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What?
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Why you keep mentioning it being passive when it doesnt matter here is beyond me. But the point remains unchanged that not all characters Reiatsu Crush a soul instantly, just as shown with Yammy and Tatsuki. It being passive doesn't have anything to do with the speed of the abilities use.
And it's relevant because you like to assume Tatsuki has some magical resistance all because her soul wasn't instantly flattened without considering the possibility of Yammy's RC not instantly crushing souls. Like we always assume first if a resistance isn't outright proven (so im told we do anyway).
And it's relevant because you like to assume Tatsuki has some magical resistance all because her soul wasn't instantly flattened without considering the possibility of Yammy's RC not instantly crushing souls. Like we always assume first if a resistance isn't outright proven (so im told we do anyway).
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Sry. That was a personal qualm. But it kinda goes back to my jadedness regarding this topic of RC.
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> some magical resistance
Not sure what to tell you, she resisted both Yammy and Aizen. get over it dude. So twice her soul wasn't completely flattened by someone who eclipses her.
Everything that can't resist it has died instantly, there is no speed here to argue here, but feel free to post something from the manga that helps us understand your argument.
Not sure what to tell you, she resisted both Yammy and Aizen. get over it dude. So twice her soul wasn't completely flattened by someone who eclipses her.
Everything that can't resist it has died instantly, there is no speed here to argue here, but feel free to post something from the manga that helps us understand your argument.
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> But the point remains unchanged that not all characters Reiatsu Crush a soul instantly
Maybe because they are resistant to soul manip?
> It being passive doesn't have anything to do with the speed of the abilities use.
What does this even mean? It's passive. What speed are you even trying to bring up?
> And it's relevant because you like to assume Tatsuki has some magical resistance all because her soul wasn't instantly flattened without considering the possibility of Yammy's RC not instantly crushing souls
Again. Resistance.
Maybe because they are resistant to soul manip?
> It being passive doesn't have anything to do with the speed of the abilities use.
What does this even mean? It's passive. What speed are you even trying to bring up?
> And it's relevant because you like to assume Tatsuki has some magical resistance all because her soul wasn't instantly flattened without considering the possibility of Yammy's RC not instantly crushing souls
Again. Resistance.
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>Maybe because they are resistant to soul manip?
Or the ones who have used RC to crush souls instantly do it because its a feat for them.
>What does this even mean? It's passive. What speed are you even trying to bring up?
Should be pretty clear. The speed im talking about is the speed in which the victim is soul crushed. In this case, Tatsuki's soul was being crushed like it was supposed to, but not instantly. Yet, you assume this is because she magically resisted it rather than consider Yammy's soul crush just doesnt immediately crush souls.
>Again. Resistance
Which is what im calling out as flawed. As in, its easily just as likely that Yammy wasn't instantly crushing her soul rather than her magically gaining a resistance just because it wasn't instant. THAT is the issue.
Or the ones who have used RC to crush souls instantly do it because its a feat for them.
>What does this even mean? It's passive. What speed are you even trying to bring up?
Should be pretty clear. The speed im talking about is the speed in which the victim is soul crushed. In this case, Tatsuki's soul was being crushed like it was supposed to, but not instantly. Yet, you assume this is because she magically resisted it rather than consider Yammy's soul crush just doesnt immediately crush souls.
>Again. Resistance
Which is what im calling out as flawed. As in, its easily just as likely that Yammy wasn't instantly crushing her soul rather than her magically gaining a resistance just because it wasn't instant. THAT is the issue.
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Also, thats going to be my last reply here for 2nite because I have to work on a blog I need to make while I still have time left.
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Having resistance allows you dull the effects of abilities. It's how resistance works. Poison not instantly killing when it normally does but you are fighting through it is a feat of resistance.
I'll ask you again to post evidence from the manga that supports a speed variable in how people are crushed or just stop honestly but it's just clogging the thread.
I'll ask you again to post evidence from the manga that supports a speed variable in how people are crushed or just stop honestly but it's just clogging the thread.
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> Or the ones who have used RC to crush souls instantly do it because its a feat for them.
All of those who were instanly RC don't have resistance or their resistance isn't as good.
> Should be pretty clear. The speed im talking about is the speed in which the victim is soul crushed. In this case, Tatsuki's soul was being crushed like it was supposed to, but not instantly. Yet, you assume this is because she magically resisted it rather than consider Yammy's soul crush just doesnt immediately crush souls.
Mate that is what resistance is. It allows you to not be affected or reduce the effect of the ability used. Why do you keep assuming Yammy's RC is any different to anyone else?
> Which is what im calling out as flawed. As in, its easily just as likely that Yammy wasn't instantly crushing her soul rather than her magically gaining a resistance just because it wasn't instant. THAT is the issue.
She survived the Gonzui which affects the soul so she gets a resistance. Yammy proceeds to RC her and not instantly negging her is because of said resistance.
All of those who were instanly RC don't have resistance or their resistance isn't as good.
> Should be pretty clear. The speed im talking about is the speed in which the victim is soul crushed. In this case, Tatsuki's soul was being crushed like it was supposed to, but not instantly. Yet, you assume this is because she magically resisted it rather than consider Yammy's soul crush just doesnt immediately crush souls.
Mate that is what resistance is. It allows you to not be affected or reduce the effect of the ability used. Why do you keep assuming Yammy's RC is any different to anyone else?
> Which is what im calling out as flawed. As in, its easily just as likely that Yammy wasn't instantly crushing her soul rather than her magically gaining a resistance just because it wasn't instant. THAT is the issue.
She survived the Gonzui which affects the soul so she gets a resistance. Yammy proceeds to RC her and not instantly negging her is because of said resistance.
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Tatsuki not getting instantly crushed but just barely surviving could also be because she possesses a little higher reiryoku levels than normal humans. All Yammy needed to do was to flare up his aura a bit more to generate a bit more effect.
The point isn't even relevant here. It's about the aura having no effect on characters having a higher energy than you. Not about weaker characters surviving your aura because they have good resistance or because you decided not to unleash it completely.
The point isn't even relevant here. It's about the aura having no effect on characters having a higher energy than you. Not about weaker characters surviving your aura because they have good resistance or because you decided not to unleash it completely.
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Again characters naturally have resistance to it.
her having a little more reiryoku than the average human doesn't support your argument about it being based around only the strength between individuals. The ability is scaled as a form of soul manipulation not some sort of AP Aura.
her having a little more reiryoku than the average human doesn't support your argument about it being based around only the strength between individuals. The ability is scaled as a form of soul manipulation not some sort of AP Aura.
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Also pointing out that Yammy's aura was clearly having its effect on a weaker character. Doesn't matter if she barely survives it, or has a poor resistance or not. The point is that it DID have an effect on a weaker character, but does NOT on a stronger character.
Also, no. If a power doesn't work on stronger characters, the whole verse doesn't get some magical resistance to it. That's highballing to the extreme limits. The more logical and blatant conclusion is that the ability has a caveat.
Doesn't matter what the ability is, be it soul manipulation or mind. What matters here is its working requirments which is clearly dependent on the opponent's energy level.
Also, no. If a power doesn't work on stronger characters, the whole verse doesn't get some magical resistance to it. That's highballing to the extreme limits. The more logical and blatant conclusion is that the ability has a caveat.
Doesn't matter what the ability is, be it soul manipulation or mind. What matters here is its working requirments which is clearly dependent on the opponent's energy level.
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So what you're arguing is that anyone that doesn't get affected by RC in the series is comparable to each other in energy?
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That's not a caveat, you're blatantly ignoring the mechanics and context of the verse and trying it to make it something like DBZ. There is no statement or implication supporting this caveat within the verse that you're trying to place. It's not a high ball you simply just don't know the mechanics of the verse is all.
Yammy doesn't even matter here he's just one of earlier examples. She resisted Aizen as well.
Later in TYBW arc Shunsui withstood direct contact with Aizen who is 5-B at that point in time.
Your logic scales Shunsui to 5-B so you're the one high balling here.
Yammy doesn't even matter here he's just one of earlier examples. She resisted Aizen as well.
Later in TYBW arc Shunsui withstood direct contact with Aizen who is 5-B at that point in time.
Your logic scales Shunsui to 5-B so you're the one high balling here.
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Going by AKM's logic a lot of people will need to be upgraded lol.
All of these guys don't get affected by each other's RC so they are comparable to each other.
Edit: TYBW arc gonna be even better.
All of these guys don't get affected by each other's RC so they are comparable to each other.
Edit: TYBW arc gonna be even better.
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Also I've yet to see your evidence which is listed on the page as a requirement for there to even be a discussion on caveats.
"It is also important to note that characters won't lose or gain any abilities or resistances which they do or do not inherently possess. However, if an ability has a weakness, condition, caveat, or limitation, stated by at least a valid and uncontradicted statement, then it should be applicable after the equalization."
Please supply said uncontradicted statement of this caveat existing within said verse.
"It is also important to note that characters won't lose or gain any abilities or resistances which they do or do not inherently possess. However, if an ability has a weakness, condition, caveat, or limitation, stated by at least a valid and uncontradicted statement, then it should be applicable after the equalization."
Please supply said uncontradicted statement of this caveat existing within said verse.
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Why does that mean the ability has a caveat instead of it just meaning that the stronger people have a higher resistance?
Exhibit A: Tatsumaki was left gasping and barely able to stand up after Gonzui. We know it is perfectly effective at all ranges it works on because even a normal dude standing close to Chad and Orihime dies instantly, like the bunch of people around Tatsumaki.
Tatsumaki is left extremely weakened before Yammy even approaches. Orihime and Chad are left completely fine.
Gonzui is not Reiatsu Crush, yet they still resist better than her. That's a clear cut example of them having better resistances.
So let me posit a simple and straight forward question. What determines the ability having a caveat and what does the people just having higher resistance than other people? What has to happen for it to be one and not another?
There's no defined guideline that I can see through all this. A character being unaffected by a technique that affects other people, or being unaffected to a higher degree, gives resistance until direct implication that something like power makes the ability ineffective. So what criteria are you using to decide it must be a caveat?
Exhibit A: Tatsumaki was left gasping and barely able to stand up after Gonzui. We know it is perfectly effective at all ranges it works on because even a normal dude standing close to Chad and Orihime dies instantly, like the bunch of people around Tatsumaki.
Tatsumaki is left extremely weakened before Yammy even approaches. Orihime and Chad are left completely fine.
Gonzui is not Reiatsu Crush, yet they still resist better than her. That's a clear cut example of them having better resistances.
So let me posit a simple and straight forward question. What determines the ability having a caveat and what does the people just having higher resistance than other people? What has to happen for it to be one and not another?
There's no defined guideline that I can see through all this. A character being unaffected by a technique that affects other people, or being unaffected to a higher degree, gives resistance until direct implication that something like power makes the ability ineffective. So what criteria are you using to decide it must be a caveat?
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Let's not with the snippy tone if possible, please.
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AKM is just saying that it doesn't work on stronger characther because they have better Ap without even taking into consideration that it doesn't work because they have a better resistance.
he have no proof of what he claim while we have multiple proof that resistance is a thing for pretty much everyone in bleach .
he have no proof of what he claim while we have multiple proof that resistance is a thing for pretty much everyone in bleach .
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He couldn't even move and without interference (I don't remember if it was Freeza or Beerus who saved him) would've been erased by it eventually.ProfessorKukui4Life said:
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iirc , that was beerus who destroyed Sidra's hakai energy to free goku . And yes , he would have been erased eventually .
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The soi fon statement directly contradict the physical statement .
Aizen go from "a battle of souls is a battle of soul energy" to "nah ,who care about soul energy , just yeet that shit"
Aizen during that fight is 100% wrong on pretty much everything and spew contradicting stuff all around .
Aizen go from "a battle of souls is a battle of soul energy" to "nah ,who care about soul energy , just yeet that shit"
Aizen during that fight is 100% wrong on pretty much everything and spew contradicting stuff all around .
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How i interpreted than scene was like
aizen implied that physical attacks would work if you used reiatsu to gain that
so basically you would need high enough reiatsu and physical attacks alone wont work
cut zangetsu couldnt hurt kenpachi in the slightest despite being a sharp sword vs naked skin
as ichigos reiatsu wasnt high enough
aizen implied that physical attacks would work if you used reiatsu to gain that
so basically you would need high enough reiatsu and physical attacks alone wont work
cut zangetsu couldnt hurt kenpachi in the slightest despite being a sharp sword vs naked skin
as ichigos reiatsu wasnt high enough
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Kenpachi can use Reiatsu as some defensive wall. In the Novel with the other Kenpachi I think it's stated even his organs are hardened by it or something.
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Because , clearly , becoming the hogyoku's master mean a loss of 300 IQ points .Sekkonds. said:
That and plot induced stupidity , Hogyoku aizen is a completely different characther from base aizen .
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maybe in bleach putting reiatsu into your physical attributes would make it undetectable ?or aizen couldnt accept ichigo being higher than him as he is shocked after realizing that and he thought outside the box and made up a wierd explanation that made sense to himNaeblis495 said:
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You can improve your physical with soul energy , being strong ,durable and fast , but that doesn't make your energy disseapear.
And there never was a single mention either prior or after , that you can trade ALL of your soul energy permenantly for raw physical stats . That even condradict a LOT of the bleach basic stuff.
Aizen was just on drugs here .His other statements during the fight prove it enough .
And there never was a single mention either prior or after , that you can trade ALL of your soul energy permenantly for raw physical stats . That even condradict a LOT of the bleach basic stuff.
Aizen was just on drugs here .His other statements during the fight prove it enough .
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Kisuke did notice that as soon as aizen started to evolve , he started acting very differently than usual .Zoro21043 said:
In TYBW , aizen seem to be back to his senses , so i take it as a temporary loss in IQ and characther so that ichigo could win.
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Thank you!Naeblis495 said:
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Idk why arguments are being misconstrued here. RC not working on someone who is factually weaker than the user could depend on the context and a number of factors such as the user not wanting to kill the person, being suppressed enough, not flaring up his energy to the fullest, or just legit good resistances like in Orihime's case, not because the factually weaker characters are suddenly on the user's level. Scans for all these examples would also be real helpful.
Tatsuki was literally going to be crushed if Yammy had flared up his energy, she was almost done for as it is.
Plus, these examples don't even counter the point that it does not work on someone having more energy, which is literally the case how it works in verse. All these examples prove is that it doesn't always work on weaker characters for a plethora of reasons. I don't have to prove a negative, you have to prove the positive. So provide scans where it says that it doesn't work on stronger beings because they have stronger resistance to soul crush and that having more reiryoku grants more resistance.
Tatsuki was literally going to be crushed if Yammy had flared up his energy, she was almost done for as it is.
Plus, these examples don't even counter the point that it does not work on someone having more energy, which is literally the case how it works in verse. All these examples prove is that it doesn't always work on weaker characters for a plethora of reasons. I don't have to prove a negative, you have to prove the positive. So provide scans where it says that it doesn't work on stronger beings because they have stronger resistance to soul crush and that having more reiryoku grants more resistance.
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This more energy caveat doesn't even make sense. We know that having some level of reiryoku gives resistance which means this ties back into the "resistances from energies are not shared via verse equal" which was already agreed upon.
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Where does it say reiryoku gives resistance to soul crush? You're basically arguing more energy = more resistance so scan please? Also no, reiryoku is spiritual energy and it ties to "the caveat of an ability that depends on the level of energy one has will hold true via verse equal".
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> Asking for scans
> Doesn't provide a single one to support his argument. I don't understand how not a single person against this can't supply not 1 scan to support any of their claims lol.
1. Orihime isn't special which is something you don't seem to be understanding. No one is misconstructing your argument here. It's just that us the knowledgeable members about said series know what your argument is and how ridiculous it sounds. Which you seem to be ignoring.
2. She was already in the process, literally moments before she withstood his soul suck. There is no need to flare energy. Because again they're always emitting it as long as they're alive. Also again she was able to withstand Aizens whilst in in close proximity. He even praised her.
3. You have no proof of this like at all dude, it's not how it works. If it did you'd be able to provide 1 scan about how it works showing said statement.
Also you're the one arguing that it has a caveat, we don't have to do anything here. It's literally in the SBA page that you have to prove the caveat.
"It is also important to note that characters won't lose or gain any abilities or resistances which they do or do not inherently possess. However, if an ability has a weakness, condition, caveat, or limitation, stated by at least a valid and uncontradicted statement, then it should be applicable after the equalization."
> Doesn't provide a single one to support his argument. I don't understand how not a single person against this can't supply not 1 scan to support any of their claims lol.
1. Orihime isn't special which is something you don't seem to be understanding. No one is misconstructing your argument here. It's just that us the knowledgeable members about said series know what your argument is and how ridiculous it sounds. Which you seem to be ignoring.
2. She was already in the process, literally moments before she withstood his soul suck. There is no need to flare energy. Because again they're always emitting it as long as they're alive. Also again she was able to withstand Aizens whilst in in close proximity. He even praised her.
3. You have no proof of this like at all dude, it's not how it works. If it did you'd be able to provide 1 scan about how it works showing said statement.
Also you're the one arguing that it has a caveat, we don't have to do anything here. It's literally in the SBA page that you have to prove the caveat.
"It is also important to note that characters won't lose or gain any abilities or resistances which they do or do not inherently possess. However, if an ability has a weakness, condition, caveat, or limitation, stated by at least a valid and uncontradicted statement, then it should be applicable after the equalization."
Why does it matter what he thinks?
because he's giving us an analysis on a in verse mechannic? its like saying who cares what he thinks when he said my higher SP is why soi fons hax didnt work
Does not matter what he thinks, because his analysis was wrong though. You acknowledged what Aizen said was wrong concerning Ichigo sacrificing his spiritual energy.
You then proceeded to dignify and draw attention to the implications of what Aizen was saying. Later stating that it was his analysis of an element of the verses mechanics.
Well his analysis was wrong. It contradicts the lore on the workings of reiatsu.
Obviously what you said about the Soifon thing is correct.
because he's giving us an analysis on a in verse mechannic? its like saying who cares what he thinks when he said my higher SP is why soi fons hax didnt work
Does not matter what he thinks, because his analysis was wrong though. You acknowledged what Aizen said was wrong concerning Ichigo sacrificing his spiritual energy.
You then proceeded to dignify and draw attention to the implications of what Aizen was saying. Later stating that it was his analysis of an element of the verses mechanics.
Well his analysis was wrong. It contradicts the lore on the workings of reiatsu.
Obviously what you said about the Soifon thing is correct.
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"There is no need to flare energy. Because again they're always emitting it as long as they're alive."
Always emitting it is quite different than how much amount you're emitting at a given point of time. IIRC only Starrk doesn't know how to control it.
Always emitting it is quite different than how much amount you're emitting at a given point of time. IIRC only Starrk doesn't know how to control it.
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Stark knows how to control it, he simply found strong people that's able to withstand being in his presence. It's his entire backstory, he even split himself into 2 beings.
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