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When will it be applied to profiles or do we have to wait longer?Bunp
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When will it be applied to profiles or do we have to wait longer?Bunp
It's all good, take your time man.Yeah, I'm sorry. I've been really busy with IRL stuff for the past couple of days. I'll comment as soon as I can.
No worries,sometimes stuff happens.Yeah, I'm sorry. I've been really busy with IRL stuff for the past couple of days. I'll comment as soon as I can.
So there's two jutsu that Shikamaru uses one is Shadow Possession Jutsu which is described as the following in the first databook and fourth.Shikamaru
Tier: 5-C with Shadow Possession Jutsu
Key: New Era
AP: Moon level with Shadow Possession Jutsu (Shikamaru's Shadow Possession Jutsu can crush the heads of people like Darui[1][Statistics Values 1])
Notes/Explanations
- ↑ 88.74 Exatons
References
- ↑ Shikamaru Shinden
So Zetsu's thing is the following from the databook.Zetsu
Tier: up to 5-C
AP: up to Moon level (Obito, while attached to Black Zetsu, was able to deflect Juubidara‘s Truth-Seeking Orbs[1]. Impaled Rinne-Sharingan Juubidara after catching him by surprise[2][Statistics Values 1])
SS: up to Moon level (Comparable to his Attack Potency)
Dura: up to Moon level (Can withstand the force of his own strikes[Statistics Values 2])
Notes/Explanations
References
Bro what exactly do you want? There is "up to moon level" in zetsu page while attached to obito body .I also kinda disagree with Black Zetsu's scaling it's not really big on my list but eh since I'm here.
So Zetsu's thing is the following from the databook.
Zetsu's ability is to manipulate the body and consciousness at will. So his stats should say it depends on the body he's attached to or up to moon level when using Obito's body or something.
His speed though is good since he moved faster than Minato though iirc.
I disagree with the following section.
So there's two jutsu that Shikamaru uses one is Shadow Possession Jutsu which is described as the following in the first databook and fourth.
The other jutsu is Suffocating Darkness, which is explained in the second databook below.
The key difference is one is endowed with physical strength while the other isn't.
Moving onto the evidence you use to justify Shikamaru is false since Shikamaru himself says he isn't capable of doing it when he actually tries to use Suforcating Darkness on a tree later on during the same novel.
Countering counter Arguments kinda idk.
Shikamaru holding the Gokage was in page 58-59 and he calls it Shadow Possession but as stated in the above scans only Suffocating Darkness would have an effect on physical objects not Shadow Posession.
He claims he hasn't used this jutsu in a long time in the above scans, but we know he used Shadow Possession during the Chunin exams against Momoshiki and Kinshiki, which this novel takes place after.
I feel like I'm forgetting something and I don't know what.
I'm not really sure this comparison works, with Sasuke and base Naruto I mean. Sasuke failed to harm Fused Momo in that instance, but it's not like Naruto managed to do so either. He just matched his AP. It works well enough to say that this makes base Naruto superior to Darui, though, since Momo's AP wrecked his ass. But Sasuke didn't interact with Momo in terms of AP here, so I don't find this justification the best. I think you should just mention that he briefly matched Momoshiki, which makes him superior to Darui.Moon level (Performs better against Fused Momoshiki than Sasuke[14][15] or Darui, and while Naruto is ultimately overpowered, this still suggests is base level of power is comparable to people like Sasuke and Darui[Statistics Values 16])
I feel like it'd be worth mentioning here that his Chō Ōdama Rasengan was able to one-shot both Fused Momoshiki and Delta.Moon level+ with Rasengan Variants (Naruto can utilize Rasengan Barrage and other powerful Rasengan variants in tandem with Kurama Six Paths Sage Mode to boost his power over 2x[Statistics Values 19])
Question. Are you sort of including the Kurama Avatar with "Kurama Six Paths Sage Mode"? If so, then I think you should include the fact that it's considered Naruto's full power somewhere. It's also the main reason for him scaling above the 2x Rasengan variant stuff. That's not super relevant for Adult Nard since he scales to 2x his base via Fused Momo scaling regardless, but it's a nice piece of support, and could be relevant for Naruto's previous versions.
So, sorry, I know this ain't New Era, but I do have an argument I want to share for base Sasuke.At least Island level (Stronger than before[Statistics Values 1])
Just out of curiosity, is there a reason you didn't include these feats for Sasuke? At the least, I feel like his Kusanagi Blade and Ninjutsu should scale to SPSM Naruto's tier, which would be consistent with both their previous keys, and also their portrayal as rivals overall.Moon level (Fought Kinshiki[10][11][Statistics Values 9]), higher with Susano'o (As Naruto's equal[12][13][14][15], his avatar state should be equivalent to Naruto's[Statistics Values 10])
Okay, so the first bit goes for both Momo and Kin.Moon level (Sasuke confirms that Kaguya's power alone wasn't enough to combat Momoshiki[1][2][3][4], drew blood from base Naruto[5][Statistics Values 1]), higher with Chakra Pills (Chakra pills provide an amplification[6])
You can tweak that wording however you like, but the point is that nothing in those scans really confirms or indicates that Kaguya feared these guys individually. All of the statements refer to them as a duo. This also makes more sense with the fact that Adult Naruto and Sasuke still consider Kaguya a formidable opponent, and the whole reason they even considered the duo's arrival a threat was the potential of them being threats to her in the first place.Sasuke hypothesized, and then confirmed, that Kaguya feared and prepared for the arrival of Momoshiki and Kinshiki, which indicates that they should be comparable to her at the very least.
Ngl, I'm not seeing at all how Shikamaru implies that Isshiki being stronger than Code is uncertain. Is it just his usage of the word "should"? The thing is, Shikamaru is not an authority on any of these people's powers in the first place. He doesn't know how powerful either of them actually are. The only things he really knows for sure is that Jigen defeated NaruSasu, Isshiki's stronger than Jigen (and also beat NaruSasu), and that Code's power surpasses Jigen's. I don't think he's in any position to be an authority on Isshiki vs Code IMO.
So a couple of things.Jigen/Isshiki
Ehhhhh, I'm honestly iffy about this being used to scale Jigen above the MAS. There's no reason to assume Koji even knows about the MAS, and given the fact that Naruto and Sasuke already pushed Jigen to his absolute limit and had moments where they seemed to be genuine threats to him, somewhat survive his attacks, etc, makes me a bit doubtful about Jigen being above the MAS. Much like Shikamaru, Koji isn't an authority on Naruto and Sasuke, and he was mostly hypothesizing here.and Koji doesn't believe that Naruto and Sasuke working together would have anything more than minimal chances of defeating Jigen[4], which would imply that Jigen's full power is beyond the full power of Naruto and Sasuke
SS: Moon level (Comparable to his Attack Potency), Moon level+ with Kāma (Comparable to his Attack Potency), Small Planet level with Ōtsutsuki Form (Comparable to his Attack Potency)
Dura: Moon level+ (Took a kick from Post-Polar Particles Kurama Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto[15][Statistics Values 5]), higher with Kāma (Blocks attacks from Kurama Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto and Sasuke), Small Planet level with Ōtsutsuki Form (It's heavily implied that nothing Sasuke or Naruto could do would give them sufficient odds at defeating Jigen's full power[Statistics Values 6])
I can replace Sasuke with Darui here ig.I'm not really sure this comparison works, with Sasuke and base Naruto I mean. Sasuke failed to harm Fused Momo in that instance, but it's not like Naruto managed to do so either. He just matched his AP. It works well enough to say that this makes base Naruto superior to Darui, though, since Momo's AP wrecked his ass. But Sasuke didn't interact with Momo in terms of AP here, so I don't find this justification the best. I think you should just mention that he briefly matched Momoshiki, which makes him superior to Darui.
I was just trying not to overclutter the profile, hence I really only included his multipliers, but if you wanna edit that into the sandbox sure.I feel like it'd be worth mentioning here that his Chō Ōdama Rasengan was able to one-shot both Fused Momoshiki and Delta.
Yes.Question. Are you sort of including the Kurama Avatar with "Kurama Six Paths Sage Mode"? If so, then I think you should include the fact that it's considered Naruto's full power somewhere. It's also the main reason for him scaling above the 2x Rasengan variant stuff. That's not super relevant for Adult Nard since he scales to 2x his base via Fused Momo scaling regardless, but it's a nice piece of support, and could be relevant for Naruto's previous versions.
Ngl idrc care, it's up to others, if you wanna type out the on profile justification for it sure.So, sorry, I know this ain't New Era, but I do have an argument I want to share for base Sasuke.
Basically, I want to propose that he's rated as "At least 6-C, likely 5-C" for him. "possibly 5-C" or "at most 5-C" would work, too. Whichever ya'll think works best ig.
So, the argument is just simply the fact that Sasuke received a flat chakra amp from Hagoromo. Basically he got a ton of chakra, and was greatly empowered. We've seen this a million times in the series. Chakra amps such as those never really enhanced one attribute to such a ridiculous degree, without touching the other ones.
I feel like Sage Mode's a good bench mark example, as it amps absolutely everything. Same with the curse mark. Bijuu chakra. Just, any chakra amp I could personally think of doesn't really behave like that for the most part. Now there are techniques that specifically amp certain attributes like shunshin amping speed, Rasengan amping AP, or Iron Spear amping durability. But just regular ass chakra amps turning someone into a brick wall or glass canon? I can't think of too many instances of that happening personally.
Honestly, this alone wouldn't have made me bring this up. What prompted me to make this argument is just the fact that Sasuke was not a brick wall prior to the Six Paths amp, and more importantly, he was definitely not one after receiving it either. We can clearly see that he can harm those capable of harming him. Now, yes, he's greatly weakened here, but it wouldn't make much sense for his durability to drop massively more than his physical strength/AP, certainly not by millions of times or whatever the difference is. Like, it's possible I guess, but it would just be super strange.
I dunno, maybe this is all just me, but it's just what I think atm.
First, knocking some around without dealing damage is lifting strength not AP. Second, all the Jigen stuff is like Sasuke off guarding him and dealing 0 damage. Hence they weren't included.Just out of curiosity, is there a reason you didn't include these feats for Sasuke? At the least, I feel like his Kusanagi Blade and Ninjutsu should scale to SPSM Naruto's tier, which would be consistent with both their previous keys, and also their portrayal as rivals overall.
Hence why I said he posits it, I'm not claiming it's word of god. Nevertheless there can be some potential narrative intent there, as the way Ikemoto provides information to the reader is through dialogue. Regardless it doesn't affect his rating so idc if it gets deleted or not.Ngl, I'm not seeing at all how Shikamaru implies that Isshiki being stronger than Code is uncertain. Is it just his usage of the word "should"? The thing is, Shikamaru is not an authority on any of these people's powers in the first place. He doesn't know how powerful either of them actually are. The only things he really knows for sure is that Jigen defeated NaruSasu, Isshiki's stronger than Jigen (and also beat NaruSasu), and that Code's power surpasses Jigen's. I don't think he's in any position to be an authority on Isshiki vs Code IMO.
Given Koji gets his information from Amado, and Amado would logically be aware of their capabilities through research. I think it's fine.Ehhhhh, I'm honestly iffy about this being used to scale Jigen above the MAS. There's no reason to assume Koji even knows about the MAS, and given the fact that Naruto and Sasuke already pushed Jigen to his absolute limit and had moments where they seemed to be genuine threats to him, somewhat survive his attacks, etc, makes me a bit doubtful about Jigen being above the MAS. Much like Shikamaru, Koji isn't an authority on Naruto and Sasuke, and he was mostly hypothesizing here.
Isshiki scaling above the MAS if totally valid, though. I feel like his statements are a bit more solid and straightforward imo.
Naw the scans are in the AP section, too lazy to double post scans.I think you forgot to give Isshiki SS and Dura sections lmao
Aight do you agree or disagree with the polar particles amp rn tho? or do you have no stanceThe current discourse regarding Shikamaru is one I agree with. I think his AP should be massively downgraded.
I'm a bit pressed for time rn and really tired, so I'll respond to KT later. I'll try to do it tomorrow, but no promises.
I also wanted to talk about Shin, but again, kinda pressed atm. So I'll either talk about him when I address KT, or maybe I'll just save it for that High 6-A thread, we shall see.
I'm still gonna do a bit of research into a few things, but for the time being, I agree with the amp.do you agree or disagree with the polar particles amp rn tho? or do you have no stance
Not all of them are related to just sending some aliens flyingFirst, knocking some around without dealing damage is lifting strength not AP. Second, all the Jigen stuff is like Sasuke off guarding him and dealing 0 damage. Hence they weren't included.
So, sorry, I know this ain't New Era, but I do have an argument I want to share for base Sasuke.
Basically, I want to propose that he's rated as "At least 6-C, likely 5-C" for him. "possibly 5-C" or "at most 5-C" would work, too. Whichever ya'll think works best ig.
I can agree with a ‘likely 5-C‘ for P2 Sasuke’s physicals.Ngl idrc care, it's up to others, if you wanna type out the on profile justification for it sure.
Wow, and I thought "we're gonna find a new 5-B calc" was optimistic.Ya'll gon' be real stressed when Kishimoto puts all of his high universe stats into the Boruto manga (which he already hinted at w/ higher transcending characters and allat mumbo jumbo). Most of this will likely be reverted and buffed by the end of 2024.
So me thinking momoshiki memories is gonna start flowing into boruto and he's gonna see into the past which is gonna come with some ridiculous feats for momoshiki is like too hopeful?Wow, and I thought "we're gonna find a new 5-B calc" was optimistic.
Sounds great.I can replace Sasuke with Darui here ig.
Clutter is kinda unavoidable with Nard, dude has a lot going on no matter what. I think this bit's pretty relevant tho. Him being to one-shot physical rivals with an attack is a big deal imo.I was just trying not to overclutter the profile, hence I really only included his multipliers, but if you wanna edit that into the sandbox sure.
So you agree with adding that bit to the justification...?Yes.
Same thing as above, I can do it, just not now.Ngl idrc care, it's up to others, if you wanna type out the on profile justification for it sure.
It honestly feels like you skimmed through that album I sent. It has more examples than him sending others flying, as others like Sparkle and Lightning have mentioned earlier. Sasuke has a lot of higher end portrayal and feats.First, knocking some around without dealing damage is lifting strength not AP. Second, all the Jigen stuff is like Sasuke off guarding him and dealing 0 damage. Hence they weren't included.
Okay, sure, but I don't agree with your conclusion regarding the "intent" there either. I don't think the point of that piece of dialogue was to throw doubt regarding Isshiki's superiority to Code, I think the intent is to reinforce that idea if nothing else.Hence why I said he posits it, I'm not claiming it's word of god. Nevertheless there can be some potential narrative intent there, as the way Ikemoto provides information to the reader is through dialogue. Regardless it doesn't affect his rating so idc if it gets deleted or not.
Meh, I don't fully agree, but tbh I don't care enough about this rn to debate it further.Given Koji gets his information from Amado, and Amado would logically be aware of their capabilities through research. I think it's fine.
No, Arc. Like, Isshiki doesn't have a SS and durability section AT ALL, lol.Naw the scans are in the AP section, too lazy to double post scans.
These bits belong in the P&A section if I'm not mistaken. I think it was decided a while back that Dura Neg and Immortality/Regen stuff should no longer be put in the AP or Dura sections anymore.Black Rods ignores conventional durability to an extent
Tbh, I still disagree with Koji scaling this high, for essentially the same reasons that were brought up in the last Koji thread by Nierre and others, but it's whatever. If everyone's okay with it, I can live with it for now.likely Moon level+ with Sage Mode (Koji believes he can combat Delta[5] and briefly fought with Isshiki, albeit ultimately lost[6]. This should imply that Koji's peak strength is likely around the level of other powerful cyborgs like Delta, which is consistent with the fact that Amado created Koji to take down Jigen[7][Statistics Values 2])
Regarding Shin using his MS ability to have Sasuke's sword stab through SPSM KCM Naruto, I'm not entirely sure this works.
Respectfully, I think I disagree with your interpretation here.We don't accept having twice the chakra in your body meaning you're twice as strong. I'm pretty sure we accept the contrary.
On top of that, no.
The particles aren't meant to amp power in your body. They're meant to temporarily drastically increase the chakra in the body in order to expand the chakra pathway system's size and chakra flow, badly damaging the user (if they have large amounts of chakra, just like from how much chakra is there.
Also, his chakra didn't double from his previous full health state. His chakra doubled from his sickly struggling to use chakra state when his Keirakukei was closing off and it brought him back to his regular health.
AKA he doesn't need a new key, and him + Hagoromo wouldn't get a "doubled" value with them as if they're an amp, cause they aren't.
I assume you're referring to this here scan? Normally, I'd agree with your conclusion regarding this, but I don't think this is how it works for Juubi Jins.We don't accept a Jinchuriki scaling to a bijuu's power added to their own. Unless you mean Hagoromo with the juubi's chakra, which still contradicts that as it'd just be him replacing his chakra with the juubi's.
Unless bro merged with him on some Momoshiki Kinshiki timing, then nada
@UchihaSlayer96 i need youAight, this is the sequel to yesterday's post.
Sounds great.
Clutter is kinda unavoidable with Nard, dude has a lot going on no matter what. I think this bit's pretty relevant tho. Him being to one-shot physical rivals with an attack is a big deal imo.
Won't be able to make edits anytime soon, but if you don't mind waiting, I can do it later.
So you agree with adding that bit to the justification...?
Same thing as above, I can do it, just not now.
It honestly feels like you skimmed through that album I sent. It has more examples than him sending others flying, as others like Sparkle and Lightning have mentioned earlier. Sasuke has a lot of higher end portrayal and feats.
Okay, sure, but I don't agree with your conclusion regarding the "intent" there either. I don't think the point of that piece of dialogue was to throw doubt regarding Isshiki's superiority to Code, I think the intent is to reinforce that idea if nothing else.
Meh, I don't fully agree, but tbh I don't care enough about this rn to debate it further.
No, Arc. Like, Isshiki doesn't have a SS and durability section AT ALL, lol.
Also, speaking of Jigen/Isshiki...
These bits belong in the P&A section if I'm not mistaken. I think it was decided a while back that Dura Neg and Immortality/Regen stuff should no longer be put in the AP or Dura sections anymore.
Tbh, I still disagree with Koji scaling this high, for essentially the same reasons that were brought up in the last Koji thread by Nierre and others, but it's whatever. If everyone's okay with it, I can live with it for now.
Regarding Shin using his MS ability to have Sasuke's sword stab through SPSM KCM Naruto, I'm not entirely sure this works.
Firstly, regarding Kurama's statement, it was only about Naruto's battle senses being dulled through inactivity. He's basically saying he should've seen that attack coming. That really shouldn't have any impact on Naruto's durability or AP, especially not one that's mainly facilitated through Kurama's chakra cloak and SPSM.
Secondly, Naruto being off-guard here shouldn't matter in my opinion. KCM essentially puts armor around Naruto in the form of a chakra cloak, him being on or off-guard shouldn't really impact the cloak's durability, and it never has to my knowledge. These cloaks have also been shown to be pretty resistant to cutting and piercing attacks many times, even when people were somewhat caught off-guard. The same thing could be said for Sage Mode. There's more examples I can bring up, but I'm lazy, and I'm sure you get my point by now.
So yeah, I still think Shin should scale with his MS controlled weapons. We can discuss how that affects Sakura later.
But yeah, I think this is pretty much everything I wanted to say regarding the Sandbox.
Now it's KT's turn.
Respectfully, I think I disagree with your interpretation here.
Naruto and Hagoromo's "sick states" don't have any less chakra than normal. In fact, they're perfectly healthy for the most part, and the amount of chakra they possess is the same. The only issue is that their chakra channels are clogged, rendering them unable to use chakra because it simply cannot flow through their body.
All the Ultra Particles do is amplify their existing chakra so much that it kinda forcibly unclogs their pathways and returns them back to normal. Kinda like increasing the pressure through a clogged pipe to unblock it. We know from this scan that the increase is around 2x, and we know from this other scan that the particles do provide a permanent boost to the recipient's power.
Like, this isn't something I actually care about if I'm being honest. I wasn't even aware of these particles until pretty recently, so it's not like I'm super invested in this topic. It's just that when looking at the evidence, I don't think your interpretation makes a lot of sense personally.
I assume you're referring to this here scan? Normally, I'd agree with your conclusion regarding this, but I don't think this is how it works for Juubi Jins.
Lemme give you an example.
Remember how SPSM Naruto was stated to be stronger than his previous Kurama Mode, and was shown to be relative to Madara? Aight, cool. SPSM + KCM Naruto is also on this level, obviously, but like a bit stronger since he competed with stronger versions of Madara. I think this is all stuff we can agree on.
So my thinking is that none of this would make sense if Juubi Jins functioned like normal Jins. If he was replacing his current chakra with that of the other Bijuu inside him, he'd end up being far weaker than Madara, since Madara had far more of those Bijuu's chakra. It's obvious that Naruto's using all of his chakra, and also amping it with his Bijuu chakra on top. Otherwise, there really would be no point to him using KCM at that point. He doesn't even need it to access the individual Bijuu's abilities.
Same thing could be said for Madara. He underwent a couple of amps, which wouldn't make sense if he didn't really use his total available power, and was simply just replacing it with the Juubi's power, which would be static.
We also sort of see this concept in action with Sasuke's Gedo Susano'o. Him absorbing the 9 Bijuu's chakra (essentially recreating the Juubi's chakra) massively amped the power of the Susano'o, which wouldn't work if he was, like, replacing the Susano'o original power with the Bijuu's or something (because he overpowered Naruto, who's beyond the Juubi on its own at that point). It's also worth noting that Kurama stated that what Sasuke did here was the exact opposite of what Hagoromo did in the past, meaning that prior to dispersing the Juubi's chakra within him, Hagoromo was conceptually similar to the Gedo Susano'o. It's probably why Kurama knew that the Susano'o that'd emerge would be something incredible.
Also, like, yeah I actually think they are merging with the Juubi tbh. It's clearly very unlike any other Bijuu/Jinchuriki relationship. It literally alters their physical make-up and appearance. Their skin becomes very similar to the Ten-Tails' hide. They literally physically absorb the damn thing. And it was repeatedly described as the Jinchuriki making the Juubi's power their own. And this was obviously likened to Hagoromo many times as well.
So yeah, I still think Juubi Jin Hagoromo should scale to 177 Exatons, personally.
I've more or less said all I wanted to say here. Probably won't comment here again for a little while. I guess ping me again if I'm really needed or sumn.
So off guard is an appropriate use for that but not this one? Seems kinda sus and biased if you scaling shin offguarding Naruto and Co but not scaling Kid Shin.He was injured, fatigued, and offguard
Shin doesn't have a chakra cloak actively surrounding his body at all times, and Sasuke wasn't offguard when Shin's shuriken pierced himSo off guard is an appropriate use for that but not this one? Seems kinda sus and biased if you scaling shin offguarding Naruto and Co but not scaling Kid Shin.
That "Avatar head thing" is way stronger than mostly anything Naruto has. It's the Jinchuuriki equivalent of a partial Susano'o.If we scaling Shin what about kid Shin managing to hurt Shin in MS and such?
Also Shin couldn't penetrate Naruto's avatar head thing as shown below.
Also isn't caught off guard a thing in naruto? Just some examples I could find.
Kid Shin is just a Shin clone, he should be comparable to his "dad". We just don't talk about those clones because they don't have profiles, so they're irrelevant.So off guard is an appropriate use for that but not this one? Seems kinda sus and biased if you scaling shin offguarding Naruto and Co but not scaling Kid Shin.
Noone made a claim of him having a chakra cloak surrounding his body at all times but hey lets use that logic for the next bit you said.Shin doesn't have a chakra cloak actively surrounding his body at all times,
Sasuke doesn't have a chakra cloak surrounding his body at all times when he threw himself onto his daughter to protect her and it's not like he stated that he was lacking on the chakra and eye powers.and Sasuke wasn't offguard when Shin's shuriken pierced him
He mentioned injured, fatigued and off guard and you went ahead and took only the last part to suit you? Besides shin doesn't have a chakra cloak actively protecting himSo off guard is an appropriate use for that but not this one? Seems kinda sus and biased if you scaling shin offguarding Naruto and Co but not scaling Kid Shin.
So comparable in stats to OG Shin okay? Also why not make a profile/tab on the Shin character page for them?Kid Shin is just a Shin clone, he should be comparable to his "dad". We just don't talk about those clones because they don't have profiles, so they're irrelevant.
Also you do realize that Shin had every bone in his body crushed by the Susano'o at that point, right?
Well shit I'll also use the fatigued too since guess what Sasuke was during the fight before that?He mentioned injured, fatigued and off guard and you went ahead and took only the last part to suit you? Besides shin doesn't have a chakra cloak actively protecting him
Ok, that's two out of three.Well shit I'll also use the fatigued too since guess what Sasuke was during the fight before that?
So comparable in stats to OG Shin okay? Also why not make a profile/tab on the Shin character page for them?
So why couldn't someone comparable to OG Shin manage to hurt a Naruto who wasn't using a chakra cloak who only grabbed the blade when their MS were active and proceeded to call out they stronger then OG Shin?