Izuku Midoriya vs Shirou Emiya: Battle for Humanity's Greatest Hero.

[The_Legendary_Vin]

Both combattant's normal speed are equalized in this fight. Meaning 100% Deku and Shirou both have equal speed

Problem is, Gearshift and Fa Jin MASSIVELY enhance Deku's speed to the point that he can blitz him completely and utterly

Yes, they do have equal speed, but Shirou also speed amps, I want to see the scaling chain that puts Deku directly over Shirou's amps from projection

Gáe Bolg: Barbed Spear that Pierces with Death and Gáe Bolg: Soaring Spear that Strikes with Death have 2 unique effects depending on the circumstance

Gáe Bolg: Barbed Spear that Pierces with Death is a melee attack that ignores causality to always strike an opponent's heart. Instead of following the usual laws of physics with "Launch the Attack" = cause and "Pierce someone's heart" as the effect, this attack reverses that order, so the opponent's heart is already ****** even before he launches the attack, therefore ignoring durability. It's a good insta kill against most single targets

Gáe Bolg: Soaring Spear that Strikes with Death is a ranged attack that DOESN'T ignore causality, and doesn't flip the regular order of events. Instead, it locks onto an opponent's heart like a homing attack, but the resulting hit is a massive explosion instead of a stab. Due to the attack's great speed, power, and homing nature, its extremely difficult to be blocked by someone with the same AP and durability, and it also can't be dodged since it just turns right around and hits you.

Arguing this, as I've said multiple times now, is Irrelevant, Shirou can use both by copying the spear directly

 

[Mickey1940]

Yes, they do have equal speed, but Shirou also speed amps, I want to see the scaling chain that puts Deku directly over Shirou's amps from projection

Arguing this, as I've said multiple times now, is Irrelevant, Shirou can use both by copying the spear directly

1. Shirou's speed amps aren't actually speed amps. His base movement speed is subsonic, with his reaction speed being FTL. His sword's flight/attack/reaction speed is between Relativistic to FTL, which is the same as Shirou's reaction speed
Reaction speed tends to be the factor that gets equalized here so it's not actually a speed amp at all, otherwise Shirou would stab someone millions of times over with his swords in every speed equalized match, which isn't how we treat his speed here

2. Sorry, I just wanted to address the conceptual/causality part of it

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Yes, they do have equal speed, but Shirou also speed amps, I want to see the scaling chain that puts Deku directly over Shirou's amps from projection

How much does Shirou speed amp.

Because Gearshift lets Deku statue someone with 2nd Gear. Then he gets faster with 3rd and Top Gear. Then again with Fa Jin.

Overdrive > Top Gear > 3rd Gear > 2nd Gear > Views as not moving > Base Deku

Also going by profiles, his speed does not get amped from projections higher than his own reactions like Deku’s does.

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

How much does Shirou speed amp.

Because Gearshift lets Deku statue someone with 2nd Gear. Then he gets faster with 3rd and Top Gear. Then again with Fa Jin.

Overdrive > Top Gear > 3rd Gear > 2nd Gear > Views as not moving > Base Deku

Also going by profiles, his speed does not get amped from projections higher than his own reactions like Deku’s does.

okay yeah no he's blitzing Shirou with that chain even with phantasm rank ups

Trying to hunt down the exact wiki point where it shows the stat amps, but here's some other things of note:

Due to the extra effort, it is possible to produce incredibly stable ordinary items that can remain in the world seemingly indefinitely after their creation, unless broken or dismissed.[6] Furthermore, whenever replicating mystical objects such as Noble Phantasms, it is possible to faithfully copy their special abilities and any skill that their owner performed is available for use.

Here's how UBW works with it (Directly wiki quote):

Outside of the Reality Marble, Shirou is barely able to keep up with Gilgamesh's assault while he was simply playing around with Shirou. But once within the confines of the Reality Marble, all of his weapons are produced and ready to attack, which means that the Gate of Babylon's slightly slower summoning rate allows Shirou to hone in on Gilgamesh to fight and defeat him at close range. He is unable to handle Shirou's attacks, which forces him to allow his own weapons to be destroyed in order to counter Shirou's projections, and Shirou even has time to instantly recognize Ea as Gilgamesh is drawing it and quickly chop off his arm before he can utilize it. Even with the advantages, he claims that Gilgamesh would win if he were to have time to regain his composure.

This is more of to show how fast he can project things with UBW compared to normal

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

As it turns out, Im apparently tripping balls, Shirou doesnt emulate physical parameters, only skill and abilities of the servant in question, also while digging, SHIROU CANT USE UBW

He could only use it with Rin supplying him Mana, and if we're not taking Avalon into account then he cant use that either, only projection/Reinforcement, which means he gets folded like a Napkin by Deku

 

[Fezzih_007]

SHIROU CANT USE UBW

He can do it in this battle, since we assume he gonna have mana to deploy UBW.

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

He can do it in this battle, since we assume he gonna have mana to deploy UBW.

Thats kinda dumb but okay, he shouldn't be able to use it on his own

Regardless, Shirou projects Gae Bolg; Deku gets made into a Causality (Pun sound exe)

He projects pretty much anything else: speedblitz goes brr without me unleashing my final form of wank

Deku apparently using Gearshift instantly wins more times out of ten, so changing vote to Deku

 

[Mickey1940]

As it turns out, Im apparently tripping balls, Shirou doesnt emulate physical parameters, only skill and abilities of the servant in question, also while digging, SHIROU CANT USE UBW

He could only use it with Rin supplying him Mana, and if we're not taking Avalon into account then he cant use that either, only projection/Reinforcement, which means he gets folded like a Napkin by Deku

If he didn't emulate physical parameters he wouldn't be able to block Gil's Gate of Babylon with his swords

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Shirou Emiya does have Reinforcement as a ability. That is canonically his thing from the start as well IIRC

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

If he didn't emulate physical parameters he wouldn't be able to block Gil's Gate of Babylon with his swords

UBW doesnt work via physical parameters, other than perhaps reaction speed, its literally just summoning them in the time it takes for Gil to summon his own weapons, plus its stated that Gil woulda made him into a donut if he had regained his composure

 

[HammerStrikes219]

UBW doesnt work via physical parameters, other than perhaps reaction speed, its literally just summoning them in the time it takes for Gil to summon his own weapons, plus its stated that Gil woulda made him into a donut if he had regained his composure

With Ea. Gil could finished him off with Ea. However, guess who got the kill on Gil? His future self and don’t forget in this route, Shirou outright confront and fight against his future self in UBW route IIRC

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

Shirou Emiya does have Reinforcement as a ability. That is canonically his thing from the start as well IIRC

Yeeee but its not servant level like I thought, I could PERHAPS make an argument around him getting Herc's death revive, or Archer's Mind's Eye, but nah its too much of a stretch

 

[HammerStrikes219]

This is in the anime though. Would have to check VN

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Yeah, apparently the same did happen in VN for Archer Emiya as Shirou did outright fight against him.

However, there was the fight against Herc (Different route though IIRC so not really relevant to this version of Shirou).

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

This is in the anime though. Would have to check VN

Ehhh saying Shirou was keeping up there is a bit of a stretch, which is what he'd need to do for that argument to really work

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Ehhh saying Shirou was keeping up there is a bit of a stretch, which is what he'd need to do for that argument to really work

Keep in mind, that is not the full fight as that was the start of the fight as well.

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Manage to find the full fight version

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

Manage to find the full fight version

Thats a feat to find

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Tbf, Archer Emiya did deployed his version of UBW against Shirou Emiya as well.

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Okay, so I find the visual novel version of the fight.





Didn’t seem like he deployed the UBW against Shirou Emiya otherwise he will fully chant.

 

[Mickey1940]

UBW doesnt work via physical parameters, other than perhaps reaction speed, its literally just summoning them in the time it takes for Gil to summon his own weapons, plus its stated that Gil woulda made him into a donut if he had regained his composure

no no you misunderstand

Shirou has to be able to match Gil's weapon-throwing power and speed, since Shirou was blocking Gil's weapons with his own by smacking them out of the air. If he didn't have comparable stats, Gil's weapons would just plow through Shirou's and he wouldn't be able to do anything

Not to mention, Shirou's striking strength is enough to slash of Gil's arm and would have bisected him if UBW didn't end early

UBW certainly doesn't make Shirou nearly as physically competent as, say, Artoria or Cu, but he's certainly still High 6C physically

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Bump.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Bump.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Well, because greenie here can speedblitz Shirou because of Gearshift and win because of it, this battle can't be added because of speed equalization rules.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

So who's voting for who on this?

 

[Smashtwig]

Bump

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Is this more fair after the buff that Deku got since I made this?

 

[Fezzih_007]

Is this more fair after the buff that Deku got since I made this?

No, Shirou still gets blitzed.

 

[Violetcyanide]

Is this more fair after the buff that Deku got since I made this?

This isn't possible

Shirou projections count as amps,meaning in equal speed.deku becomes subsonic(since base shirou only has subsonic combat speed) but with projection he becomes relativistic+,shirou stomps him here.

 

[AThe1412]

This isn't possible

Shirou projections count as amps,meaning in equal speed.deku becomes subsonic(since base shirou only has subsonic combat speed) but with projection he becomes relativistic+,shirou stomps him here.

Deku has amps too in the form of his quirk's normal physical abilities, Gearshift, and Fajin.

 

[Violetcyanide]

Deku has amps too in the form of his quirk's normal physical abilities, Gearshift, and Fajin.

Can any of them deal with a 1748060x speed amp?

Cause that's how much shirou is gonna amp himself the amount he traces a weapon,which is his first move.

 

[AThe1412]

Can any of them deal with a 1748060x speed amp?

Cause that's how much shirou is gonna amp himself the amount he traces a weapon,which is his first move.

Not a MHA supporter so I have no idea exactly how much Deku can amp. He goes from Supersonic to Sub-Relativistic and then there's the amps from Gearshift and Fajin which...

Because Gearshift lets Deku statue someone with 2nd Gear. Then he gets faster with 3rd and Top Gear. Then again with Fa Jin.

Overdrive > Top Gear > 3rd Gear > 2nd Gear > Views as not moving > Base Deku

Also going by profiles, his speed does not get amped from projections higher than his own reactions like Deku’s does.

 

[Violetcyanide]

Not a MHA supporter so I have no idea exactly how much Deku can amp. He goes from Supersonic to Sub-Relativistic and then there's the amps from Gearshift and Fajin which...

Actually he goes from high hypersonic+(mach 22.87) to sub-rel(Mach 17155.74) and couple blitzed which doesn't add anything until a calc is made.

Meanwhile shirou goes from baseline subsonic(mach 0.1) to just shy of sol(mach 874029) with 3x higher reaction speed

You tell me who is faster here?