Shirou Emiya vs Ichigo Kurosaki

[Dat_Dot]

I believe there's a limit on how long shirou can maintain UBW, I believe if he use rho aias plus tracing will put large a strain for shirou in both physical and mentaly, which at this point stamina will be deciding factor. a huge deciding factor.

 

[LordGinSama]

Rin if you want a debate then do it with someone else please. Right now I'm deadly tired and only up due to insomnia issues nor am I in the mood. But do feel free to explain how he can bypass Blut Vene.

 

[Gemmysaur]

@knight

I gave my opinion on it quite a while ago on this thread. Something something only the sword but not the spirit.

@Yomi

I am aware. It was missed or forgotten entirely. It's pretty much common knowledge (if a lot get it wrong) that Shirou can trace the skill and stats (degraded though) of the weapon he traces. For example: Nine Lives Bladeworks. Caliburn in Shirou's hands letting him have servant stats enough to hit Berserker who was midswing, first. Shirou's KnB tracing to counter Kuzuki's attack, that mind you, the guy threw Saber like a ragdoll in his first battle appearance.

 

[Rin_Rokudo]

Rin if you want a debate then do it with someone else please. But do feel free to explain how he can bypass Blut Vene.

You mentioned those arguments, it's only llogical my argument would be directed at you. I have nothing against you, I'm just stating things as I see them.

And he can bypass Blut Vene with Gae Darg.

 

[Dat_Dot]

And he can bypass Blut Vene with Gae Darg.

So shirou has gae darg now?

 

[Blanked]

I believe there's a limit on how long shirou can maintain UBW, I believe if he use rho aias plus tracing will put large a strain for shirou in both physical and mentaly, which at this point stamina will be deciding factor. a huge deciding factor.

This. For some reason it's always ignored in Shirou match ups.

 

[LordGinSama]

I don't recall Shirou ever using Gae Garg. And what are the chances of him actually using it? He's not automatically gonna go for it.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

I believe there's a limit on how long shirou can maintain UBW, I believe if he use rho aias plus tracing will put large a strain for shirou in both physical and mentaly, which at this point stamina will be deciding factor. a huge deciding factor.

This. For some reason it's always ignored in Shirou match ups.

Yeah, except Shirou maintained his UBW against Gilgamesh just fine, while projecting hundreds of swords, analyzing Gilgamesh's swords as well as using Rho Aias. Not to mention actually that, he doesn't even project inside the UBW, he merely summons the swords to him, because they are already there.

 

[Yomi_Schwarz]

Experience/Skill Yeeeah, no. Shirou will automatically read those and gain them as his own.

Stamina Conceded, but that's not nearly enough to save him.

destroying UBW because he allegedly destroyed a pocket dimension No stated size on it, a NLF.

Blut Vene How is this ad advantage, it's just another ability. It's like me saying Shirou has hundreds of advantages because he has hundreds of swords. And, he can bypass the Vene.

Shunpo Really?

When did shirou get the ability to get someone's Skill and Exp. From tracing? isn't that limited into weapons only? proof pls

UBW is risky since his entire weakness pretty much has UBW in it

"He needs to be able to recite the full incantation for Unlimited Blade Works to bring it into existence as a Reality Marble. His low mana means that he can't use Unlimited Blade Works for long and only has a limited amount - though enough to match and overwhelm the Gate of Babylon - of projections before he runs out of mana. Avalon is useless without his connection to Saber, and thus can't be used in Unlimited Blade Works and Heaven's Feel under normal circumstances. He can lose control of Unlimited Blade Works' regenerative capabilities and die as his body bursts apart into swords. In Heaven's Feel, he cannot access Archer's abilities without unsealing the Shroud of Martin, which will eventually kill him by transforming his body into swords and overwriting his mind. Projecting past his limits will only accelerate this. His armor of swords doesn't protect his head."

Ichigo can take advantage of that "incantation" and kill him while he's busy talking to himself

His mana is low as it is already and using UBW would make him weak af if ichigo survives the entire shit show (he can't even use it for too long"

How Exactly can he no show blut so easily? if anything that just makes things harder for shirou

"Blut (ÞíÇÞúà (ÒâûÒâ½Òâ╝Òâê), burüto; German for "Blood," Japanese for "Blood Guise"): A Quincy ability which gives one inhuman defensive and offensive capability.

Blut Vene (ÚØÖÞíÇÞúà (ÒâûÒâ½Òâ╝ÒâêÒâ╗Òâ┤ÒéºÒâ╝Òâì), burüto vēne; German for "Blood Vein," Japanese for "Stilled Blood Guise"): One of two Blut abilities, Blut Vene is the defensive Blut. Ichigo's imprisonment by Quilge Opie transferred some of Quilge's Reiatsu to Ichigo, which awakened the memories within his Reiatsu left by his mother, who was a Quincy. This has given him access to the defensive Blut. He has used it to survive an attack from Yhwach's sword, which only left a small cut. This power can also be used to aid Ichigo against critical wounds that have already been inflicted, able to stop the severe loss of blood that would be caused from said wound."

you made it sound like blut is useless LOL

 

[Dat_Dot]

Yeah, except Shirou maintained his UBW against Gilgamesh just fine, while projecting hundreds of swords, analyzing Gilgamesh's swords as well as using Rho Aias.

And in the end of UBW route it was archer who killed gilgamesh.

 

[Blanked]

@Scarlet you don't answer the question at all.

For how long? That battle ended really quick.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

And in the end of UBW route it was archer who killed gilgamesh.

Your point being? Gilgamesh can hold his own against UBW because he does the exact same thing. Ichigo can't. He'll get skewered long before Shirou runs out of mana.

Ichigo won't be able to take advantage of Shirou during the enchantment of UBW because he can trace weapons, attack and defend while chanting, he can even project Rho Aias during it.

@William I don't know a timeframe but it was enough. And Shirou battled with Gilgamesh prior to entering the UBW as well.

 

[Dat_Dot]

@Scarlet

my point is shirou ran out magical energy before he able kill gilgamesh, yes gilgamesh is heavily injured but still alive, if archer wasn't there shirou is screwed. heck even it was archer who secretly use rho aias to help shirou during the fight.

 

[Blanked]

Yeah, the battle prior was nothing special.

To be honest I give him max of 15 minutes for UBW without using his rho aias several times. The timeframe would fall under 10 minutes and Shirou was really tired after they exit the UBW and this is without having to relay on rho aias.

 

[BoomeYang]

Going with Shirou for reasons above.

What you guys have forgotten to mention is that Shirou can also detonate his swords as Broken Phantasms therefore increasing their rank.

 

[Gemmysaur]

Shirou used Aias twice, once before UBW and another within UBW, btw.

Regardless, I can't see Ichigo taking longer than Gilgamesh who lasted so long because he can shoot his own sword rain. That and he was still thinking of how Shirou is undeserving of him using his best weapon to turn the guy into mince meat.

 

[Dat_Dot]

You guys also forgetting how long shirou can maintained UBW, Tracing, rho aias tbh..

 

[ScarletFirefly]

@Dot Yes he ran out of magic because Gilgamesh could keep up even though barely with his sword spam. Ichigo can't therefore the battle will be concluded earlier.

@William Probably, but that's more than enough. Battles on those speeds don't last long, unless you're in DragonBall where Namek is about to explode on the next episode (not really) -_-

 

[Ramesses_the_Sun_King]

It takes time to overload the weapons as broken phantasms so he can't spam that.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

It takes time to overload the weapons as broken phantasms so he can't spam that.

I forgot about the BP entirely, but yes it does take a bit.

 

[Dat_Dot]

I can't see Ichigo taking longer than Gilgamesh

I believe at that time gilgamesh lose his cool and become reckless IIRC

 

[ScarletFirefly]

I believe at that time gilgamesh lose his cool and become reckless IIRC

Gilgamesh lost his composure at the very last attacks. He was getting blocked effortlessly even before entering the UBW, that goes to show Shirou can project faster even outside UBW. Inside, it only gets worse.

 

[Blanked]

@Scarlet yeah (not always) still the thing is he fights someone who's more experienced than him and can somewhat deal with his sword spam.

Change my vote to Ichigo also because this assumes Shirou start with UBW without which he is done for as if he wouldn't even have time to make enough range after activating before Ichigo overpowers him. Plus Ichigo can spam getsuga so he throws getsuga directly at Shirou who uses rho aias to protect, but his back is vulnerable and here goes shunpuo and getsuga from behind.

 

[LordGinSama]

Ichigo: 8

Shirou: 8

 

[Ramesses_the_Sun_King]

Yes Gil lost his composure and would have killed Shirou if he regained it.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

@William Bruh the battle starts from max range. He has all the time he needs.

Also that Revy is disturbing.

 

[Dat_Dot]

Gilgamesh lost his composure at the very last attacks. He was getting blocked effortlessly even before entering the UBW, that goes to show Shirou can project faster even outside UBW. Inside, it only gets worse.

The fact is Gilgamesh with full ego and not take shirou seriously prior then lose his cool after,can survive the the fight inside UBW, and then peoples assume Ichigo can't is weird tbh...

 

[Blanked]

Yo, don't make me send her after you.

They start with that range but Shirou likes close combat as well so he likely would close some of the gap as well.

 

[LordGinSama]

Scarlet the fact that you used the word bruh makes me hope you step on something wet with socks on.

 

[Ramesses_the_Sun_King]

Ichigo doesn't have a nigh infinite treasury of conceptual weapons that each can one shot servants with firing rate compared to a gushing torrent of water. Seriously are you telling me that Ichigo during speed equalized will be able to block omnidirectional blade spam of 7-A weapons.

At that range Shirou can project Caladbolg II and straight up one shot. "But muh Shunpo" Tough luck Space twisting nuke that prevents teleporting exists.

 

[Dat_Dot]

Ichigo doesn't have a night infinite treasury of conceptual weapons that each can one shot servants with firing rate compared to a gushing torrent of water.

Again, shirou also doesn't have nigh infinite stamina to keep tracing and spaming the NP.

 

[Gemmysaur]

UBW makes Tracing costs moot when it's active.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

@William Please don't, she's actually insane.

@Knight Joke's on you, I don't wear socks.

@Dot He doesn't need to waste mana inside UBW. The weapons are already stored there, he merely calls them.

 

[Blanked]

@Ramses first you assume he is using UBW from start even thou that's not really his style if he doesn't know the enemy.

Two yeah it's infinite number of swords, but it's like what 10-20 swords at the time?

There is thing called adaptation, ones you see the very same moves dozens of times you get used to them and can easily track and read their movements combine that with everything Ichgo has and he won't have a lot of problems resisting 10-15 minutes before Shirou collapse from being over exhausted.

 

[Dat_Dot]

Even so, I believe shirou won't immediately use his strongest weapon.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

I'm just here to post the votes, correct any errors.

Ichigo (8): Phantasys ; Dat Dot ; WilliamShadow ; ScarletMoon1111 ; Newendigo ; Yomi Schwarz ; Aizenishere ; Omahariptic

Shirou (9): Promestein ; Gemmysaur ; ScarletFirefly ; Meosos ; Gargoyle One ; Damned Salvation ; TISSG7Redgrave ; BoomeYang ; Rin Rokudo

I dunno if Ramesses is voting.

 

[Ramesses_the_Sun_King]

No Gil can fire thousands when serious/pissed, Shirou still matched his fire rate. Ichigo dies to the first omnidirectional balde spam of a thousand swords.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Ichigo dies to the first omnidirectional balde spam of a thousand swords.

Does it even matter if it is a thousand, a hundred or a dozen? Ichigo still can't dodge them and will die to the first couple of barrages. The only thing that changes, is how many times he'll be skewered.

 

[Dat_Dot]

So many votes, man this thread getting attention like those Reinhards or BB thread lol, Impressive.

 

[Blanked]

Also, one second people.

We should all take Knight's example and make matches like this instead of 1 reason + FRA. Applause!