Root changes and possible High 1-A upgrade

[BasedNecoScaler69]

「　」 [Others]
If you really wished to pronounce this term, call it "Kara".
Its meaning varied depending on each individual's understanding. To put it in simple terms, it was the Spiral of Origin.
However, since the Spiral of Origin was called the Spiral of Origin, it was no longer ' '.
To properly express this term was a source of headache during the production of the drama CDs.

Basically any mention of the root that isnt「　」or "Kara" isn't the true structure,but has a very similar concept.
Each individual has a different concept on what「　」is .
The sub-concepts that are being attributed to 「　」　, but are not truly「　」 are already accepted as 1-A, so automatically, 「　」 should be scaled above this, since it is above all possible human logic and definition that could be used to describe it.
Any mention of 「　」 cannot be the exact same concept, because「　」is meant to be emptiness, and therefore lacks a proper name and description. Any concept in the nasuverse is automatically a part of 「　」
Because of this fact that "「　」" is infinitely above all concepts in the nasuverse, I believe its rating should be changed from 1-A to High 1-A.

Agree: Strife304, Tdjwo
Disagree:

Theoretical,1Nairove​

Neutral:

Maxeez​

​

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

I can smell the controversy from a mile away

 

[1Nairove]

A lot can be said about this subject, what exactly is the proof that these concepts are in an infinite amount in the first place? or what is the proof that all concepts are more than all nasuverse like root?

 

[Tdjwo]

what exactly is the proof that these concepts are in an infinite amount in the first place? or what is the proof that all concepts are more than all nasuverse like root?

Concepts are infinitely layered in the Nasuverse

 

[Strife304]

Absolute madness, I agree.

 

[Tdjwo]

Are concepts even allowed on this site to upgrade a verse?

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Each individual has a different concept on what「　」is .
Because of this basically confirming theres an infinite amount of "「　」" like concepts and the fact that "「　」" is infinitely above all concepts in the nasuverse, I believe its rating should be changed from 1-A to 1-A+.

This is bad people don't have a different concept of [] they have different views of how [] is described but any view of that is not [] so [] exists beyond that
[] is the one that's accepted to be 1-A its the fundamental reason for that [] is [] it cannot be infinitely layered if it was anything other than [] like descriptions this can work but it doesn't work for [] because it can't be layered the idea that [] can be layered contradicts what [] is

Only descriptions would apply to it being layered anything other than [] are those descriptions not [] itself

I disagree it's not 1-A+ atleast not that with this reason

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Are concepts even allowed on this site to upgrade a verse?

Sometimes yes, but pretty much 「　」 is based on the real life Akashic records

are a compendium of all universal events, thoughts, words, emotions and intent ever to have occurred in the past, present, or future in terms of all entities and life forms, not just human

 

[1Nairove]

Nasuverse'de kavramlar sonsuz katmanlıdır

But is there evidence that these concepts will scale into the origin spiral? for example, can all these concepts be assumed as 1A?

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

This is bad people don't have a different concept of [] they have different views of how [] is described but any view of that is not [] so [] exists beyond that
[] is the one that's accepted to be 1-A its the fundamental reason for that [] is [] it cannot be infinitely layered if it was anything other than [] like descriptions this can work but it doesn't work for [] because it can't be layered the idea that [] can be layered contradicts what [] is

Only descriptions would apply to it being layered anything other than [] are those descriptions not [] itself

I disagree it's not 1-A+ atleast not that with this reason

Spiral of Origin and Swirl of the root are accepted as 1-A

 

[Tdjwo]

Spiral of Origin and Swirl of the root are accepted as 1-A

They are the same thing.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

They are the same thing.

Thats what this thread is talking about, they are similar concepts, but not the same thing. Nasu confirms this in the quote i listed in the op

 

[1Nairove]

Anyway, I disagree either, but maybe it can take a specific layer instead of 1A+ like 1A^2

 

[Tdjwo]

ElbetteBut is there evidence that these concepts will scale into the origin spiral? for example, can all these concepts be assumed as 1A?

The scan I sent claimed concepts in their primordial existence reached the root. SO yeah, they should be 1A.

I remembered Theoretical scaling concepts to 1A but idk if his mind has changed cuz he considered spiral of origin High1A and true emptiness tier 0.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Anyway, I disagree either, but maybe it can take a specific layer instead of 1A+ like 1A^2

they are 2 infinities, 1A squared would still be 1-A+, im not talking about high 1-a if thats what you think

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Spiral of Origin and Swirl of the root are accepted as 1-A

The term spiral of origin and swirl of the root in the wiki are used synonymously with [], spiral of origin refers to it but only an attempt at the characters to conceive of it

There's no description that alone makes the root 1-A in the wiki, it was primarily accepted to be 1-A because of it being above dimensions with the supporting evidence of negative theology which [] represents meaning [] itself is thought of as 1-A you can't layer [] because it contradicts what [] is

[] is a symbol of the ineffability thesis attesting for the idea that God cannot be spoken of if we talk ab [] we disregard the characters view ab the the spiral of origin because [] already exists beyond those views

And [] is already accepted as 1-A and cannot be layered into itself because it contradicts what [] is

You could've done better to upgrade the root this is just made in jest, I still disagree

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Though i believe there is room for argument for H1-A, but that and tier 0 give me brain rot

 

[1Nairove]

they are 2 infinities, 1A squared would still be 1-A+, im not talking about high 1-a if thats what you think

I don't know, it seems inconsistent to me, but if there is a knowledgeable nasu fan who accepts it, I will accept it and either an admin

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

The term spiral of origin and swirl of the root in the wiki are used synonymously with [], spiral of origin refers to it but only an attempt at the characters to conceive of it

There's no description that alone makes the root 1-A in the wiki, it was primarily accepted to be 1-A because of it being above dimensions with the supporting evidence of negative theology which [] represents meaning [] itself is thought of as 1-A you can't layer [] because it contradicts what [] is

[] is a symbol of the ineffability thesis attesting for the idea that God cannot be spoken of if we talk ab [] we disregard the characters view ab the the spiral of origin because [] already exists beyond those views

And [] is already accepted as 1-A and cannot be layered into itself because it contradicts what [] is

You could've done better to upgrade the root this is just made in jest, I still disagree

Did you even read the op? Nasu flat out states that they arent the same thing

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

the moment you refer to " 「　」" as anything but "「　」", you are no longer talking about the same thing, most of the scans to prove 1-A arent talking about "「　」" either

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

I don't know, it seems inconsistent to me, but if there is a knowledgeable nasu fan who accepts it, I will accept it and either an admin

so you're neutral or disagree?

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

I remembered Theoretical scaling concepts to 1A but idk if his mind has changed

There no crt made for that because I'm lazy it's not like I changed my mind it just can't be used here

but idk if his mind has changed cuz he considered spiral of origin High1A and true emptiness tier 0

For different reasons certainly not this those reasons being that the infinity that the spiral of origin exemplifies is distinguished from the infinities of reality which are recursively stacked the scan used non Euclidean geometry to make an example of that in non Euclidean geometry hyperbolic geometry for any dimension x its infinity and the next dimension is infinity^infinity this idea carries on from the first dimension to 1-A+ where high 1-A it becomes different all those stackings of such infinities can't reach high 1-A Euclidean geometry works in a similar fashion too but uses the real number line to describe the stacking of infinity for any dimension and higher dimension

Therefore the root being distinguished from those infinities would make it 1-A the reason is very distinct from what's being presented here I'm just lazy to make the crt

 

[Tdjwo]

The way I interpret this scan is more of it being an absolute/inaccessible definition rather than it being infinitely layered. Look at the description again;

「　」 [Others]
If you really wished to pronounce this term, call it "Kara".
Its meaning varied depending on each individual's understanding. To put it in simple terms, it was the Spiral of Origin.
However, since the Spiral of Origin was called the Spiral of Origin, it was no longer ' '.
To properly express this term was a source of headache during the production of the drama CDs.

It claims every meaning varies depending on an individual's understanding. In order words, none of the definitions are completely wrong neither are they correct when they describe the root and this is because the root is beyond definition and can only be described by negation. So the "real" definition of the root(if there's any), would always have an absolute transcendence above any concepts and definition of what other people think 1A root is. In order words, this implies the root to be High 1A instead of 1A+

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

the moment you refer to " 「　」" as anything but "「　」", you are no longer talking about the same thing, most of the scans to prove 1-A arent talking about "「　」" either

Most of the scans to prove it being 1-A aren't 1-A on their own if you read the 1-A crt the thing that solidified the root being 1-A in the wiki is []

 

[1Nairove]

the moment you refer to " 「　」" as anything but "「　」", you are no longer talking about the same thing, most of the scans to prove 1-A arent talking about "「　」" either

you can ask paul to comment on the matter, if he agrees (I doubt he will, but at least try) I'm sure most people will agree

 

[Tdjwo]

There no crt made for that because I'm lazy it's not like I changed my mind it just can't be used here

For different reasons certainly not this those reasons being that the infinity that the spiral of origin exemplifies is distinguished from the infinities of reality which are recursively stacked the scan used non Euclidean geometry to make an example of that in non Euclidean geometry hyperbolic geometry for any dimension x its infinity and the next dimension is infinity^infinity this idea carries on from the first dimension to 1-A+ where high 1-A it becomes different all those stackings of such infinities can't reach high 1-A Euclidean geometry works in a similar fashion too but uses the real number line to describe the stacking of infinity for any dimension and higher dimension

Therefore the root being distinguished from those infinities would make it 1-A the reason is very distinct from what's being presented here I'm just lazy to make the crt

Then stop being lazy and ,ake the CRT already

 

[1Nairove]

so you're neutral or disagree?

disagree

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

The way I interpret this scan is more of it being an absolute/inaccessible definition rather than it being infinitely layered. Look at the description again;


It claims every meaning varies depending on an individual's understanding. In order words, none of the definitions are completely wrong neither are they correct when they describe the root and this is because the root is beyond definition and can only be described by negation. So the "real" definition of the root(if there's any), would always have an absolute transcendence above any concepts and definition of what other people think 1A root is. In order words, this implies the root to be High 1A instead of 1A+

thats what i thought, though my knowledge of h1-a is basic

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

The way I interpret this scan is more of it being an absolute/inaccessible definition rather than it being infinitely layered. Look at the description again;

Still doesn't work negative theology is only accepted as 1-A without further context ultima tried to make it high 1-A which would make sense but it was rejected

It claims every meaning varies depending on an individual's understanding. In order words, none of the definitions are completely wrong neither are they correct when they describe the root and this is because the root is beyond definition and can only be described by negation

No the descriptions are wrong because you can't speak about God the descriptions would only serve to make an example of God existing beyond those definitions

The definitions are completely wrong [] cannot be spoken of that's what it is, to say the definitions aren't completely wrong is to say God can be spoken of which would contradict []

This crt just doesn't you can all just make a new one with a better reason than this

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Then stop being lazy and ,ake the CRT already

Fine not today tho somewhere around this week sounds better

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Still doesn't work negative theology is only accepted as 1-A without further context ultima tried to make it high 1-A which would make sense but it was rejected

No the descriptions are wrong because you can't speak about God the descriptions would only serve to make an example of God existing beyond those definitions

The definitions are completely wrong [] cannot be spoken of that's what it is, to say the definitions aren't completely wrong is to say God can be spoken of which would contradict []

This crt just doesn't you can all just make a new one with a better reason than this

「　」 isnt spoken of as 「　」by pretty much everyone except shiki's void personality. Also, them being different concepts would not contradict 「　」not being able to be spoken, as what most characters are talking about is not 「　」, but as a different name

 

[Comicgyal]

Disagree FRA.

 

[Tdjwo]

I'm neutral on the crt only because I'm still uncertain whether concepts can be allowed to upgrade the root. If it is, then I'm still neutral because I think the scan doesn't really solidify 1 A+ and IMO, there seems to be a clear difference between Swirl of the root, True emptiness and Akashic records with one being higher than the other

Fine not today tho somewhere around this week sounds better

Nice. What tier are you targeting? High 1A or 0? I planned on doing 0 before using the scans you gathered but I thought that would be disrespectful.

Still doesn't work negative theology is only accepted as 1-A without further context ultima tried to make it high 1-A which would make sense but it was rejected

What I meant was that if concepts were truly 1A and each one of them had different definitions that could never comprehend the root, wouldn't that make the root Higher than them which means it would be at least High 1A?

No the descriptions are wrong because you can't speak about God the descriptions would only serve to make an example of God existing beyond those definitions

The definitions are completely wrong [] cannot be spoken of that's what it is, to say the definitions aren't completely wrong is to say God can be spoken of which would contradict []

I agree. Which is why I claimed the "real" definition of root is a whole tier higher than what each person conceives the already accepted 1A root as. This site accepted 1A root based on it being above dimensional theories(even if that's just akashic records being mistakened for root). So if we accept the basic understanding of the root as a 1A tier, then the "real"/inconceivable" definition of root would be High 1A.

This crt just doesn't you can all just make a new one with a better reason than this

I agree.

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Nice. What tier are you targeting? High 1A or 0? I planned on doing 0 before using the scans you gathered but I thought that would be disrespectful.

Atleast High 1-A

This site accepted 1A root based on it being above dimensional theories(even if that's just akashic records being mistakened for root)

No that scan alone wasn't enough they used the statement of dimensional theory which is already completed vague in itself is not supposed to scale anywhere but added [] to solidify it being 1-A

So if we accept the basic understanding of the root as a 1A tier, then the "real"/inconceivable" definition of root would be High 1A.

I'll just make the better crt in a couple of days

 

[Tdjwo]

Atleast High 1-A

Neat

No that scan alone wasn't enough they used the statement of dimensional theory which is already completed vague in itself is not supposed to scale anywhere but added [] to solidify it being 1-A

The dimensional theory is vague? How? I always thought that statement by itself was pretty underrated and should scale way higher than just 1A since it encompasses theories of every dimensional statement based on mathematic principles..

I'll just make the better crt in a couple of days

Positively looking forward to it.

 

[ImmortalDread]

Are concepts even allowed on this site to upgrade a verse?

No unless with enough context on how this will effect cosmology by any chance.

 

[Maxeez]

Because of this basically confirming theres an infinite amount of "「　」" like concepts and the fact that "「　」" is infinitely above all concepts in the nasuverse, I believe its rating should be changed from 1-A to 1-A+.

Solely basing my reasoning on this (since this is the crux of your argument) : infinite different concepts of 「　」doesn't really mean anything regarding your proposition. All it means is that since it's an "ineffable" and "incomprehensible" force, everyone has a different way of describing/naming/conceptualizing it, all being on the same level of reality. Since 「　」transcends all of them equally, it's one of its reasoning for 1-A, but not 1-A+.

For the Root to be 1-A+, it would need this :

Characters that stand an infinite number of steps above baseline 1-A are to have a + modifier in their Attack Potency section (Outerverse level+).

The concepts themselves aren't 1-A, but rather apart of reality which the Root transcends (thus why it is 1-A, among other reasons).
So yeah I disagree.

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

The same reason why "Transcending all mathematical theories" are not outright tier 0.
Disagree.

 

[Tarang123]

Concepts are infinitely layered in the Nasuverse

How does this imply layering?

 

[Tarang123]

Thats what this thread is talking about, they are similar concepts, but not the same thing. Nasu confirms this in the quote i listed in the op

Why would this lead to 1A+. An infinite amount of them wouldn't be 1A+, but just an infinite amount of 1A entities