Tdjwo
He/Him- 2,931
- 1,152
Once again, I'm here to try my luck after gaining some experience regarding the tiering system and some misunderstanding regarding it and Nasuverse as a whole.
For this CRT, my intention is to implement certain ideas gotten from the philosophical study of Tao/Daoism into the Nasuverse's Swirl of The Root. I'm well aware that philosophical statements aren't held as objectively as mathematical constructs, but as far as I'm aware, if a certain verse uses information gotten directly from the philosophical concept or from a philosopher regarding the topic, then it's totally usable for tiering based on what the verse has shown with such philosophy. Fortunately, Nasuverse seems to be one of those few verses that actually implements these philosophical works directly to its cosmological structure.
In Kara no Kyoukai, the cosmology of Daoism/Taoism aka, Onmyōdō (Japanese) was directly referenced when Shiki's root of existence and personality was being discussed. As we know, Shiki's third personality is Swirl of the Root itself. Kinoko Nasu, the author overseer of Nasuverse, has repeatedly taken contents directly from Laozi's Tao Te Ching, which is basically the original writing about Taoism, its teachings, cosmology and way of life. In this CRT, I'm going to show how Taoism has a remarkably coherent and hyper-literal depiction of the Root’s nature, as each statement regarding the Root corresponds very closely to statements about Laozi's Tao/Daoism.
Looking at the similarities, it starts with this;
Everything that comes from the origin/the root is destined to return back to the root
In the philosophical study of Taoism, there are two types of Tao; The Eternal Tao, also known as "Constant Tao," and the Tao (just Tao). The Tao can be named and described, but the Eternal Tao cannot be named and described
Tao can be spoken of as that which is spoken of as an aspect of divinity, but it doesn't apply to the one that cannot be spoken of, which is another aspect of divinity which has divine ineffability.
This is directly identical to how Swirl of The Root can be named and talked about but not the indescribable「 」
Swirl of The root represents "Tao," but the indescribable「 」represents the Constant/Eternal Tao.
Terms like "Akashic Records," Spiral of Origin, Swirl of The Root, etc are used to refer to the same divinity but a different aspect of it, to say it contains every record of existence is correct, but it doesn't refer to the aspect that cannot be spoken of as wholeness is a part of divinity just as much as ineffability is which is a different aspect that supersedes its other aspects and is the divinities true form. Some things can be said about divinity/the root/Tao, like it existing beyond dimensions.
....which would apply to some aspect of it but a lesser one that which the true form of it they can't be named, would still be separate and superior to it. This is further explained
What it says about Taiji
And then we have this from Tao/Dao
The indescribable「 」represents the oneness beyond distinction(yin-yang) and non-distinction(taiji). It's the complete totality of everything. It's neither transcendent of anything or transcending everything. Instead, it's everything, including the Swirl of Root. According to the Taoism description above, 「 」is the spiritual vessel itself, while Swirl of the Root is what's inside the vessel.
In Taoism, despite the number 0 being synonymous with emptiness, zero cannot be used to define the constant Tao as absolute nothingness.
while Tao is what gives birth to One, Two, Three, etc
The reason behind this is that「 」 represents the unnamed and imperceptible facet of the Divine, beyond the realm of human thought. It exists as a state that is neither the totality of God nor the void of nonexistence (0). It defies representation, as it can only be defined by the absence of information itself, without any binary digits whatsoever. I remember a character like God (Unsong) having this type of justification on his profile for tier 0.
From now on, please read everything very CAREFULLY.
In Nasuverse the concept of infinity is described this way through [ ]
And this is blatantly identical to what infinity is in Taoism;
Basically, how to define infinity as infinite is to make it definite hence not infinity, because infinity is only infinity if infinity is incomprehensible hence「 」as they said in the last sentence in the scan above for「 」;
But this direct comparison doesn't matter because I feel like people would still say that's not enough, and it's vague; the need for a direct statement is practically nigh irrelevant because the explanation of the infinity being ineffable is a direct comparison in itself, in a sense that absolute infinity also works like that with how it's strong Reflection Principle works.
If the infinity is a collection of everything in V then trying to capture it one way or another positively, you'll fail because the characterization is satisfied by atleast one large cardinal or certain large sets in V; hence absolute infinity is only absolute infinity if it's ineffable. Basically the exact same way「 」was described.
This should make it at least High 1A. After all, the Swirl of Root is already 1A as it's above dimensional theory, and I've proven that 「 」is different from Swirl of The Root via the blatant copy-like references cosmology-wise between Taoism and Swirl of the Root and the indescribable aspect being ontologically superior to the Swirl of Root making it at least High 1A.
Furthermore,「 」could qualify for Tier 0 based on the fact that 「 」is neither the totality of God nor the void of nonexistence (0). It defies representation, as it can only be defined by the absence of information itself, without any binary digits whatsoever.
Thinking again, Swirl of The Root has very identical justifications as God (Unsong).
Swirl of The Root (Proposed Justification)
Attack Potency: Outerverse level (exists at the summit of dimensional theories[3], It is completely transcendent of the rest of reality, an unrestrained domain free from binary opposition[4] | High Outerverse level (The stygian「 」represents True Infinity itself which can't be reached by recursively stacking infinities to it because in order to define infinity as truly infinite, is to make it definite hence not infinity, because infinity is only infinity if infinity is incomprehensible). possibly Boundless (While spoken off as [Swirl of the Origin] because that term cannot accurately capture its true essence as「 」, as 「 」 is absolute nothingness that can't have a name and lacks any and all description to the point where one can only remain silent if one wishes to stray closer to such divinity. and any possible description or definition one could try giving is immediately separated into its own idea unrelated to「 」due to its ineffable and incomprehensible element existing independently of its definitions representing the most divine aspect that exists in a state that can't be properly described as [0] which is supposed to represent Emptiness and nonexistence from which all concepts sprang forth from a realm of freedom without boundaries which even names cannot exist within it.)
God (Unsong)
Due to possible contentions, rating it as High 1A rather than Tier 0 could be fine as well as long as you give convincing reasonings for it.
For any possible contentions, please discuss it in the comment section peacefully and hopefully, don't spam "Disagree FRA" because that honestly shows you weren't interested in the CRT and only made such a statement because of personal bias. Thank you.
Agree:
Disagree:
Neutral:
For this CRT, my intention is to implement certain ideas gotten from the philosophical study of Tao/Daoism into the Nasuverse's Swirl of The Root. I'm well aware that philosophical statements aren't held as objectively as mathematical constructs, but as far as I'm aware, if a certain verse uses information gotten directly from the philosophical concept or from a philosopher regarding the topic, then it's totally usable for tiering based on what the verse has shown with such philosophy. Fortunately, Nasuverse seems to be one of those few verses that actually implements these philosophical works directly to its cosmological structure.
In Kara no Kyoukai, the cosmology of Daoism/Taoism aka, Onmyōdō (Japanese) was directly referenced when Shiki's root of existence and personality was being discussed. As we know, Shiki's third personality is Swirl of the Root itself. Kinoko Nasu, the author overseer of Nasuverse, has repeatedly taken contents directly from Laozi's Tao Te Ching, which is basically the original writing about Taoism, its teachings, cosmology and way of life. In this CRT, I'm going to show how Taoism has a remarkably coherent and hyper-literal depiction of the Root’s nature, as each statement regarding the Root corresponds very closely to statements about Laozi's Tao/Daoism.
Looking at the similarities, it starts with this;
Everything that comes from the origin/the root is destined to return back to the root
which is also said in the source material:
Furthermore, the constant Taoism is ineffable for it is absolutely nothingness beyond descriptions
Which corresponds to the Nasuverse source material about the Root:
In the source material as well, the basis for the ineffability of the Root is predicated on it being absolute nothingness even where the name, "Swirl of The Origin" cannot be used to describe「 」because it is a name hence separate and inferior to「 」which denotes for Kara/Emptiness.
In the philosophical study of Taoism, there are two types of Tao; The Eternal Tao, also known as "Constant Tao," and the Tao (just Tao). The Tao can be named and described, but the Eternal Tao cannot be named and described
Tao can be spoken of as that which is spoken of as an aspect of divinity, but it doesn't apply to the one that cannot be spoken of, which is another aspect of divinity which has divine ineffability.
This is directly identical to how Swirl of The Root can be named and talked about but not the indescribable「 」
And again;
Nasuverse version;
Swirl of The root represents "Tao," but the indescribable「 」represents the Constant/Eternal Tao.
Terms like "Akashic Records," Spiral of Origin, Swirl of The Root, etc are used to refer to the same divinity but a different aspect of it, to say it contains every record of existence is correct, but it doesn't refer to the aspect that cannot be spoken of as wholeness is a part of divinity just as much as ineffability is which is a different aspect that supersedes its other aspects and is the divinities true form. Some things can be said about divinity/the root/Tao, like it existing beyond dimensions.
....which would apply to some aspect of it but a lesser one that which the true form of it they can't be named, would still be separate and superior to it. This is further explained
Tao exists beyond Dualities, beyond distinction (yin and yang) and non-distinction (taiji) which In the source material its supported as well, True Emptiness being unrestricted from binary oppositions as a territory of freedom (this would include space-time because it's part of the distinctions that exist in yin and yang).
What it says about Taiji
And then we have this from Tao/Dao
The indescribable「 」represents the oneness beyond distinction(yin-yang) and non-distinction(taiji). It's the complete totality of everything. It's neither transcendent of anything or transcending everything. Instead, it's everything, including the Swirl of Root. According to the Taoism description above, 「 」is the spiritual vessel itself, while Swirl of the Root is what's inside the vessel.
In Taoism, despite the number 0 being synonymous with emptiness, zero cannot be used to define the constant Tao as absolute nothingness.
...which corresponds directly to how「 」is viewed.
while Tao is what gives birth to One, Two, Three, etc
The reason behind this is that「 」 represents the unnamed and imperceptible facet of the Divine, beyond the realm of human thought. It exists as a state that is neither the totality of God nor the void of nonexistence (0). It defies representation, as it can only be defined by the absence of information itself, without any binary digits whatsoever. I remember a character like God (Unsong) having this type of justification on his profile for tier 0.
From now on, please read everything very CAREFULLY.
In Nasuverse the concept of infinity is described this way through [ ]
And this is blatantly identical to what infinity is in Taoism;
Basically, how to define infinity as infinite is to make it definite hence not infinity, because infinity is only infinity if infinity is incomprehensible hence「 」as they said in the last sentence in the scan above for「 」;
Taoism's view on the concept of infinity, in general, has been discussed by numerous philosophists and Mathematicians comparing it to Georg Cantor's Absolute Infinity.
But this direct comparison doesn't matter because I feel like people would still say that's not enough, and it's vague; the need for a direct statement is practically nigh irrelevant because the explanation of the infinity being ineffable is a direct comparison in itself, in a sense that absolute infinity also works like that with how it's strong Reflection Principle works.
If the infinity is a collection of everything in V then trying to capture it one way or another positively, you'll fail because the characterization is satisfied by atleast one large cardinal or certain large sets in V; hence absolute infinity is only absolute infinity if it's ineffable. Basically the exact same way「 」was described.
This should make it at least High 1A. After all, the Swirl of Root is already 1A as it's above dimensional theory, and I've proven that 「 」is different from Swirl of The Root via the blatant copy-like references cosmology-wise between Taoism and Swirl of the Root and the indescribable aspect being ontologically superior to the Swirl of Root making it at least High 1A.
Furthermore,「 」could qualify for Tier 0 based on the fact that 「 」is neither the totality of God nor the void of nonexistence (0). It defies representation, as it can only be defined by the absence of information itself, without any binary digits whatsoever.
Thinking again, Swirl of The Root has very identical justifications as God (Unsong).
Swirl of The Root (Proposed Justification)
Attack Potency: Outerverse level (exists at the summit of dimensional theories[3], It is completely transcendent of the rest of reality, an unrestrained domain free from binary opposition[4] | High Outerverse level (The stygian「 」represents True Infinity itself which can't be reached by recursively stacking infinities to it because in order to define infinity as truly infinite, is to make it definite hence not infinity, because infinity is only infinity if infinity is incomprehensible). possibly Boundless (While spoken off as [Swirl of the Origin] because that term cannot accurately capture its true essence as「 」, as 「 」 is absolute nothingness that can't have a name and lacks any and all description to the point where one can only remain silent if one wishes to stray closer to such divinity. and any possible description or definition one could try giving is immediately separated into its own idea unrelated to「 」due to its ineffable and incomprehensible element existing independently of its definitions representing the most divine aspect that exists in a state that can't be properly described as [0] which is supposed to represent Emptiness and nonexistence from which all concepts sprang forth from a realm of freedom without boundaries which even names cannot exist within it.)
God (Unsong)
Due to possible contentions, rating it as High 1A rather than Tier 0 could be fine as well as long as you give convincing reasonings for it.
For any possible contentions, please discuss it in the comment section peacefully and hopefully, don't spam "Disagree FRA" because that honestly shows you weren't interested in the CRT and only made such a statement because of personal bias. Thank you.
Agree:
Disagree:
Neutral:
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