from UI

 

[Theuser789]

Were was it removed? People just need to accept when a character loses

 

[HST_Master]

But as the last argument before we continue on the thread, Sonic won't stand there and let Goku punch him this easily, he can increase his speed, has no time limit, and can and probably will use his hax when he'll eventually get overwhelmed, also invulnerability protects him from being one shotted, even if Goku can affect him

I never said he will, in fact I said vice versa. Goku's RPL counters Sonic's attempts to use boost, it's quite literally a hard assumption Sonic will use said hax on a whim before Goku can stop him and again Sonic's Invulnerability has only been consistently on those comparable or weaker than him. Goku is neither.

 

[Theuser789]

Who cares, you only remove a thread because something is objectively wrong like winning via a AP advantage they don't have, hax they don't have, or the opponent got a update, this match is neither, you not agreeing with the reasons isn't enough to remove a thread, it makes you into a salty loser

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Were was it removed? People just need to accept when a character loses

It was, and I'm trying to bring it back since it's still valid

 

[HST_Master]

@User

It's also when something about the character is led to be something else when it's not like what they do In Character. Simply saying I'm salty isn't gonna make you're argument any more valid when it constantly changes on what Sonic will do for sure.

 

[Omegas03]

Wait, why was this removed?

 

[Theuser789]

Except you saying it it's not objective to remove a thread, people argued with you about that, you lost, end of talk, what you say it's not a fact, it's something it's argued and you lost, and it's healthy to accept it

@Gilad

I posted there as well, even the person who removed it didn't knew much of the context

 

[Theuser789]

Wait, why was this removed?

HST is not accepting he lost the debate, so he posted on the removal thread ommiting tons of context to the thread, and a admin removed it, me and Golad were there explaining it

 

[HST_Master]

Dude, quit accusing me of "ommiting". Ommiting is leaving out any arguments, which I didn't. It's being dishonest at this point.

 

[Theuser789]

I accuse you because you did, as has been proven

 

[HST_Master]

Where did I leave out an argument? Ring Time that was literally brought up on the spot and is iffy ic? Or Speed Boost that was also bought up on the spot and gets countered by RPL?

 

[Omegas03]

The main argument for Sonic winning was invulnerability and wisps, correct?

 

[HST_Master]

@Omega

It was for those exact reasons, you can even see when Invulnerability stops being argued for (As hard) and starts being Color Powers GG.

 

[Theuser789]

So? You only remove something that's objectively wrong, not something you disagree or can argue, and neither of this is, nor people arguing other things, that's basic debating

You lost the debate, Goku lost, disagreeing with arguments is not enough to remove a match, they need to be factualy wrong, cope that your character lost and stop being salty and wasting people's time, you are the only one doing this

 

[Greenshifter]

Why don't we solve this by making a thread about Sonic's invulnerability (again) just like the Bleach supporters did for their verse. Wokistan said it would be a stat amp so it needs to change. And yes while we might not be forced to do this yet, eventually we will be, so we might as well get it over with and give the good example while we're at it.

 

[HST_Master]

@User

You already said that. And It's not "disagreeing with the arguments" it's saying he does something in character when he doesn't.

@Green

I already did but it went dead.

 

[Theuser789]

Nobody said in the thread Sonic would start with it, so your only point is invalid

@Green

Invulnerability won't change anything here big enough to be valid removing the match

 

[HST_Master]

I never said he'd start with it, doing something in character is not the same as starting with something.

 

[Greenshifter]

If Sonic end up being a stone wall who's durability is say 3 times baseline low 2-C (not saying that will be the result), then he will get practically oneshot by Goku so it could affect this battle quite a lot.