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The Flash (2023) Movie Discussion Thread (SPOILERS AHEAD)

Early Kryptonians LS were downgraded to Class K if you didn't know
 
ArkhamDC06 said:
Btw where are we with calcs and profiles?
Click to expand...
Flash becomes: At least 7-C with the Speed Force, 2-C Environmental Destruction when going FTL

Barry 2 could already contend with Faora and easily killed her. Not to mention both were capable of fighting against average Kryptonian soldiers.

Supergirl becomes: Low 6-B based of her being able to contend with and fight Zod.

I suppose Dark Flash gets the same rating as normal Flash, Keaton Batman should stay the same, although he should get a "Far higher with Bombs" given how they could stagger the big Kryptonians whose name I forgot.

The Barry 2's speed is weird though, he describes the Kryptonians to be fast but is still clearly faster than them. Yet he's shown to be somewhat comparable to Barry 1? I guess a suitable rating is like: "At least Sub-Relativistic, likely Relativistic, up to FTL at his peak". Both Zod and Supergirl should just be "At least Sub-Relativistic, likely higher", given that Zod proved to be a challenge for Barry 2
 
We could also bump up stronger Kryptonians to Rel, since Zod and Faora tagged Barry 1 & 2 while they were accelerating.
 
ByAsura said:
We could also bump up stronger Kryptonians to Rel, since Zod and Faora tagged Barry 1 & 2 while they were accelerating.
Click to expand...
Didn't Barry 2 end up blitzing Faora. Like at best, that's probably At most. Add to the fact Barry 1 is somewhat faster than a Superman that's superior to his MoS counterpart.

So ig, Zod, Faora and Kara can get "At most Relativistic"?
 
Do we consider Josstice League Superman to be stronger than MoS Superman?
 
ByAsura said:
Do we consider Josstice League Superman to be stronger than MoS Superman?
Click to expand...
Yeah. He supposedly got stronger as time went on, as by the time of BvS, he could fight Doomsday while poisoned and weakened, and Doomsday himself is superior to Zod (By how much, we don't really know).
 
town level superman, fr fr

edit: i was referring to the bvs nuke stuff
 
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Emirp sumitpo said:
Flash becomes: At least 7-C with the Speed Force, 2-C Environmental Destruction when going FTL

Barry 2 could already contend with Faora and easily killed her. Not to mention both were capable of fighting against average Kryptonian soldiers.

Supergirl becomes: Low 6-B based of her being able to contend with and fight Zod.

I suppose Dark Flash gets the same rating as normal Flash, Keaton Batman should stay the same, although he should get a "Far higher with Bombs" given how they could stagger the big Kryptonians whose name I forgot.

The Barry 2's speed is weird though, he describes the Kryptonians to be fast but is still clearly faster than them. Yet he's shown to be somewhat comparable to Barry 1? I guess a suitable rating is like: "At least Sub-Relativistic, likely Relativistic, up to FTL at his peak". Both Zod and Supergirl should just be "At least Sub-Relativistic, likely higher", given that Zod proved to be a challenge for Barry 2
Click to expand...
Okay, I can post my Supergirl blog if that's alright
 
ArkhamDC06 said:
Okay, I can post my Supergirl blog if that's alright
Click to expand...
I feel there's a lot still missing:

  • Class M should be Class K
  • Sub-Relativistic should be Relativistic (Zod, while slower, could still catch Barry 2 unaware)
  • She should share all of the same physiological powers as Superman, just copy paste and word it differently.
  • Standard Equipment should include Codex
  • I think you should add a notable attacks and techniques section as well as Standard Tactics

For Standard Tactics, I think it should be this
Standard Tactics: Supergirl often starts out with Heat Vision, before proceeding to use close quarters combat against her opponent.
Click to expand...

It's better to just compile the profile in a CRT when we start updating the profiles as well.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
  • I think you should add a notable attacks and techniques section as well as Standard Tactics
Click to expand...
I don't think it's necessary honestly, at least not for the Standard Tactics, Supergirl doesn't seem to have a particulary strategic mind, she just uses whatever ability she feels is better at the moment
Emirp sumitpo said:
It's better to just compile the profile in a CRT when we start updating the profiles as well.
Click to expand...
Yeah, we'll add the blog to the CRT when we start the update
 
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ArkhamDC06 said:
I don't think it's necessary honestly, at least not for the Standard Tactics, Supergirl doesn't seem to have a particulary strategic mind, she just uses whatever ability she feels is better at the moment
Click to expand...
I feel it's better to include as it's a part of the standard profile format, and would at least give a more detailed explanation for stuff
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Sub-Relativistic should be Relativistic (Zod, while slower, could still catch Barry 2 unaware)
Click to expand...
Isn't Barry 2 not quite as fast as Barry 1?

I'm iffy about this scaling, since Barry 1's scaling comes from JL Superman who has grown a lot more powerful since MoS + BvS Superman can fight Doomsday even while not fully recovered from Kryptonite weakening
 
Marvel_Champion_07 said:
Isn't Barry 2 not quite as fast as Barry 1?

I'm iffy about this scaling, since Barry 1's scaling comes from JL Superman who has grown a lot more powerful since MoS + BvS Superman can fight Doomsday even while not fully recovered from Kryptonite weakening
Click to expand...
I mean, Barry 2 could still somewhat keep up with Barry 1 couldn't he? IIRC, he's not that much slower.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
I mean, Barry 2 could still somewhat keep up with Barry 1 couldn't he? IIRC, he's not that much slower.
Click to expand...
Perhaps, but given that Barry 2 is still somewhat slower and the Clark that Barry 1 scales to having grown significantly more powerful since fighting Zod makes me more doubtful of Relativistic scaling for Zod and the other Kryptonians

I can see something along the lines of "At least Sub-Rel, possibly higher", but outright Rel scaling is iffy
 
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Marvel_Champion_07 said:
Perhaps, but given that Barry 2 is still somewhat slower and the Clark that Barry 1 scales to having grown significantly more powerful since fighting Zod makes me more doubtful of Relativistic scaling for Zod and the other Kryptonians

I can see something along the lines of "At least Sub-Rel, possibly higher" or sth, but outright Rel scaling is iffy
Click to expand...
Fair enough, I think it's weird the likes of Cyborg is faster than Zod but I digress
 
Marvel_Champion_07 said:
Perhaps, but given that Barry 2 is still somewhat slower and the Clark that Barry 1 scales to having grown significantly more powerful since fighting Zod makes me more doubtful of Relativistic scaling for Zod and the other Kryptonians

I can see something along the lines of "At least Sub-Rel, possibly higher", but outright Rel scaling is iffy
Click to expand...
Changed my blog with that
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Flash becomes: At least 7-C with the Speed Force, 2-C Environmental Destruction when going FTL

Barry 2 could already contend with Faora and easily killed her. Not to mention both were capable of fighting against average Kryptonian soldiers.

Supergirl becomes: Low 6-B based of her being able to contend with and fight Zod.

I suppose Dark Flash gets the same rating as normal Flash, Keaton Batman should stay the same, although he should get a "Far higher with Bombs" given how they could stagger the big Kryptonians whose name I forgot.

The Barry 2's speed is weird though, he describes the Kryptonians to be fast but is still clearly faster than them. Yet he's shown to be somewhat comparable to Barry 1? I guess a suitable rating is like: "At least Sub-Relativistic, likely Relativistic, up to FTL at his peak". Both Zod and Supergirl should just be "At least Sub-Relativistic, likely higher", given that Zod proved to be a challenge for Barry 2.
Click to expand...
I agree with everything other than Flash's rating. Barry 1 should scale to his SnyderVerse key and have a Low 6-B rating due to the movie acknowledging his part of events from the Snyder Cut, including his knocking out Aquaman with an accidental tackle. Given that Barry 2's supposedly less powerful than Barry 1, he could/should get the 7-C scaling. Dark Flash's tricky since he's supposedly a much more powerful Barry 2, so I'd probably give him an at least 7-C possibly/likely Low 6-B due to him being much stronger than before and, theoretically, somewhat superior to Barry 1.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Tbh, I really don't think Faora and Nam-Ek are that vastly inferior. At least 7-C is kinda cringe ngl
Click to expand...
Yeah, I think they should get a likely/possibly up to Low 6-B, at least when discussing their latest appearances since here they seem to be treated as comparable to Zod and Supergirl.
 
animus10001 said:
I agree with everything other than Flash's rating. Barry 1 should scale to his SnyderVerse key and have a Low 6-B rating due to the movie acknowledging his part of events from the Snyder Cut, including his knocking out Aquaman with an accidental tackle. Given that Barry 2's supposedly less powerful than Barry 1, he could/should get the 7-C scaling. Dark Flash's tricky since he's supposedly a much more powerful Barry 2, so I'd probably give him an at least 7-C possibly/likely Low 6-B due to him being much stronger than before and, theoretically, somewhat superior to Barry 1.
Click to expand...
Can summarise the snyder thing again?
 
Eh, it seems very iffy, with Snyder actively saying the Snyder cut ain't canon, and the way they time travel is very different.

It just seems more like a cute reference.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Eh, it seems very iffy, with Snyder actively saying the Snyder cut ain't canon, and the way they time travel is very different.

It just seems more like a cute reference.
Click to expand...
Not sure about that, even accounting for Snyder's statement, the movie actively acknowledges both the time travel and Aquaman pointing at Flash after he accidentally knocked him out, so I'd say it's pretty safe to use them as reference.

Anyways, the one that truly matters here is Aquaman's scene as it directly affects the scaling by showing that Barry can generate enough force to knock out beings on Aquaman's level, it's also not contradictory to anything shown in 2017's version, so I don't see an issue with using it.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Barry 2 could already contend with Faora and easily killed her. Not to mention both were capable of fighting against average Kryptonian soldiers.
Click to expand...
Will Barry 2 be getting a separate profile then? Also, wasn't the reason Barry 2 killed her because he had a sharp piece of metal in his arm? Wouldn't him temporarily holding off Nam-Ek be better scaling than that?
Reyne said:
Kara couldn't break through a Kryptonian ship, but that was nothing for EoS MoS Superman.
Click to expand...
7-C Superman could damage Kryptonians' visors to the point they had to rip it off but Kara couldn't

I do want to point out that Flashpoint Zod might not be as powerful as End of MoS Zod, since he still has his armour entirely intact while fighting Kara, so he can't absorb as much sunlight as End of MoS Zod, who could take in even more sunlight by breaking off his armour. Plus, Flashpoint Zod doesn't have powers like heat vision or flight. Kara is probably still Low 6-B, just scaling below the likes of End of MoS Superman/Zod
 
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Marvel_Champion_07 said:
Will Barry 2 be getting a separate profile then? Also, wasn't the reason Barry 2 killed her because he had a sharp piece of metal in his arm? Wouldn't him temporarily holding off Nam-Ek be better scaling than that?

7-C Superman could damage Kryptonians' visors to the point they had to rip it off but Kara couldn't

I do want to point out that Flashpoint Zod might not be as powerful as End of MoS Zod, since he still has his armour entirely intact while fighting Kara, so he can't absorb as much sunlight as End of MoS Zod, who could take in even more sunlight by breaking off his armour. Kara is probably still Low 6-B, just scaling below the likes of End of MoS Superman/Zod

Worst comes to worst, she should still be 7-C
Click to expand...
Yeah, Barry 2 holding Nam-Ek back is the better feat. Faora's death is clearly due to the kryptonian shrapnel that fused with Barry 2's arm acting as a blade.

In regards to Zod's scaling, it's weird. He's definitely not as strong as his end of MoS version, but seems to be stronger than mid MoS Superman, he's also the only member of the Sword of Rao to fly during the final battle, even though Faora and Nam-Ek (especially Faora) should have the ability given that they were with him when he questions the military about Supergirl, but that might be strictly about his skill than his power.
 
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Marvel_Champion_07 said:
Will Barry 2 be getting a separate profile then? Also, wasn't the reason Barry 2 killed her because he had a sharp piece of metal in his arm? Wouldn't him temporarily holding off Nam-Ek be better scaling than that?
Click to expand...
He still physically deflects attacks from her and contends with her physically, even harms her with his punches.

Marvel_Champion_07 said:
7-C Superman could damage Kryptonians' visors to the point they had to rip it off but Kara couldn't

I do want to point out that Flashpoint Zod might not be as powerful as End of MoS Zod, since he still has his armour entirely intact while fighting Kara, so he can't absorb as much sunlight as End of MoS Zod, who could take in even more sunlight by breaking off his armour. Plus, Flashpoint Zod doesn't have powers like heat vision or flight. Kara is probably still Low 6-B, just scaling below the likes of End of MoS Superman/Zod
Click to expand...
I mean, even armored Zod could still damage End of MoS Superman. And Kara could straight up overpower Zod at times. Just Low 6-B is fine.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
He still physically deflects attacks from her and contends with her physically, even harms her with his punches.
Click to expand...
I see. 7-C Barry 1 and Barry 2 is solid
Emirp sumitpo said:
I mean, even armored Zod could still damage End of MoS Superman. And Kara could straight up overpower Zod at times. Just Low 6-B is fine.
Click to expand...
I agree. Low 6-B Kara isn't an issue for me. It's just where she fits on the scaling chain
 
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