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Should Genshin Impact's Hilichurl Tier really be Low 7-B?

I think that's too much. Actually that radius will reach 6-A. You must have forgotten to change km to m.
 
Are we scaling the avg elemental attack to Bennett's elemental burst?, That comes off as odd, like scaling Raiden's Musou no Hitotachi to her normal blade strikes.
 
That would be a false equivalence though, not all bursts are alike, and not to mention certain skills sometimes end up doing more damage than their burst with some characters. As far as we should be concerned, the difference between burst and skill in terms of potency should be considered mostly gameplay mechanics unless demonstrated otherwise in lore.
 
Anyway, reading the thread, here are the possibilities I'm seeing:
  • Non-destructive characters or characters with no massive feats will have High 8-C as their baseline, scaling to Bennett and Susbedo
  • Higher tier ones either scale above the High 8-C characters or we revise the bamboo forest calc based on the "in-lore" scaling of the size of a bamboo forest, which would be around High 7-C (haven't bothered to really make it official though)
  • Characters can be scaled to other characters like basically every Vision User to someone like Bennett but should preferably be scaled to character-specific feats
 
Naitodesu said:
Anyway, reading the thread, here are the possibilities I'm seeing:
  • Non-destructive characters or characters with no massive feats will have High 8-C as their baseline, scaling to Bennett and Susbedo
  • Higher tier ones either scale above the High 8-C characters or we revise the bamboo forest calc based on the "in-lore" scaling of the size of a bamboo forest, which would be around High 7-C (haven't bothered to really make it official though)
  • Characters can be scaled to other characters like basically every Vision User to someone like Bennett but should preferably be scaled to character-specific feats
Click to expand...
Susbedo should not be High 8C
He was able to throw hands with Eula and clash swords with Traveler, who at this point had already clapped Childe

As for literally featless characters like Barbara and Diona, they should be "unknown" for literally never being in any combat-related scenario in the entire series. Default High 8C doesn't make any sense since actual High 8Cs have had training to use their powers specifically in combat while other characters haven't
 
Mickey1940 said:
Susbedo should not be High 8C
He was able to throw hands with Eula and clash swords with Traveler, who at this point had already clapped Childe

As for literally featless characters like Barbara and Diona, they should be "unknown" for literally never being in any combat-related scenario in the entire series. Default High 8C doesn't make any sense since actual High 8Cs have had training to use their powers specifically in combat while other characters haven't
Click to expand...
The low tiers from what I understand don't scale to susbedo but Bennett who melted Susbedos High 8-C ice
 
Mickey1940 said:
As for literally featless characters like Barbara and Diona, they should be "unknown" for literally never being in any combat-related scenario in the entire series. Default High 8C doesn't make any sense since actual High 8Cs have had training to use their powers specifically in combat while other characters haven't
Click to expand...
Makes sense
 
Naitodesu said:
Using the histogram tool on Photoshop, we find that the rough area of the selected forest is about 848 px^2, which when plugged into a radius calculator yields 16.42945 px, the document states there is an in-game meter for every 0.5125 pixels so:

16.42945/0.5125 = 32.05746341 in-game meters

Plugging these into the calculation, nets an 9-A+ to High 8-C
Click to expand...
We have a canon distance of 100 miles on the map, why not just use that?
 
Rakih_Elyan said:
The dialogue.
Click to expand...
genshin-impact.fandom.com

Guili Plains

The Guili Plains (Chinese: 归离原 Guīlí-yuán) is a subarea located in Qiongji Estuary, Liyue. It was the central area of the Guili Assembly, the ancient civilization ruled by Guizhong, the God of Dust, and Morax, the God of Geo.The location's name is derived from their names,[Note 1] and it is also...
genshin-impact.fandom.com genshin-impact.fandom.com
No mention of distance here.
 
The document I linked speculates in-game to in-lore distance with a talk about 100 miles to the west which came from the Cooking event with Xiangling.
 
Naitodesu said:
The document I linked speculates in-game to in-lore distance with a talk about 100 miles to the west which came from the Cooking event with Xiangling.
Click to expand...
Wow. Someone wrote an entire scientific paper on this topic. Nice. But I still couldn't find a mention of 100 miles or Xiangling even with CTRL-F.
 
Here you go
latest
 
Reading it again, why are we scaling Andrius to Guhua exactly? I don't really see much standing in the way of just making everyone High 8-C, we could make an exception for characters who are incredibly strong as Guhua himself is speculated to be an Adepti of sorts but I don't really see a reason why Guhua calc would scale to any of the regular Vision Users. Hell, we already make exceptions for people like Beidou (I still think her High 7-A rating is a hot load of shit), Xiao, and Shenhe, why is Guhua suddenly the focal point for characters that quite literally have no relation to him?

The justification I'm seeing for withholding the downgrades because Razor and Traveler might and I emphasize might scale to Andrius if we ignore the fact that the whole fight isn't really winnable anyway, and just plainly assume Andrius scales to Guhua for literally no good reason other than "they're both strong"

Really, all the other scaling we do is kind of horse hock given we scale Xiao to a feat that is unique to Venti, and scale to Beidou to a monster that might scale to other comparable monsters that the gods fought which we just scale to Venti's feat again. The logic is there but the justification for scaling is questionable because it relies on hasty assumptions on the relation of different characters.
 
Last edited:
Now in fairness, we are applying the same logic using Susbedo's calc and scaling it to everyone else but the difference is he actually fought the traveler and co., Guhua's feat is definitely applicable to someone in Genshin but Andrius is not one of them imo
 
Scaramouche handblocked an Electro Polearm strike from Cyno in the trailer, I wonder what the fight was all about.

He also seems to retain that Catalyst fighting style in Cutscenes but is still an absolute unit physically
 
Naitodesu said:
Reading it again, why are we scaling Andrius to Guhua exactly? I don't really see much standing in the way of just making everyone High 8-C, we could make an exception for characters who are incredibly strong as Guhua himself is speculated to be an Adepti of sorts but I don't really see a reason why Guhua calc would scale to any of the regular Vision Users. Hell, we already make exceptions for people like Beidou (I still think her High 7-A rating is a hot load of shit), Xiao, and Shenhe, why is Guhua suddenly the focal point for characters that quite literally have no relation to him?

The justification I'm seeing for withholding the downgrades because Razor and Traveler might and I emphasize might scale to Andrius if we ignore the fact that the whole fight isn't really winnable anyway, and just plainly assume Andrius scales to Guhua for literally no good reason other than "they're both strong"

Really, all the other scaling we do is kind of horse hock given we scale Xiao to a feat that is unique to Venti, and scale to Beidou to a monster that might scale to other comparable monsters that the gods fought which we just scale to Venti's feat again. The logic is there but the justification for scaling is questionable because it relies on hasty assumptions on the relation of different characters.
Click to expand...
Andrius =< Liyue Traveler => Ganyu = Guhua
 
Okay that makes more sense but I'm still questioning whether Ganyu's actually High 7-C though or scales to Guhua?
 
Shey said:
What's the justifications for these.

Why's Liyue Traveler Superior to Andrius and Ganyu
And why is Ganyu equal to Guhua
Click to expand...
I don't know much about Andrius' and Guhua's scaling but Ganyu directly stated that the Traveler wasn't inferior to her in her Story Quest.
 
Ganyu: No, I'm aware of your strength, Traveler. The power hidden within you is not inferior to mine.
Ganyu: If you're ready, we shall begin the training

This line then?
Seems valid, at first I thought it to just be potential.
That'll be grounds for an = chain
 
Shey said:
What's the justifications for these.

Why's Liyue Traveler Superior to Andrius and Ganyu
And why is Ganyu equal to Guhua
Click to expand...
Liiyue Traveler was stated to be stronger than Ganyu by Ganyu herself in her story quest, and Traveler boxed with Andrius in Razor's

Ganyu's considered the baseline for combatant Adepti in Genshin, and even lower-level Adepti scale to higher-level Vision users due to both being able to mollywhopp the likes of Abyss Mages, who can fight against the average trained Vision User
 
Mickey1940 said:
Liiyue Traveler was stated to be stronger than Ganyu by Ganyu herself in her story quest, and Traveler boxed with Andrius in Razor's

Ganyu's considered the baseline for combatant Adepti in Genshin, and even lower-level Adepti scale to higher-level Vision users due to both being able to mollywhopp the likes of Abyss Mages, who can fight against the average trained Vision User
Click to expand...
And then, there Inazuma and Sumeru Traveler who dunked the gods.
 
Gonna be honest, not convinced about scaling Ganyu to Guhua given Guhua has no reason to really have his feats scaled to anyone, and the justification for it merely being that Guhua is an adeptus or adeptus-aligned. Is there any good reason why we shouldn't just discard this besides the fact that we just arbitrarily decided that he'd scale to every Adeptus?

There's no good reason that it should really be considered a feat scalable to anyone given he has zero direct association with just about every relevant character we encounter, hell, Shenhe's 7-A calc would have more basis than this at being something Ganyu scaled to given they were both trained by Cloud Retainer, or the fact that Shenhe actually has been trained by other Adepti.

The lore behind the emergence of adepti is actually a lot like cultivation from those xia-whatever novels, so IMO universal adepti-scaling doesn't really make sense.
 
Naitodesu said:
Gonna be honest, not convinced about scaling Ganyu to Guhua given Guhua has no reason to really have his feats scaled to anyone, and the justification for it merely being that Guhua is an adeptus or adeptus-aligned. Is there any good reason why we shouldn't just discard this besides the fact that we just arbitrarily decided that he'd scale to every Adeptus?

There's no good reason that it should really be considered a feat scalable to anyone given he has zero direct association with just about every relevant character we encounter, hell, Shenhe's 7-A calc would have more basis than this at being something Ganyu scaled to given they were both trained by Cloud Retainer, or the fact that Shenhe actually has been trained by other Adepti.

The lore behind the emergence of adepti is actually a lot like cultivation from those xia-whatever novels, so IMO universal adepti-scaling doesn't really make sense.
Click to expand...
Guhua is considered an adeptus according to the lore behind the Rainslasher weapon
 
Mickey1940 said:
Liiyue Traveler was stated to be stronger than Ganyu by Ganyu herself in her story quest,
Click to expand...
Misinterpretation of her statement, she said he's not inferior, not that he's stronger
Mickey1940 said:
and Traveler boxed with Andrius in Razor's
Click to expand...
Okay I guess?
But Andrius has no reason to scale to Guhua
Mickey1940 said:
Ganyu's considered the baseline for combatant Adepti in Genshin, and even lower-level Adepti scale to higher-level Vision users due to both being able to mollywhopp the likes of Abyss Mages, who can fight against the average trained Vision User
Click to expand...
I don't recall instances of Abyss mages not losing to an avg trained vision user
 
Shey said:
Misinterpretation of her statement, she said he's not inferior, not that he's stronger

Okay I guess?
But Andrius has no reason to scale to Guhua

I don't recall instances of Abyss mages not losing to an avg trained vision user
Click to expand...
same thing, they both have the same tier

Andrius scales to Liyue Traveler who scales to Ganyu who is an adeptus, and Guhua is also considered an adeptus

They can still harm Vision users and give them a tough time
 
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