Revising Dragon Ball Flight Speed (Dragon Ball + DBZ + DBS Manga)

[KLOL506]

Oh boy, this is a pickle. Obviously they aren't as fast as their combat speed, but the OP brought up some terrible "anti-feats". AKK and DDM expressed most of my thoughts here.

I'm going with "Don't agree 100%, but it's certainly slower".

I wouldn't say the travel speed is overwhelmingly slower than their combat speed.

Damage's aura argument... Obviously, there is the unsupported correlation that "Has an aura = Using a relevant amount of strength", but we also have this. Cell isn't using nowhere near his full strength here

Can't access the scan.

 

[Dalesean027]

Deadass there's no way we're still discussing buu is immortal or not please get back on topic dudes lived since the dawn of time and has shown absolutely no signs of getting older, aging, and getting weaker from said aging he has immortality type 1 point blank period now, if you can't drop scans to prove it's just longevity then just drop it there's literally no point to it now we get back to the actual discussion at hand and stop derailing.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

The fact that they can still outrun ki attacks and run away from blasts and that the attacks not catching up to them immediately proves that the travel speed can't be that much lower than combat speed even if it is slower, otherwise Goku's Relativistic Kamehameha would instantly catch Raditz as he tries to run away

 

[KLOL506]

I'm not sure how you both aren't getting it. But to go over it.

Majin Buu has existed for billions of years (if not more) and doesn't age or show signs of aging.

He's Type 1 Immortal. He cannot die from old age. Its a very straightforward rating here. I think you're confusing Dragon Ball immortality for VSBW's immortality which are two different things.

I don't exactly understand how Immortality correlates to Buu being a universal threat long before he learns the Kai Kai technique from Kibito.

 

[Vizer04]

Deadass there's no way we're still discussing buu is immortal or not please get back on topic dudes lived since the dawn of time and has shown absolutely no signs of getting older, aging, and getting weaker from said aging he has immortality type 1 point blank period now, if you can't drop scans to prove it's just longevity then just drop it there's literally no point to it now we get back to the actual discussion at hand and stop derailing.

It's not derailing, and the burden of proof is on you, you have to prove it's Immortality and not Longevity.

 

[KLOL506]

Deadass there's no way we're still discussing buu is immortal or not please get back on topic dudes lived since the dawn of time and has shown absolutely no signs of getting older, aging, and getting weaker from said aging he has immortality type 1 point blank period now, if you can't drop scans to prove it's just longevity then just drop it there's literally no point to it now we get back to the actual discussion at hand and stop derailing.

Again, how does Immortality correlate to being able to blitz through the universe and destroy every single planet there exists?

Why would it matter at all whether Buu has Longevity or Immortality if he was a universal threat long before he learned of Kai Kai?

 

[Damage3245]

The fact that they can still outrun ki attacks and run away from blasts and that the attacks not catching up to them immediately proves that the travel speed can't be that much lower than combat speed even if it is slower, otherwise Goku's Relativistic Kamehameha would instantly catch Raditz as he tries to run away

The reason for that is because that is just in short bursts. That kind of feat would fall under Combat Speed, which is what would be specified on the profile.

We're not advocating removing those ratings but adding more detail to account for all of the other feats and statements too.

 

[Dalesean027]

Again, how does Immortality correlate to being able to blitz through the universe and destroy every single planet there exists?

It doesn't which is why I'm saying to get back on topic it literally has no correlation I personally am in the favor of yourself and DDM points but this immortality talk is so pointless it's annoying

 

[Vizer04]

The reason for that is because that is just in short bursts.

Can you prove that? When was it said they could only do it in short bursts?

 

[Vizer04]

Buu is a threat to the Universe and that makes him FTL by itself

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

The reason for that is because that is just in short bursts. That kind of feat would fall under Combat Speed, which is what would be specified on the profile.

How is that even combat speed? Running away is not combat speed, it's just travel speed. They don't just do a small movement to dodge a punch or strike with their hand, it's full on running or flying away from a blast, which is travel speed

 

[Damage3245]

Can you prove that? When was it said they could only do it in short bursts?

There is a statement from Piccolo to that effect. It was posted by Qaws further up the thread.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

There is a statement from Piccolo to that effect. It was posted by Qaws further up the thread.

That's not what Piccolo meant at all. All Piccolo says is that he can suppress his power by a huge amount, so what Gero stole from him is basically nothing. This has nothing to do with speed and doesn't prove your point in the slightest. If that's your explaination then it simply falls flat

And yes, I went and searched for the scan you said so don't come and say "oh you don't read you are not even worth my answer"

 

[Vizer04]

There is a statement from Piccolo to that effect. It was posted by Qaws further up the thread.

I can't find it

 

[Damage3245]

I'll be back to this thread in a few hours, hopefully.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I don't exactly understand how Immortality correlates to Buu being a universal threat long before he learns the Kai Kai technique from Kibito.

Oh my point was that he can just, fly through the void of space and eventually get somewhere.

It wouldn't dispute the point since Buu has an infinite amount of time to do stuff.

 

[Qawsedf234]

That's not what Piccolo meant at all.

It is.

Remember this: In battle, we can amplify what you call energy in one tremendous burst.

He wasn't holding back, but they can rapidly increase their energy and offensive output in short burst. So what Gero stole from Piccolo meant nothing since Piccolo amplifies his own energy before he attacks to a much greater degree.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

It is.

He wasn't holding back, but they can rapidly increase their energy and offensive output in short burst. So what Gero stole from Piccolo meant nothing since Piccolo amplifies his own energy before he attacks to a much greater degree.

He literally was. Piccolo can power up to full power in an instant, and that is what he meant. Gero stole little energy from Piccolo because Piccolo was suppressed before powering up against Gero, who was shocked that Piccolo has so much power

By your logic, they have to also actively power their defenses in order to not get immediately killed by any attack at their level, and you also forget that in most fight they stay at the level they are the entire fight

 

[SirAlex09]

When purely flying , the speed of the flying nimbus was considered high by the time of Radditz arrival by Radditz himself and Goku.
The Nimbus has a speed of Mach 1.5 and people like Radditz and Goku have relativistic Running speed. (https://dragonball.fandom.com/wiki/Flying_Nimbus)


In my opinion this kinda shows a pattern. Flight speed and combat did have gap at the beginning of Z since most of the high speed exchanges happened on the ground rather than Aerial combat ( Nappa vs Goku, Radditz vs Goku, Ginyu vs Goku)

 

[SirAlex09]

But this doesn't seem to apply in the scond half of Z since they start blitzing and attacking in the sky as well. And in the case of Burter we have a character whose Flight speed certainly exceeded the Z - Fighters combat speed at the time since no one could react to him catching the Dragonball in mid air. And he was surpassed by Goku later on

 

[Damage3245]

But this doesn't seem to apply in the scond half of Z since they start blitzing and attacking in the sky as well. And in the case of Burter we have a character whose Flight speed certainly exceeded the Z - Fighters combat speed at the time since no one could react to him catching the Dragonball in mid air. And he was surpassed by Goku later on

To be fair Burter is the fastest in the Universe. /s

 

[thetechmaster36]

To be fair Burter is the fastest in the Universe. /s

Absolute facts, my man.

 

[SirAlex09]

If we separate Combat speed / Movement speed in short bursts from Flight speed, we can scale the former more reliably without any potential Anti feats.

This, on top of the previously mentioned anti-feats, leads me to believe that the speed of Flight is slower than combat speed, likely due to the fact that the user is essentially radiating Ki under their bodies rather than unleashing it in its pure form from their palms and because of the laws of aerodynamics directly acting against them, possibly reducing their potential maximum speed.

And combined with this we can always assume travel speed is lower than combat speed in Dragonball meaning that if character X has a flight speed of quadrillion times light speed , his combat speed is at the minimum on the same level.

 

[Nierre]

SirAlex FRA

 

[Arnoldstone18]

TLDR but I see examples comparing flight with "running" and "walking" but no one factors in the possibility of "jogging" or "power walking"

Just recently Gas is flying/flew from the farthest reaches of the universe to the planet in 18 minutes according to Whis. What will that be considered as "sprinting"?

I'm sure Gas will be drained from that haha.

 

[UeTa]

Very simple and straight forward, I agree

Yep same, I agree.

 

[UeTa]

After catching up with the whole thread (took me 26 mins). I still agree.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Well, a friend of mine sent me some examples of flight speed being above attack speed in... very continuous bursts

Goku vs Freeza

Goku vs Cell

Goku vs Piccolo

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

And these are just few examples. Frieza earlier is also able to completely outpace and avoid all of Vegeta's attacks

 

[KLOL506]

Well, a friend of mine sent me some examples of flight speed being above attack speed in... very continuous bursts

Goku vs Freeza

Goku vs Cell

Goku vs Piccolo

in b4 "this is only combat speed because short bursts"

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

in b4 "this is only combat speed because short bursts"

If it would be for only "short bursts", wouldn't they tire out after going this fast? Because they didn't showed to be tired at all in any of these scans

 

[KLOL506]

If it would be for only "short bursts", wouldn't they tire out after going this fast? Like how you really tire after sprinting at top speed?

They'll prolly use MUI as an example of that. Even tho MFTL+ flight speed journeys should literally be over in seconds or hours if traversing across a large universe.

 

[Qawsedf234]

If it would be for only "short bursts", wouldn't they tire out after going this fast?

Where did this come from? I don't think anyone for Damage's side has argued about stamina being an issue before.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Even tho MFTL+ flight speed journeys should literally be over in seconds or hours if traversing across a large universe.

I mean, even with their current ratings it would take forever to get anywhere. It would take SS1 Goku nearly two days to get to the nearest solar system from Earth. Intergalactic distances or more would still take decades or more.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Where did this come from? I don't think anyone for Damage's side has argued about stamina being an issue before.

So why would it only be "for short bursts" then? And where is the proof for that?

 

[Qawsedf234]

So why would it only be "for short bursts" then?

Short Bursts would just be a limit of how long they can keep that increased power Piccolo was talking about. It would have nothing to do with their stamina.

And where is the proof for that?

Of what? Their stamina being good?

Well like, Krillin can fly in a straight-line for a couple hours and plenty of people have had solid multi-minute or back to back fights over a day

 

[SirAlex09]

As stupid as my comment sounds : They are probably not using pure flight in these instances. They probably kick the air and leap through it similar to how they all do it in the ToP where flying was disabled.

So yeah their movement speed is probably the same as their combat speed but their pure flight speed is lower.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Short Bursts would just be a limit of how long they can keep that increased power Piccolo was talking about. It would have nothing to do with their stamina.

Piccolo did not talked about that at all. He didn't said anything like "I can only use my power in short bursts". What he actually said is: "In battle we can amplify our energy in one tremendous blast". Piccolo held back while searching for Gero, as he wasn't fighting beforehand (Goku and Vegeta fought Gero and 19, and when Gero escaped, the rest searched for him, allowing Gero to surprise Piccolo and steal energy from him), and then when Gero attacked Piccolo, he unleashed his full power to easily destroy Gero's hand

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

As stupid as my comment sounds : They are probably not using pure flight in these instances. They probably kick the air and leap through it similar to how they all do it in the ToP where flying was disabled.

So yeah their movement speed is probably the same as their combat speed but their pure flight speed is lower.

In the scan where Goku outpaces Frieza's attack, he was flying the entire time and the attack was following him the entire time up until Frieza got sliced in half

 

[SirAlex09]

In the scan where Goku outpaces Frieza's attack, he was flying the entire time and the attack was following him the entire time up until Frieza got sliced in half

You know what. F*** Toriyama for not staying consistent to anything. I am out