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Don't the Anime and Manga characters scale to the Games characters tho (Alain scaling to Lysandre and Mitsumi scaling to Cynthia)We are referring to the Games Adam.
Cynthia defeating Cyrus with Palkia comes from a cutscene, not gameplayI am more or less neutral on RPG points but there are a few oddball cases like Cynthia's pokemons which seem to suggest being able to fight the end-game legendary pokemons in generation 4 but in the newer generations, they lose to arguably weaker pokemons.
In any case, here is the thread where the discussion rule above on the verse was accepted for more contexts; it would probably be ideal to get more staffs inputs like in the last thread.
I am fine with Cyrus' case.
When did Cynthia fight Cyrus?Cynthia defeating Cyrus with Palkia comes from a cutscene, not gameplay
Pokémon Masters. During Cyrus' event with PalkiaWhen did Cynthia fight Cyrus?
That's what I'm saying. It shouldn't be canon to the main games, though the games are canon to itwhy do we consider masters as canon? Wouldn't it be its own separate thing?
Okay, I do not want us opening that can of worms right now.That's what I'm saying. It shouldn't be canon to the main games, though the games are canon to it
Honestly Pokemon in general should be split in some regards rather than remaining composite
Pokemon Masters is a game thoOkay, I do not want us opening that can of worms right now.
Just to clarify with everyone, this is a discussion about the GAME variants of these trainers scaling to the feats in the GAME canon. We'll talk about what to do with Manga and Anime and whether compositing should be even done at a later date.
Which is of extremely dubious canonicity to the main games. It's like trying to scale mainline Fire Emblem characters to Fire Emblem Heroes.
Only Team Rainbow Rocket. Cyrus has Palkia thereWe have pokemon fought in-game at 2-B and higher?
Palmer also has a CresseliaOnly Team Rainbow Rocket. Cyrus has Palkia there
Other than that I think only N used either Reshiram or Zekrom
ThisHonestly Pokemon in general should be split in some regards rather than remaining composite
see, the thing is, I’m unsure how to handle the anime. Games I’m adamant on due to well…this thread. But the anime I’m iffy.I just realized something about the scaling to Legendaries specific for the anime. Why do we have "At 3-A with Z moves" even though trainers are shown to be able to fight Ultra Beasts without them? Like Ash straight up defeated and knocked out Silvally without the use them as well as match it blow for blow.
Yea. At the very least a different universe…mostlyIsn't the anime different continuity?
This is more or less what I’m going for, yeah. Though Volkner would be added to the G4 scaling, as he’s canonically E4 level and is Flint’s equal.Without using the Anime or Masters:
- Champion Blue, Elite4 Lance and Alder stay at 6-C
- Gen2 Elite4, Champion Lance and Gen2 Red become 6-B
- Piers, Raihan, Chairman Rose, Leon, Hop, Peony, Champion tournament Trainers become High 6-A
- Gen 3 Elite4, Wally, Wallace and Steven become High 6-A or 5-B with ORAS
- Zinnia, B/W N, Ghetsis and Cheren, B2/W2 Elite4, Champion Iris, Colress, Lysandre, AZ, Gen6 Elite4, Diantha, Alola Elite Four, Title Defense Trainers become "At least 3-C, possibly High 3-A"
- Barry, Gen 4 Elite4, Cynthia, Palmer, Dahlia, RainbowRocket Giovanni and all Battle Tree and World Tournament trainers become "At least 2-B, likely 2-A"
I also have a question about one Pokémon in particular: Mewtwo. Because Rainbow Rocket Giovanni is very consistently the strongest villain in the franchise, and Mewtwo is his ace in both, the mainline games and Masters (in USUM, Giovanni left that universe to terrorize wherever Masters takes place), do we give Mewtwo a RR key alongside upgrading Giovanni?
Mind you, this would only affect Mewtwo. No other Legendary changes with the plot. All the other evil team leaders are never compared to each other. Giovanni is the only one who’s canonically the strongest of em
based and false and annoying and L + cope + seethe + mald + no maidens + shut up + banana + Hop knows you are but what is Hop + get trolledRetired Cal isn't even a beast, he's someone that rants over stuff but rarely actually does something.
Idk about the amp stuff but limits sounds like it was under its own power. Also that wouldn’t change that USUM, Giovanni + Mewtwo > Cyrus + Pal/DiaGiovanni's Mewtwo was mega amped ontop of Mega Evolution was and forced to break his limits three times over in Masters
Based.Idk about the amp stuff but limits sounds like it was under its own power. Also that wouldn’t change that USUM, Giovanni + Mewtwo > Cyrus + Pal/Dia
Also should probably state that other Pokémon, Legendaries or otherwise, can reach that level under the right trainer. Giovanni’s Mewtwo is just the only one out of nearly a thousand that’s story-relevant (with a possible exception of like, maybe Red’s Charizard)
The swords of justice are basically Roaming Legendaries in The Crown Tundra thoBy that logic can't one argue the Galar trainer cam catch legendaries like the Creation Trio via the Dens?
I feel like we're only talking about canonical mon trainers use, so unfortunately I'm not sure the Galar trainers can scale too high just yet.
pretty sure in Crystal you catch suicune before the Elite 4The swords of justice are basically Roaming Legendaries in The Crown Tundra tho
If we can use the legendary birds for the Gen1 Elite4 and the legendary beasts for the Gen2 Elite4, I think we could do the same thing with Gen8