Minamoto no Raikou vs Dread Emperor

[Peppersalt43]

ALTERNATE TITLE: THE MATCH WE'VE ALL BEEN DREADING​

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Well, it's been a month since the chaos that is Minamoto no Raikou vs Charon
I assume all parties are well rested
I still don't know how to Imgur

Summary would be added later

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• First key Raikou used
• Speed equalized
• Place Located in : Florida Everglades
• Both characters have prior knowledge
• Starting range : 30 meters
• Win via anything!!
• A Dreadful Encounter : 0
• The Purple Divine Lightning: 0
• Inconclusive : 0

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VS

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[Expectro2000xxx]

Again, what can the dnd guy do (and this time seriously what he can do to prevent situations like the last thread).

 

[Qawsedf234]

Oh he-

The Purple Divine Lightning:

 

[Qawsedf234]

Again, what can the dnd guy do

There's really nothing he has that would be like Charon's at will Wish power. What you see should be what you get with him.

The real issue is actually like, moral wise

Her overflowing maternal instinct makes her reluctant to attack or harm children

The Emperor has four to six kids magically chained to his armor that redirects all damage he takes to them. He'll also freely kill them or harm them being his a psychopath. She would have to get around that first.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

There's really nothing he has that would be like Charon's at will Wish power. What you see should be what you get with him.

Ok

The real issue is actually like, moral wise

The Emperor has four to six kids magically chained to his armor that redirects all damage he takes to them. He'll also freely kill them or harm them being his a psychopath. She would have to get around that first.

Actually that probably would bloodlust her a lot if that is the case, because she would want to end him quickly if he really do that type to thing with childs, so she would probably go off the bat for the kill more strongly than normal (like, I could see her having even more killing intent that when facing a oni, because to begin with part of her hate for oni is because they end hurting childs with their actions).

To give context, that weakness did come mainly from her second key when she was under a curse that made her completely crazy and with the desire to destroy everything (she was basically one of the villains of the arc), but even in that state she was unable to bring herself to harm innocent childs and at points even turned against her allies to protect the childs despite the curse effects changing completely her morals.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Actually that probably would bloodlust her a lot if that is the case, because she would want to end him quickly

That's the issue, literally anything that happens to him gets transferred to the children. He canonically exploits that aspect against others. She would need to kill every child to harm him first.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

That's the issue, literally anything that happens to him gets transferred to the children. He canonically exploits that aspect against others. She would need to kill every child to harm him first.

I was thinking more in she going more with things like directly the spiritual attacks (the attacks with the concept, info, soul, etc. hax) or even her divine power (like, she really hate to use them and normally will never use them unless extreme situations, but face someone who actively hurt kids with his power is such a extreme situation that I genuinely speaking don't know how she would react because childs are the most important thing to her, specially in her Berserker form when he maternal instincts aren't hold back).

 

[Qawsedf234]

I was thinking more in she going more with things like directly the spiritual attacks (the attacks with the concept, info, soul, etc. hax)

All of those attacks are in D&D and all of those get shunted into the children. It's why he keeps them around. Anything the effects him will be transferred or shared with any of the kids he has chained to himself. She would need to shatter that link or anything she does hurts them instead.

 

[Peppersalt43]

Bump, lets continue the discussion

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

From my part I don't know what more to say.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I'll try and do a bigger overview tomorrow and let Expectro go from there. Afaik the biggest hinderance is more morals than anything else for Berserker though.

 

[Peppersalt43]

I'll try and do a bigger overview tomorrow

OK

 

[Qawsedf234]

I have woken from my Jak II coma to remember that I promised to do a thing.

Aside from the four children (and it’s not always the same four children) chained to his armor, the Dread Emperor keeps to himself. His lonely (but well-warded) fortress is located on the Ethereal Plane, accessible via a hidden portal in a high mountain cave. Occasionally the Dread Emperor comes to a city to sell a magic item he has created, but he keeps to the shadier parts of town because only the most depraved are willing to deal with him. Upstanding, moral people often attempt to rescue the children, so the Dread Emperor has to kill the do-gooders and usually destroy a few city blocks in the process.

The Dread Emperor is clearly insane, but his isn’t the cackling, madcap sort of insanity. He is delusional, paranoid, and psychotic. He does not delight in the suffering of others, but he has not an ounce of compassion or empathy. If left alone, the Dread Emperor is content to keep to himself and remain unobtrusive. However, the children he keeps in tow often tempt would-be heroes to attack him, so he sometimes finds himself in battle when he moves among other people. When that happens, he does not hesitate to kill hundreds in the process of slaying a single target. One of his favorite tactics is to cast haste on himself and follow that with meteor swarm, a corrupted maximized fireball, and a corrupted quickened fireballall in a single round. Another favorite tactic is to use mass charm to get any and all bystanders on his side while some hero or constable attempts to accost him. He sometimes charms his assailants as well, although they are usually found dead later even if they were charmed into submission.

Next we have the Emperor's gear

Armor of the Dread Emperor: This suit of +1 full plate has four 5-foot chains connected to it at the waist. Each chain has a ring manacle sized to fit around a humanoid neck. If people are placed in these manacles by either the armor’s wearer or his minions, the armor is ready to display its true power. Whenever the wearer takes damage, the captives held by the chains take half the damage themselves. If the chains hold more than one person, divide the half damage among all of them. Operating in this armor with chains attached to other people is difficult. The wearer takes an additional –5 armor check penalty unless the victims are somehow magically subdued or controlled, such as by stupor or dominate person. If the captives are children, the additional armor check penalty is only –2. If the captives are subdued or controlled children, there is no additional armor check penalty.

Belt of the Dread Emperor: If a willing (or dominated or helpless) humanoid creature is attached to the wearer of this belt by a chain and a manacle (see armor of the Dread Emperor), the wearer can draw energy from that creature to power spells. The belt of the Dread Emperor functions for all spellcasters who prepare spells (including clerics, druids, rangers, paladins, and wizards). The belt enables the wearer to recall a prepared spell, even if the spell has already been cast, as long as the spell was among those he most recently prepared. For each spell recalled, the chained creature takes damage equal to the square of the spell’s level: A recalled 1stlevel spell deals 1 point of damage, a 2nd-level spell deals 4 points, a 3rd-level spell deals 9 points, and so on, up to a 9thlevel spell that deals 81 points of damage. If the chained creature does not have enough hit points left to power a desired spell, the spell fails and the creature dies.

Ring of the Dread Emperor: This black ring is made from a single piece of obsidian and bears a gold inlay design of chains. If a humanoid of at least 10th level is killed on a given day by the wearer of this ring, the wearer takes no penalties for wearing armor (no armor check penalty, no maximum Dexterity bonus to Armor Class, no spell failure chance, and no reduced movement). The wearer of the ring gains the effect of a free action spell for the next 24 hours.

So with that

Both characters have prior knowledge

This means that Berserker is at a serious disadvantage here:

• Her intelligence is completely for fighting and has nothing to do with prep. In fact prior knowledge would make it even worse for her considering she is fighting literal brainwashed starved children
• The Dread Emperor is really smart, with an Intelligence of 26. An intelligence of 21+ indicates a Godlike level of intelligence and the ability to have pseduo-precognition due to how big brained you are. However, it should be noted his profile is incorrect, Elder Brains have an Intelligence of 28 which is higher than the Dread Emperor and D&D stats are treated as non-linear in terms of ratings (besides bigger > lower).

To avoid the incredibly dumb debate of last time, I'm going to say that its unlikely that Berserker can fully resist everything Dread Emperor can throw at her, so it comes down to this:

Can Raikou, in-character, murder five innocent children magically chained to the Dread Emperor? Because if she can't then she has no win condition, because the Dread Emperor will just exploit that. Considering this is a listed weakness

Her overflowing maternal instinct makes her reluctant to attack or harm children

I doubt she can do anything. Prior knowledge means that she can't harm the Dread Emperor without also knowing he'll just redirect all the force to the kids. None of her abilities can directly counter the armor and she doesn't have the listed prep ability to devise a way to counter the armor. The Dread Emperor can hang back and try any number of spells or prep items until something works and she can't do anything to really counter that other than hope she can tank it.

If anything I'd suggest to change it to something else, since the Dread Emperor isn't the best for a fight (though for like, a written story or something he'd be a decent if completely 2-Dimensional villain to fight).

 

[Mageman460]

So uh ... what's to stop Raikou from just tearing the chains holding the children and then decapitating the Dread Emperor?

Also as a note, Servants have layered 4 D Power Null against supernatural sources. The layers only increase with Magic Resistance. Do D&D characters bypass Power Null?

On top of that Servants have 4 D Invulnerability.

 

[Qawsedf234]

So uh ... what's to stop Raikou from just tearing the chains holding the children and then decapitating the Dread Emperor?

The chains are magically connected and spawned from the armor. He can just conjure new chains if needed.

Also as a note, Servants have layered 4 D Power Null against supernatural sources. The layers only increase with Magic Resistance. Do D&D characters bypass Power Null?

Yes. D&D characters have a comparable amount of layered resistances and the ability to overcome those resistances.

On top of that Servants have 4 D Invulnerability.

All D&D spells and magical items can attack targets located on multiple different dimensional planes along with stuff like souls or things completely immune to mundane weaponary. Her invulnerability doesn't mean much here.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

The last days I have been thinking in the match and how Raikou would react in such extreme situation, and then I finally remembered something important, her Lone Warrior Mode.

This state was introduced in her second interlude, and was trigered by she remembering her historical childs, and by doing so remembering her trauma that affect her motherly persona. Lone Warrior Mode is a state in which Raikou enter when she is under too much stress, a state in which she don't hold back with anything, just empty her mind from all troublesome problems and focus entirely in fighting and slaying her enemies (in the video she was even attacking seriously Kintoki who she see as her child and who she would never actually hurt). In exchange however of not holding anything back and crush things with an overwhelming power, her mental defences get incredible lower do to her unstable mental state, and such even mental spells from low level servants (Shikibu in the video is considered a low level servant) can affect her, so while in combat Raikou would be able to crush Dread if he end using a mental spell is likely that he would win.

 

[Mageman460]

The chains are magically connected and spawned from the armor. He can just conjure new chains if needed.

Where did you get that info? The description of the armor doesn't say that at all.

Yes. D&D characters have a comparable amount of layered resistances and the ability to overcome those resistances.

I'm not asking about all resistances, but specifically Power Nullification. Servants passively nullify anything supernatural directed at them so long as it doesn't have enough mystery. Certain spells in Fate can bypass this and still effect servants. Magic Resistance grants even more layers to the Power Nullification that can nullify even more potent spells and other supernatural phenomena.

All D&D spells and magical items can attack targets located on multiple different dimensional planes along with stuff like souls or things completely immune to mundane weaponary. Her invulnerability doesn't mean much here.

Alright I guess. My main concern if this applies to even Invulnerability that is unfortunately four dimensional.

Also, literally nothing about his armor or equipment is listed on his profile. Looks like only the spells he has are listed in the P&A section.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Where did you get that info?

Yeah you're right, I was just confused there. The chains are magically enhanced since they're part of his armor which can withstand 6-C+ attacks and magical effects, but he can't spawn them.

I'm not asking about all resistances, but specifically Power Nullification.

Dispel Magic is a common ability that anyone in D&D can resist. It applies to both magic objects and casters themselves. So the suppressing magical abilities can be overcome by the Dread Emperor who has something like 16 layers of compared to the baseline D&D person.

literally nothing about his armor or equipment is listed on his profile

Yeah, we honestly need to standardize the D&D profiles much more than they are. Its basically just physicals + certain spells rather than a full gear kit.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Question how many layers is servant resistance?

 

[Peppersalt43]

Bump, lets continue the discussion

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Bump, lets continue the discussion

In my case I already answered how probably Raikou would react in such bizarre situation against someone like Dread Emperor:

The last days I have been thinking in the match and how Raikou would react in such extreme situation, and then I finally remembered something important, her Lone Warrior Mode.

This state was introduced in her second interlude, and was trigered by she remembering her historical childs, and by doing so remembering her trauma that affect her motherly persona. Lone Warrior Mode is a state in which Raikou enter when she is under too much stress, a state in which she don't hold back with anything, just empty her mind from all troublesome problems and focus entirely in fighting and slaying her enemies (in the video she was even attacking seriously Kintoki who she see as her child and who she would never actually hurt). In exchange however of not holding anything back and crush things with an overwhelming power, her mental defences get incredible lower do to her unstable mental state, and such even mental spells from low level servants (Shikibu in the video is considered a low level servant) can affect her, so while in combat Raikou would be able to crush Dread if he end using a mental spell is likely that he would win.

The layers and such a thing in the case of fate are more complicated so will let others (probably more knowledgeables) debate that part since I can be wrong with them, like initially in the last thread.

 

[Peppersalt43]

OK then, I'll wait

 

[Peppersalt43]

Anyway, bump

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Did you post this in the nasuverse general discussion thread? I’m sure they can help you out

 

[Peppersalt43]

Well that didn't work

 

[Peppersalt43]

Back to bumping...

 

[Peppersalt43]

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