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Turnabout Devil May Cry

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2.) More importantly, it's the second part of the statement that makes it questionable to me that they mean surpassing the time stream the same as how we define it: "As a demon lord with more power than his hunters, his speed is faster than theirs, allowing him to travel and bypass the dimensional axis of the time stream, giving the illusion of teleportation to the naked eye."
Click to expand...

This "illusion" is the same for both Infinite and Immeasurable users. To the naked eye, they will both appear as teleporters, since the naked eye can't see if the movement is breaking time by some seconds, travelling through it or anything of the sort, the user will just "appear" there just like a Infinite user would

Pluto is a big fish despite being a weaker 2-C, but if the list isn't about requirements, him not showcasing immeasurableness (Like seeing time as a line, travelling hundreads of years into past or future and etc) isn't a must, they have a clear cut statement and no inconsistencies, and staff believes it is enough. You said yourself, this is a speed rating that is hard to showcase even when "baseline", that's why most users are only under quotes, DMC is no different

Now, I do agree with part of your reasoning, and I fully believe that if it bothers you, a Staff Discussion should be a good bet, you'll get the answers will seek, or the revisions that may be necessary
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
I don't even remember Devil May Cry anymore, all thanks to whatever the hell is this new game/information you guys are talking about. I'm not really going to argue anything since I'm really not knowledgeable on Immeasurable stuff Since it changes a lot

I guess everything is fine though, it fits the description. Though this speed buff seems ridiculous.
Click to expand...
Blame the West Taiwanese
 
Lightning_XXI said:
This "illusion" is the same for both Infinite and Immeasurable users. To the naked eye, they will both appear as teleporters, since the naked eye can't see if the movement is breaking time by some seconds, travelling through it or anything of the sort, the user will just "appear" there just like a Infinite user would

Pluto is a big fish despite being a weaker 2-C, but if the list isn't about requirements, him not showcasing immeasurableness (Like seeing time as a line, travelling hundreads of years into past or future and etc) isn't a must, they have a clear cut statement and no inconsistencies, and staff believes it is enough. You said yourself, this is a speed rating that is hard to showcase even when "baseline", that's why most users are only under quotes, DMC is no different

Now, I do agree with part of your reasoning, and I fully believe that if it bothers you, a Staff Discussion should be a good bet, you'll get the answers will seek, or the revisions that may be necessary
Click to expand...
I understand that an infinite or immeasurable character moving would come across as looking like teleporting to the naked eye, but the statement seems to imply that is the extent of how his speed manifests and not the true extent of what being beyond a time stream would imply. If the statement implied that was just the start of what he could do, then that would add strength to the statement.

I don't know, I just don't get the feeling from the story that I've seen thus far that immeasurable passes the sniff test for Pluto. He was literally needing to use Dante as a guide to get to the seal to release that female Demon partner of his (I don't believe she is named thus far) and disguised himself as a human to do so. I don't see why he didn't just see forward in time to figure out where he needed to go.

Yeah, it makes for a harder story, but story constraints are often part of the lore too. There's moments where we have to suspend disbelief to allow a story to play out implausibly, but I'm not sure about this particular case.

But again, the game is still on-going so maybe that will all be revealed in due-time. I think that does it for my contributions to this thread in the mean time. Have a great day all.
 
Nah visual talking when person A blitz person B then person A will look like teleportation, but not neccessary infinite speed
 
On nightmare's LS defense

In the text it says thanks to Nightmare's immense power he's capable of lifting the entire structure of the Demon world

]With his immense great power, he could effortlessly lift the entire structure of the underworld or destroy it.
Click to expand...

On the same text is also stated

Only a being comparable to her creator could surpass his strength.
Click to expand...

So yeah, scalling to nightmare isn't back/circular scalling , is actually lore stating: Anyone who's comparable to mundus or even more stronger can lift the entire structure of the demon world.
 
I've talked a bit about the lifting strength thing off-site with a couple people here, so I'll just copy and paste my current thoughts on the topic.

"It's really difficult to justify really high LS for human sized characters, cause like... unless they're One Punch Man level comedic, you often see these characters regularly struggling with very ordinary feats of lifting strength. Like, for Dante, you have to question why he'd scale to this level of lifting strength when he struggles to even hold back the momentum of his motorbike. The developers have even talked before about the fact that they designed the motorbike weapon under the idea that Dante is being carried by the motorbike's momentum, which would be very questionable for someone with such lifting strength. But I don't mind too much either way. The feat seems to be legit, and a lot of smaller examples of lifting strength can be passed off as game mechanics and "the cool factor" (since it would look really silly for Dante to never struggle to lift anything, and the developers certainly prioritize the cool factor in DMC). I wouldn't mind if this was added."
 
DarkGrath said:
I've talked a bit about the lifting strength thing off-site with a couple people here, so I'll just copy and paste my current thoughts on the topic.

Like, for Dante, you have to question why he'd scale to this level of lifting strength when he struggles to even hold back the momentum of his motorbike. The developers have even talked before about the fact that they designed the motorbike weapon under the idea that Dante is being carried by the motorbike's momentum, which would be very questionable for someone with such lifting strength.
Click to expand...
Yeah uh... about this...

Dante in his good old days could casually rip out spines, his DMC3 DT self already scales above DMC4 DT Buster Nero who can easily overpower the building-sized Savior and outright crush its head (Dante himself casually stopped the Savior's punch and held the statue's arm above his head for a few seconds before tossing it aside). Fodder Demons alone can send cars hurling at rapid speeds.
 
Yeah, like I said, this comes down more to the semantics of how difficult it is to justify high LS for human sized characters. He has plenty of really good LS feats, and I don't mind those being used instead.
 
I do agree that just like the speed, his LS would also be hard to "see" in action, but I want to also point one thing: Dante (lol)

On fiction, they don't care for layers of infinity, someone who's High 3-A, for example, can "hold back" enough to not one shot a 7-B, or any other finite Tier. Normally that should be impossible, but that's where fiction kicks in, and with that we see many examples of many infinities being held back by a character.

Dante almost never used his full power in his whole life, I understand the issue of LS maybe needing some more on its side, but on "Dante's usual LS examples", we can't really blame him and the series, since DMC always worked with a God Layer which is massively above even the High Tiers, with Dante matching and eventually surpassing them rather early in the canon, leading him to use less than 1% of his power for most of his life. Series like the anime, which portray his usual battles, show that he holds back to the point of not one shoting Tier 9-8-7 Demons. Him having a bit of struggle to lift something can literally be his power output at the moment, since they work on Universal Energy System, part of the feat depends on their energy at the moment

Anyway, the fact that the feat comes from a non God Tier doesn't quite help, but I keep myself as neutral
 
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To be fair, its not a DMC problem but a general fiction problem.
GoW has like only one feat for immeasurable, performed by 2 god tiers(Atlas and Hercules) and a weak god tier weapon.
Otherwise you wouldn't get anywhere near that, especially when Kratos doesn't even remotely perform similarly in even scripted story events.

I don't think DMC can be held accountable alone on account of all fiction.

Besides Nightmare’s own statements gave feat for Creator(Mundus) and anyone who surpasses or matches him. Like proof in statement itself, not scale but directly attribute feat itself.

......Only a being comparable to its creator could surpass his strength.

In short I see no problem.
 
okay so grath doesnt really mind immeasurable LS, so we've gotten 4 staff approvals so far, is this crt fine to apply then? it has pretty straight forward feats to me
 
Oh, the quote linking it to the God Tiers does help a lot

Anyway, Grath has no problem apparently, and the other staff was fine with the proposals, Mr Neo also seems to be neutral for now

I guess we can add then, it will be my pleasure
 
vsbattles.fandom.com

Dante (Devil May Cry)

Dante is the protagonist of the majority of the Devil May Cry series. He, along with his twin brother Vergil, are the product of a romance between the Dark Knight Sparda and a human woman named Eva. After losing his mother to demons as a child, Dante grows up to become a demon-hunting mercenary...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
can some one unlock dantes page please? and preferbly keep it that way, dantes page was unlocked for a long time, and it didnt recieve any vandalism, so i would appreciate it remaining unlocked
 
OK so for a tally.

Agreed: Elizhaa, DarkGrath (He is neutral towards LS but is fine of how we carry it on either way), Ultima, Elizhaa and LordGriffin, and pretty much most of the DMC supporters including- Gilver, me, Oliver (though he seemed to be iffy on the speed), Sevil, ShivaShakti, Sunlight, Mister6ame6, Shizuka, Dienomite22, CrimsonStarFallen, Thehunter077 and EFITE. And a few others, also including a few good folk like Greenshifter, Vietthai and BlackDarkness

Disagreed: DDM (Regarding speed only but has since been debunked, he was neutral regarding the AP and LS)

Neutral: NeoTengus (I think?)
 
So, here we are huh

The only profile left is Dante, who's currently locked, we already asked to be opened so the changes can be applied, after all, Devil May Cry was declared GUILTY of all the charges, and the prosecution can finally rest its case

The defendant came a long way, and I remember when me, Tony and Sunlight fought every trial for even the smallest upgrades, how Universal was a hard and long trial, how we found the massive amount of forgotten/overlooked feats over the last year, and now the meme of Immeasurable Pizza can finally reign supreme in the wiki, isn't that justice ? I think it is, thanks to Peak of Wank, I mean, Peak of Combat

To everyone who replied here in the last days, the Prosecution thank u for ur effort and help in this trial
9Jim82I.gif


This can be closed

 
The more I think about it the more I feel my objections are just out of supreme caution and skepticism.

Do I think DMC is capable of Wally West type shit? As it is right now, hell no. But that can just be justified by it being a very entry level immeasurable. (I still think a new tier between infinite and immeasurable should be created at some point to account for these types of obvious gaps)

Anyway just to be cautious one last time are we sure without a shadow of doubt that the game is canon?

Like, why is he fighting Nevan multiple times again when she already submitted and became his guitar weapon? He doesn't meet Phantom and Griffin until DMC1 yet he meets them here. Is that all explained?

Capcom barely mentions it on their social media, there are contentious claim all over the internet of it just being a fun spin off that mixes elements from several games out of order and there are claims it doesn't fit within the events of DMC3 between Vergil's defeat and him going to the underworld.
 
NeoTengus said:
Like, why is he fighting Nevan multiple times again when she already submitted and became his guitar weapon? He doesn't meet Phantom and Griffin until DMC1 yet he meets them here. Is that all explained?
Click to expand...
1) It happens after DMC3, even mentioned by Lady in cutscene somewhere, I don't remember.
2) Cutscene directly mentions Dante fighting Nevan a 2nd time, in quite an exaggerated way might I add.
3) Even Cerberus is not the same Cerberus, Dante even calls him brother of original in jest, to which Cerberus takes quite a bit of offense
4)Those are not same Griffon and Phantom...they lack any type of conversation ability, unlike the Mundus generals who cannot stop talking. They are clearly different animals from same species just like our friend Cerberus above.

In some latest news article its directly called orthodox sequel and Capcom is closely monitoring and handling the game with NebulaJoy.

Canonicity was already addressed in last CM1 thread.


Vergil as usual is special edition self, aside from story stuff mentioned about him being in underworld to fight Mundus after DMC3.
 
GilverTheProtoAngelo said:
1) It happens after DMC3, even mentioned by Lady in cutscene somewhere, I don't remember.
2) Cutscene directly mentions Dante fighting Nevan a 2nd time, in quite an exaggerated way might I add.
3) Even Cerberus is not the same Cerberus, Dante even calls him brother of original in jest, to which Cerberus takes quite a bit of offense
4)Those are not same Griffon and Phantom...they lack any type of conversation ability, unlike the Mundus generals who cannot stop talking. They are clearly different animals from same species just like our friend Cerberus above.

In some latest news article its directly called orthodox sequel and Capcom is closely monitoring and handling the game with NebulaJoy.

Canonicity was already addressed in last CM1 thread.


Vergil as usual is special edition self, aside from story stuff mentioned about him being in underworld to fight Mundus after DMC3.
Click to expand...
I know it happens after DMC3, I've watched a playthrough already and I know dante and nevan had a conversation about fighting again but it wasn't explained why or how since she already became his weapon.

Good call if those are different versions of Phantom and Griffin and I already knew it was a different Cerberus so I had no qualms about that anyway.

Anyway, if an article said that outright about its canonicity then great. Nothing else to talk about.
 
I believe that Nevan ain't Nevan who already been a Devil arms.

Maybe its just another vampire demon woman who can do simmilar thing as Nevan, since Demon 'race' are common now.

Also from what I see once in DMC 1 artbook, Griffon is also race and there's a little Griffon on artbook which didn't make it to the game due hardware limits.
 
BlackDarkness679 said:
Off topic but whats orthodox sequel?
Click to expand...
Well I guess it means what it says on cover.

Thehunter077 said:
I believe that Nevan ain't Nevan who already been a Devil arms.

Maybe its just another vampire demon woman who can do simmilar thing as Nevan, since Demon 'race' are common now.

Also from what I see once in DMC 1 artbook, Griffon is also race and there's a little Griffon on artbook which didn't make it to the game due hardware limits.
Click to expand...
Well we have Nevan weapon in game, so basically it seem Dante just subdues her again after her break outside in world but could be different like Cerberus 🤷‍♂
4.png

在永无休止的演奏中, 对摇滚的狂热成为了吉他唯一的追求。它仿佛回到了战场之上, 用着癫狂的音波, 撕裂着每一个灵魂。
In the never-ending playing, the frenzy of rock and roll becomes the only pursuit of the guitar. It seems to go back to the battlefield, tearing every soul with its crazy sound waves.

Take note, this is modified nevan


Yeah, DMC1 artbook shows Griffon babies and stuff.
 
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