• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Soul Crush Doesn't Exist

Gonzui is said to be resisted if you have more reiryoku than the normal person. Ergo Reiryoku grants soul resist.

I am not arguing more energy = more resistance at all, I am saying that having a certain amount grants resistance which is shown to be the case when Ulquiorra explains this to Yammy on why Tatsuki survived.

So you want to share resistances. Got it.
 
@akm that doesn't make much sense, Soul crush is soul hax based, in fact the all the characters have soul Manipulation on their profile, therefore all the characters have soul hax resistances, and soul hax in this wiki ignore completely the Durability, that doesn't mean by any sense that by equalising energy, they all get the resistance by being stronger.

there are plenty of verse, mostly from novel, some of them that are magic based, that have soul manipulation abilities that are blocked inside the series by having a "stronger magic" yet that doesn't mean, that in a versus thread, all the characters stronger than the one with soul manipulation will resist it. Why? Because we don't give resistance to abilities by equalising energy.

the point of equalising energy is that every characters can use his abilities, he will not gain any sort of resistences thanks to the energy equalised, otherwise I can apply this logic in every match up and give random resistance to every one from DB to Fairy Tail and so on, and it will be just an huge mess.

I think the main problem here, is that, some people can't accept the existence of some soul passive hax from Bleach, but the greatest problem is that, they accept the soul hax from the attacks, that doesn't even make sense.

Soul crush is completely legit, is soul hax based, and therefore it ignores the Durability.

You can easily counter it by having soul hax resistances.
 
AnonymousBlank said:
Gonzui is said to be resisted if you have more reiryoku than the normal person. Ergo Reiryoku grants soul resist.
Click to expand...
Gonzui which is one extremely limited application of soul hax, which is only soul suck. And you wanna scale that thing to all soul hax. That's even more absurd and never going to happen without explicit statements/evidences.

Also, I wanna check the wording of that statement if you can provide the scan. Is it "resisted by" or "doesn't work"?
 
Because you don't understand the full mechanics of the verse. 99% of things within the series has a soul manipulation mechanic. Only Auswhalen, Almighty, and a couple other things don't.

Quincy have soul destruction with their arrows, Fullbringers can control ambient souls around them, Shinigami use their own souls to use techniques, Hollows go around eating them.

Reiryoku = stronger soul = better resistance.
 
Quincies arrow also destroy souls ,zanpakuto bfr and purify souls , hollow eat souls etc .

Soul hax have many variation in bleach and is treated the same as soul crush or soul suck when it come to resisting those effects , having a strong enough soul wich is linked to Reiryoku.

ninja'd
 
Can someone link to the statement about Gonzui?
 
stronger reiryoku= stronger soul = better resistance to soul hax in general , in bleach .

You can still be garbage AP and durability wise , like tatsuki, and still resist soul stuff even if her resistance is weak and doesn't do much beside barely surviving instead of dying instantly .

It's not a hard concept to grasp .
 
Yhwach is the ultra quincy. He have all the advantages but none of the weakness. He ain't even bothered by absorbing or being damaged by hollow powers which are supposed to be a big deal for basic quincies
 
That scan literally says that his soul suck didn't work because her soul is stronger which is nothing but her having higher level of reiryoku. It doesn't say she has some kind of resistance to it. That is textbook example of having a caveat, explained in-verse. Vegeta and Nappa and everybody and their mothers don't get resistance to reality warping because of having higher energy, instead Shenron gets a caveat.

And I don't know why you'd bother bringing up quincies who are clear exceptions.
 
Again this doesn't support you lol.

Higher reiryoku = stronger soul = better resistance.

you're really stretching this 2 liner out as some sort of ultimatum.

Also I bothered because it literally goes against your logic, there is no exception here. They have 0 Reiatsu but according to you they shouldn't be able to fight a Shinigami. Also I'd appreciate if u stop ignoring like 90% of my posts.
 
Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
Higher reiryoku = stronger soul = better resistance.
Click to expand...
The highlighted part is unfounded and I don't know how repeating it helps anything.
 
How is it unfounded? It's the mechanics the verse. Tatsuki doesn't have equivalent level of energy compared to Yammy.

And again stop ignoring 90% of my posts.

Reiatsu =/= AP or Durability.
 
AKM sama said:
Vegeta and Nappa and everybody and their mothers don't get resistance to reality warping because of having higher energy, instead Shenron gets a caveat.
Click to expand...
I think you misunderstood something about the whole stuff, in bleach, every battles are battles of souls, peoples with higher reiryoku (energy of the souls) can supress soul hax damages judging by how their own spirit energy is higher than the opponent, to make a clear comparison, it's like as when Goku could cancel ki blast from Nappa (or peoples weaker than him) in Z, the point here is that in bleach case, it's soul hax since all of their fights and attacks arms souls (the other explanation that came into my mind is this one from Kenpachi).

I am neutral about this but i just wanted to inform you about this.
 
I'll be honest. If your problem is that the soul wasn't affected because it is stronger than normal and because "resistance" isn't used as a word, then...

You are gonna be needing to make a CRT AKM, because that's literally how resistance is handled most of the time, by this or that being stronger and letting the character resist. It is also incredibly close minded to literally ask to be spoon fed any direct mention of resistance. That is not how things work here, so I am not sure what standards you are upholding.

Like, take a look at the SBA snippet Sigurd took.

"However, if an ability has a weakness, condition, caveat, or limitation, stated by at least a valid and uncontradicted statement, then it should be applicable after the equalization."

There's nothing like this, and you have provided nothing like this.
 
IMade has already explained it quite well I'd say, besides this AKM has yet to provide the uncontradicted statement of a caveat for RC. He seems to be blatantly ignoring mechanics explained to him en mass and rather his very extremely limited knowledge of the subject. And Also ignoring several factors like reiatsu not being equal to stats or the fact that it's also a form of soul manipulation.

1) Soul Resistance:

  • Example: A character sucks out the souls from a tow, regular people (who have little to no Reiryoku) had their souls sucked out, Tatsuki (a character who has little Reiryoku, enough to perceive the supernatural but not enough to have supernatural abilities) is incapacitated by the ability with her soul intact and characters like Chad and Orihime (who have a notable amount of Reiryoku to the point they have supernatural abilities) are unaffected by the ability.
  • Verse/Energy Equalization does not grant you this.
2) Supernatural Senses:

  • Those with a notable amount of Reiryoku can see the supernatural.
  • Regular people with little to no Reiryoku can not see the supernatural.
  • Verse/Energy Equalization does not grant you this.
3) Extra Senses (Called Reiraku and Reikaku in Bleach):

4) Reiatsu (Which has Several Abilities in Bleach):



Equalizing energy does not grant you the abilities of the equalized energy nor the resistances of the equalized energy because at that point you have changed the powers of the character and the match is no longer accurate. We have had a thread involving stuff discussing Reiatsu Crush and Energy Equalization as well and it was agreed that Reiatsu Crush's soul manipulation does not get equalized nor resisted because Reiatsu Crush is an ability, a soul manipulation ability and you need resistace to it to resist it just like any other ability.
 
"the point here is that in bleach case, it's soul hax since all of their fights and attacks arms souls (the other explanation that came into my mind is this one from Kenpachi)."

Yes I am aware that reiryoku or spiritual energy is the main energy even humans have through which almost everything happens in Bleach. Like literally what you linked, someone with a lower energy won't be able to stand against someone with higher energy. His sword not being able to cut someone of a higher spiritual energy level is nothing out of the ordinary and would work exactly the same way with any other character due to verse equalization. That's like arguing that only ten aura can block malicious aura attacks.

"You are gonna be needing to make a CRT AKM, because that's literally how resistance is handled most of the time"

Please tell me which other verse in the whole wiki gives out resistances to the whole cast when it is blatantly explained in-verse that the ability doesn't work on someone with a stronger something. If it is stated that someone resisted a mind control due to having a strong mind or powerful will, it is treated like a limitation of the mind manipulation hax that it is not potent enough to be wroking on everybody. Also it's not about the use of the word "resistance" that needs to be mentioned. She would have gotten it even if nothing was said about it.

He literally drew a conclusion as to why his ability did not work, and that conclusion is because she had a stronger soul. It's extreme highballing to suggest that everyone in the verse should get resistance based off of that, when he CLEARLY pointed out, by his own statement, that his ability is ineffective and impotent against anyone having a strong soul. That's treated as a limitation of the ability in every other case and no matter who Yammy faces, if the other person has a stronger soul for whatever reason, his soul suck won't work.

And forget what I said let's say I were to blindly accept your point, one application of soul manip hax doesn't scale to a plethora of different applications of it. Soul suck =/= reiatsu crush. Both are different.

"There's nothing like this, and you have provided nothing like this. "

As I already said above, a statement is preferable when there is lack of evidence, but not the only thing needed. Feats always > statements. And there are all the instances where it doesn't work on characters with more spiritual energy and none where it works. Your argument is literally that "a weaker character's energy aura doesn't work on stronger character because all of them are extraordinarily resistant to it", where the former part is painfully obvious because that's how energy works and it counts as a limitation, and the latter part is just headcanoning said limitation as something exactly opposite.

"Long post by Imade"

It was already addressed on the thread where you took it from, and all of the relevant points about reiatsu crush have already been brought up by you earlier. Nobody refuted it having soul manipulation effects, and the points about Orihime and Tatsuki were already addressed.
 
So any hax that didn't worked on someone can be resisted by raw AP for you ? Because it didn't worked on everyone the ability is just weak to AP ,resistance unrelated to AP doesn't exist ?
 
Don't misconstrue my point. You're literally strawmanning, I never even said that.
 
But it is what you wrote;

you are giving a resistance, to everyone is strong enough, just because of AP.

Without verse equalisation the soul crush would works, so it has to work too with the verse equalisation, the point of equalising is that every character can use all the abilities it has not that the character will gain a resistance by the equalisation.
 
AKM sama said:
Yes I am aware that reiryoku or spiritual energy is the main energy even humans have through which almost everything happens in Bleach. Like literally what you linked, someone with a lower energy won't be able to stand against someone with higher energy. His sword not being able to cut someone of a higher spiritual energy level is nothing out of the ordinary and would work exactly the same way with any other character due to verse equalization. That's like arguing that only ten aura can block malicious aura attacks.
Click to expand...
The point is, Soul energy cannot be scaled to AP since this isn't pure AP, it's the enrgy of the souls, something that can't be equaled to AP due to the fact that it don't determind how strong you are, but rather how strong your soul is, to put it simply, it's like equalize a verse where the whole cast are mere souls, everything based in the verse are souls hax and God tier can destroy soul by flexing, to a verse only with corporeal dude by saying the verse of corporeal dude are stronger so they have all the stuff of the NC verse in verse equal and btw a resistance due to the fact that they are stronger.

This wont work because their Souls aren't as potent as the NC verse due to the other verse mechanics, equalizing won't solve the thing.
 
If that's the case then wouldn't we say that Reiatsu Crush is impossible to evaluate in terms of effectiveness against other verses? We don't know how strong the souls are from a completely different verse, so at best as all you could say is that "Reiatsu Crush would possibly work against them, possibly not."
 
Wait, I saw someone above saying reiryoku gives soul hax resistance just because Yammys Gonzui can be "resisted" by having more reiryoku

Thing is, if thats the case, why is this standard being applied to all other applications of soul haxes in Bleach?
 
@damage without feats, the souls are considered simply, normal soul, for example saitama, he is strong but his soul would still be considered a normal human soul, therefore he can be easily killed with soul manipulation via ignoring durability.

when a soul resistance is involved, usually is evaluated by the number of souls you can affect.

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Soul_Manipulation

it is not AP related.
 
What is a "normal soul"? That seems completely unquantifiable.

It sounds like you're imposing Bleach standards on characters on other verses by assuming their souls have to be as strong as a random person in the Bleach-verse.
 
Saitama isn't really a good example of what a "strong soul" should be though since One Punch Man doesn't have a spiritual energy equivalent (and is one of the verses where Reiatsu Crush should actually still work on them no matter what)

I have a very hard time believing, say, Dragon ball and their KI doesn't give DB characters a "strong soul"
 
Code: 
Not all forms of soul manipulation one shots in the first opportunity. I've seen this a lot in fiction and it's not about the character having resistance it's jsut that the manipulation doesn't automatically one shot the opponent.
Like literally if someone is still alive after getting his soul attacked we shouldn't give them resistance to soul manipulation if they are showing signs of almost being near death even tho they didn't get one shotted
 
Damage3245 said:
If that's the case then wouldn't we say that Reiatsu Crush is impossible to evaluate in terms of effectiveness against other verses? We don't know how strong the souls are from a completely different verse, so at best as all you could say is that "Reiatsu Crush would possibly work against them, possibly not."
Click to expand...
If their souls have no feat of resisting soul hax or even "AP" strikes with non physical interaction , then they are considered has having basic human souls without much resistances or AP/dura.

At best , you could scale them to bleach's basic human souls via verse equal , who still have a really tiny bit of reiryoku wich grant them pretty much nothing in terms of resistance.

otherwise i could say that any verse that didn't experienced mind hax , that we can't know how mind hax would work against them , that would be silly .
 
> otherwise i could say that any verse that didn't experienced mind hax , that we can't know how mind hax would work against them , that would be silly .

Yes, but typically we don't say that mind hax would work against a creature that we don't know if it has a mind or not.

So therefore soul hax shouldn't work against a creature/character that we don't know has a soul or not.
 
Damage3245 said:
> otherwise i could say that any verse that didn't experienced mind hax , that we can't know how mind hax would work against them , that would be silly .
Yes, but typically we don't say that mind hax would work against a creature that we don't know if it has a mind or not.

So therefore soul hax shouldn't work against a creature/character that we don't know has a soul or not.
Click to expand...
"Under normal circumstances, most characters are assumed to have a soul by default unless the original medium specifies otherwise. Those who do not possess are soul are usually considered to be immune to most applications of Soul Manipulation."

straight from the soul manip page .
 
That's pretty baffling to me. I've no idea why we assume that to be the case, other than to make things easier for characters who have Soul Manipulation.
 
Well , you know what to do if you disagree with the currently accepted stuff . CRT

But right now , any soul hax in bleach or other verses soul hax, would work/be applicable against most characther unless specified in their verse.

that is how it work here . We are not "imposing" bleach 's standards on other verse. That is how soul hax is treated .

Soul hax potency is treated by the number of soul's haxxed or by the potency of the resistance it can overcome . Without feat or statements , random souls have no resistance.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Apollonir.Scale
Bleach Soul Crush
Replies
8
Views
2K
CodeCCLL
CodeCCLL
BasedNecoScaler69
  • Locked
(Bleach) reiatsu crush gg no more?
2 3
Replies
109
Views
8K
LephyrTheRevanchist
LephyrTheRevanchist
RanaProGamer
  • Locked
The Hero Hunter Take On The Quincy King
Replies
7
Views
2K
LordGriffin1000
LordGriffin1000
RanaProGamer
  • Locked
Death Battle REMATCH | Madara vs Aizen
2 3 4
Replies
142
Views
8K
LephyrTheRevanchist
LephyrTheRevanchist
ReaperAndBlues
Getting Hot? Here's a Fight to Cool You Off.
Replies
31
Views
2K
ReaperAndBlues
ReaperAndBlues
Back
Top