Nasuverse: Base Servant Stats Revisions

[Tllmbrg]

I always interpreted that as Herc having enough magic resistance to shrug off spatial warping much like Archer could break out of frozen space.

Fair on the rest though.

He doesn't even have magic resistance tho

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

You gotta keep in mind that even though it was Berserker's strength, the thing that facepalmed against the Sword was his Axe-sword.

That was specially treated by the Einzberns to let him use it as a weapon, and only God knows what the **** they did to it.

 

[LehenDuo]

You gotta keep in mind that even though it was Berserker's strength, the thing that facepalmed against the Sword was his Axe-sword.

That was specially treated by the Einzberns to let him use it as a weapon, and only God knows what the **** they did to it.

Considering Caladbolg II could just pass through Casters magical barrier (while she was in Ryudo), I doubt any modern magecraft applied to it could be relevant.
But as far as I can remember, there was any ''treatment'', it was just a piece of rock from the foundation of Herakles temple or something like that.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

I believe so? Wouldn't give anything very good. The idea was passed that maybe if the flames compared to the hotter ones of the Sun since Galatine uses the artificial sun inside of it as a power generator, but since we don't know the heat in the slightest it is speculation at best and not very solid.

And if Surtr of all people can only reach 4 million Celsius with his special sword, Gawain reaching Sun Core levels of heat turns... doubtful. But like has been mentioned, perhaps the massive hole left in Last Encore could give something good.

I been seeing of someone could calc it but a few are saying it's be hard without a reference

And it might be near impossible to calc due to how far away we are seeing the crater

what destructive value would you give gawain for it? Use pulverization violent frag or vaporization?

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

No steam of any kind, yet you see a lot of dust and pretty much no debris left over, so pulverization would be best if anyone tried to find a way.

Anyway, I will be likely busy so don't expect to see me here much today.

 

[LehenDuo]

It would be a bit awkward to use pulverization considering the effect is supposed to be heat based, though.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

It would be a bit awkward to use pulverization considering the effect is supposed to be heat based, though.

I do agree with this, but a low end of pulverization would be okay?

 

[Schnee_One]

All servants with high enough MR have spatial resistance, so Herc can interact with Caladabolg fine

 

[John985]

Herc dont have MR.

 

[Schnee_One]

Nevermind then

 

[LehenDuo]

All servants with high enough MR have spatial resistance, so Herc can interact with Caladabolg fine

It wasn't Herc, it was his weapon, which is made using a piece of stone from the foundation of a temple, or something along that line, which slashed Caladbolg II. (And, in the VNovel, he got offed by Caladbolg II, so he didn't interacted fine either way)
(and, as said above, Berserk Herk lacks MR, it's his Archer/Avenger version who has it.)

EDIT: And, one more thing that I remembered - MR would in a way protect against spatial manip from magecraft, but MR does not protect from Noble Phantasms.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

So what's happening here, are we still using "At least Low 7-B, possibly 6-C"

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

So what's happening here, are we still using "At least Low 7-B, possibly 6-C"

Well, the Rhongo feat/calc for Gawaine is no longer considered usable for a variety of reasons and that seems to be agreed on by the majority here.

Which basically leaves Caladabolg's feat, which is still being discussed as to whether or not it should scale to servant physicals. I don't personally think A+ ranked anti-army or anti-fortress phantasms are within range for backscaling however much of the supporters here disagree with me.

I'd personally like to go over Karna's feat of taking Balmung to the face, and also go over the calc for Caladabolg.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I see, seems like a lot more needs to be revised then, well we'll all get this done in due time

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Just popping in to say, I'll try to see if I can send that Beast Lair link with what You said later. Been focusing on other stuff.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

I got some stuff and maybe something new to calc? let me upload them to an imgur album.

it comes from a new chapter release btw.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

I have no idea how applicable this is, or how accurate/canon the fate Apoc Manga is to the source material

but berserker Sparatcus using his NP made a crater Jeanne blocked it with her NP

---

Lastly, Mordred took the NP of Siegfried (Technically its Sieg using Siegfriends NP) and came out fine. Mordred also tanked an NP from Fran that was a suicide attack amped by a command seal she took some of the damage, but a command seal manage to save her from most of it. The command seal was meant to teleport her away, but even still. its an NP boosted by a command seal, and only her Helmet was broke.

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Yes, I've been dead. I'll be more dead mostly likely, have a presentation and a test coming soon and at this point, I really don't care if 6-C is dropped. I'll just be mock angry at dargoo after I already finished the Saber profiles, huff >:V

Anyway, here it is. You does note that Karna would obviously take damage even with K&K, in a comment before, if he didn't use full power PB. But as I mentioned, other Servants have PB. Arthuria and Mordred very pointedly among those since theirs is Rank A like his though his is full on flamey shit, and we even get told that their normal mana boost can boost defense. But-

Well, you just need to see any fight of Saber's or Mordred's. They ain't frail, Mordred even has END A (though her big ass armor may play a part in it, it sure does for her Father), but their defense is within the bounds of Servant dura and Karna should be no different, even if that should scale to the stronger Servants rather than his C endurance, which is fair.

And as I said before, the difference between "lethal wounds" and "one shot" is not that much, as far as I care, but I think that's gonna be up to personal opinion so I just don't have a whole lot to comment there.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

Yes, I've been dead. I'll be more dead mostly likely, have a presentation and a test coming soon and at this point, I really don't care if 6-C is dropped. I'll just be mock angry at dargoo after I already finished the Saber profiles, huff >:V

Anyway, here it is. You does note that Karna would obviously take damage even with K&K, in a comment before, if he didn't use full power PB. But as I mentioned, other Servants have PB. Arthuria and Mordred very pointedly among those since theirs is Rank A like his though his is full on flamey shit, and we even get told that their normal mana boost can boost defense. But-

Well, you just need to see any fight of Saber's or Mordred's. They ain't frail, Mordred even has END A (though her big ass armor may play a part in it, it sure does for her Father), but their defense is within the bounds of Servant dura and Karna should be no different, even if that should scale to the stronger Servants rather than his C endurance, which is fair.

And as I said before, the difference between "lethal wounds" and "one shot" is not that much, as far as I care, but I think that's gonna be up to personal opinion so I just don't have a whole lot to comment there.

Well with the mordred thing

Chirons, Tristians, and Arash's Normal attacks can pierce through it

A hard jab with Siegfreinds sword can pierce through her armor (Might just be the swords properties though and less about Sieg.)

Where as a Command Seal boost, and very determined ready to die trying Fran with her NP couldn't hurt her. Mordred was still caught in the blast. So if NP's were hundreds of time stronger she would have been dead almost instantly. Armor or not lol


But anyways i pretty much found everything i could that i think can be calc'ed. its possible i could have missed alot but i tried hard to find stuff

2 cloud dispersion feats, Sparatcus NP in the Fate/Apoc Manga, and the Gawain feat in Last Encore (Though the calc'ers are saying finding a size would be hard or possibly impossible.)

 

[LehenDuo]

And as I said before, the difference between "lethal wounds" and "one shot" is not that much, as far as I care, but I think that's gonna be up to personal opinion so I just don't have a whole lot to comment there.

This is specially true for Servants, also.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I want to say that should we wait for the Camelot movie to comes out? Maybe we can find more justified feats there

Also might as well looking at the some feats from Lostbelt chapters (and since LB3 would out to NA soon in this months so why not try)

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Bump i guess

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Ok, we need to get some things clear here since this thread is dying, what feats do we need to calc, what calcs are getting revised or thrown out, and ultimately what are we doing with the Base Servant Stats

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

Ok, we need to get some things clear here since this thread is dying, what feats do we need to calc, what calcs are getting revised or thrown out, and ultimately what are we doing with the Base Servant Stats

I found like 3 feats that can be clac'd by their all NP related. Then as mentioned above there is the Gawain feat, but I been told that maybe a bit difficult to do.


im unsure about everything else.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I see, well NP's on their own need to be revised in a separate thread, I just want to get Base Stats over with

@Dargoo_Faust

Are completely nuking the Lion King's Attack or does it need to be revised in particular

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

I see, well NP's on their own need to be revised in a separate thread, I just want to get Base Stats over with

Then I shall wait for that crt

 

[Schnee_One]

Recalc the Lion King feat for the time being, right now we need to at least fix that calc before we discuss whether they scale or not

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

What information is going to be used to recalc it?

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Can someone give me all of the context and scans of the Lion King's feat, I can re-calc it, I just need that info since until this point, all I knew is that we had a High 6-C feat that scaled to the Lion King and it was accepted, but if I am to re-calc it, I need some more info

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Are completely nuking the Lion King's Attack or does it need to be revised in particular

From what was discussed with Lancelot and I believe we were discarding it entirely, although it appears Schnee had a different take on the debate.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

Are we saying it needs to be discarded as whole, or just in scaling it? Wouldn't it still be unique to only lion king with no scaling?

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

So if we nuke the Lion King Calc from scaling, then Base Servant Stats would just be Low 7-B, or does anyone else have any calc ideas

 

[Schnee_One]

@Dargoo Faust

I did? Was there a post I miswrote?

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

@Dargoo_Faust @Schnee_One

So do you believe every Servant should lose the 6-C and just be Low 7-B, or are there other feats and calcs we want to scale the characters to

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

So do you believe every Servant should lose the 6-C and just be Low 7-B, or are there other feats and calcs we want to scale the characters to

I do think that Servants shouldn't scale to Phantasms physically as a rule of thumb. However currently people are proposing that servants scale to this feat from Caladabolg in Argatha and I am not in the majority with my philosophy. Considering that we currently scale Anti-Army phantasms to most of the full yield of Anti-Fortress Phantasms, and that Anti-Fortress Phantasms vaporize average servants, I don't think that calc should be used for scaling.

Are we saying it needs to be discarded as whole, or just in scaling it? Wouldn't it still be unique to only lion king with no scaling?

I mean. We don't use the feat currently to rate the Lion King's Rhongo Blasts, since those are rated as 6-A. The calc was purely done for scaling, which is being discarded, so the calc in general has no use, really.

I did? Was there a post I miswrote?

Recalc the Lion King feat for the time being, right now we need to at least fix that calc before we discuss whether they scale or not

You seemed to imply we hadn't already discussed the scaling, my bad if this wasn't your intent.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

I mean. We don't use the feat currently to rate the Lion King's Rhongo Blasts, since those are rated as 6-A. The calc was purely done for scaling, which is being discarded, so the calc in general has no use, really.

Ah I understand now. That makes sense

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I see, well if that’s the case, I do see issues, I’m not a huge fan of scaling Anti-Army NP to base stats, but I do remember Caster and Berserker surviving Caladbolg if that means anything

 

[Schnee_One]

@Dargoo Faust The feat itself scales to the AP of noble phantasms, so it needs to be recalced regardless of if servants physically scale or not.

That is what I meant at least, but if it has no purpose, then that’s kinda irrelevant

 

[SuperKamiNappa]

So if 6-C is being tossed for Base Servants what would the A+ Nps be scaled to? would they just be 7x servants?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I want to say that should we wait for the Camelot movie to comes out? Maybe we can find more justified feats there

Also might as well looking at the some feats from Lostbelt chapters (and since LB3 would out to NA soon in this months so why not try)